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Old 07-18-2020, 06:59 PM   #1
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Water flows out when I haven't opened any wastewater valves!

Hello,
I've got a problem and am hoping to find some advice! I've got a brand new Winnebago Sunstar 29V. Today I thought I'd empty the wastewater tanks, which I've never done before. So, I had all the hoses and I was ready to get started. But the second I took the black dust cap off the sewage drain outlet, wastewater flowed out all over the Water Service Center, the ground, and my feet! Mind you, I DID NOT open the Black Waste Tank Drain Valve or the Gray Waste Tank Drain Valve. I have NEVER touched those levers. So why the heck is wastewater flowing out just because I've taken off the dust cap? All input would be appreciated!
JCH
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Old 07-18-2020, 08:19 PM   #2
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A couple things can do this and that leaves the cure up in the air for a bit.
This is a link to one brand of valve that is pretty much like all of these to look at:
https://www.amazon.com/Valterra-Wast...a-867312307670
What can happen and I find it really irritating on new Rv is that there is something left in the tank, like construction straps, maybe? What I have found was the yellow plastic strap like PVC pipe comes bundled with!
But there is a chance that "something" was left in the tank as a handy place to get rid of the scraps and it got washed down to hang up in that groove you can see in the valve where the blade should slide in to seal the drain. With something in the groove, the blade doesn't close fully and you get water leaking past to set a trap when you take the cover off! Could be wood, cigarette butt, strap or most anything that stuck in the groove. Worst case might be that the valve gets pushed hard enough against something solid to make a notch in the blade so that the valve has to be replaced.
Better case is you might try filling the tank with just water and then when you suddenly open the valve, it washes something out of the groove.
A third option might be to reach in and see if you can feel something to pull out of the groove? Smaller yuck but still not good!
Or the trek back to the dealer to complain and maybe wait weeks for the RV to come home?
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Old 07-18-2020, 09:09 PM   #3
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Morich, thanks for your reply! Since the water that was spewed forth was mostly clear, I suspect the problem is with the Gray Water Tank and not the Black Water Tank. Unfortunately, I don't think I'm going to be able to reach with my hand through the Wastewater Outlet all the way to where the Gray Water Tank Valve is - it's just too far (see picture). But I might take your suggestion and try to fill the Gray Water Tank and then dump it again to see if I can dislodge whatever is holding the Gray Water Tank Valve open.


I really hate having to do all this - the RV is brand new! Don't they check these things before they leave the factory? Shouldn't the dealer? This RV has already had a few problems and been back for a week's worth of service. And what worker would be so dumb as to dump factory junk into the holding tanks of a new RV on the line? But, I digress... Thanks again for the info!
JCH
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Old 07-19-2020, 04:22 AM   #4
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I would fill the grey tank, although if its leaking that may take some time. While you are filling the grey tank work the dump valve back and forth slowly. This may dislodge what is causing the problem. If you can get to the valve assembly you should be able to take it apart with out much problem. They are pretty much a straight forward piece of equipment.

When the factory drills holes into the tank for the plumbing some of the pieces fall into the tank to be washed out with use. As for anybody checking that kind of stuff, most likely not.

This is something I would figure out myself instead of taking to a dealer. To me its just not worth the hassle.
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Old 07-19-2020, 06:49 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCH200 View Post
I really hate having to do all this - the RV is brand new! Don't they check these things before they leave the factory? Shouldn't the dealer? This RV has already had a few problems and been back for a week's worth of service. And what worker would be so dumb as to dump factory junk into the holding tanks of a new RV on the line?
Ah, the common sounds of RV ownership. Makes you want to go camping, doesn’t it?

Unfortunately, the way the RV industry works YOU are the quality control employee.
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Old 07-19-2020, 07:56 AM   #6
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Oh my! You do have a tough one to reach, for sure.
Now that I mentioned it to my wife, she reminded me it was the new Thor that had the debris left in the tank. Part of the reason for swapping to a used Winnebago was the number of things we found as we got around to looking in cabinets and pulling out drawers to look! On that Rv we used a macerator pump to pump uphill to a drain and the yellow strap fouled the pump!
So an alternate to think about? Wonder what a person would get if they used one of the extra large diameter brushes with long flexible handles like designed for cleaning drier vents, etc. to feed up into the drain and possibly dislodge something?
This is a cheap one but I don't see the brush diameter, which might be important:
https://www.walmart.com/ip/SKY-Dryer...MaAl9JEALw_wcB
This is more expensive but does state 4 inch diameter:
https://www.amazon.com/Holikme-Clean.../dp/B07SQYX2FH
Messy, messy thought but perhaps filling the tank put the brush to work while water is coming out, to get the max effect?
I'm good at figuring out yuck for you to do, right?
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Old 07-27-2020, 01:18 PM   #7
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Unfortunately, the way the RV industry works YOU are the quality control employee.

It shouldn't be that way, but I'm discovering that you're right!
JC
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Old 07-27-2020, 01:23 PM   #8
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Hey, Richard,
Thanks for the reply! Actually, I ended-up taking my RV back to my dealer, who found the black water tank valve to be completely defective, and they replaced it free of charge. Kinda disappointing that, after shelling-out all that money for a new RV, I had to make another 140-mile round trip up there and wait 4 hours for them to do it. And that was my second warranty repair job by them in less than a month! I've only had the RV for 5 weeks! Anyway, thanks for the suggestion, and happy travels!
JC
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Old 07-27-2020, 04:51 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by JCH200 View Post
Don't they check these things before they leave the factory? Shouldn't the dealer? This RV has already had a few problems and been back for a week's worth of service. And what worker would be so dumb as to dump factory junk into the holding tanks of a new RV on the line? But, I digress... Thanks again for the info!
JCH
No the manufacturer does not check and neither does the dealer! They slap these things together and push them out the door. Unfortunately that is part of buying a new rig, it takes time to get all the bugs worked out. I have purchased two new rigs and one used rig. I will never purchase a new rig again because I do not want to go to the dealer with a punch list, wait several weeks for the work to get done only to find out the list was not completed. At least with a used rig if something goes wrong I may be able to fix it myself or have an RV tech fix it but with upgraded parts. Just my humble opinion.
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Old 07-29-2020, 05:02 PM   #10
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About 30 to 40 minutes and you would have fixed this yourself. If you're not too handy you can become that. Being on the forums is part of that. Most problems are fixed by people who can just screw 2 things together. We're here to help too.
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Old 07-29-2020, 05:06 PM   #11
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Hey, Richard,
Thanks for the reply! Actually, I ended-up taking my RV back to my dealer, who found the black water tank valve to be completely defective, and they replaced it free of charge. Kinda disappointing that, after shelling-out all that money for a new RV, I had to make another 140-mile round trip up there and wait 4 hours for them to do it. And that was my second warranty repair job by them in less than a month! I've only had the RV for 5 weeks! Anyway, thanks for the suggestion, and happy travels!
JC
JC, as others have stated here, this is standard. Some brands are better than others, but all will have problems. After your warranty runs out, you either have to figure it out yourself (this forum is fantastic at saving me money!) and fix it or pay big bucks to have someone else do it. It's not a question of if, but when. And when it happens, often times I am left scratching my head asking why Winnebago used this type of material or why did they put it here in the most difficult place to get to? We just experienced a blowout on our right rear inner tire and it blew the PLASTIC wheel well up which then damaged some relays under our fridge (located above and forward of the wheels) that needed to be replaced. Why doesn't all motorhome wheel wells have reinforced steel instead of plastic...blowouts happen! Fortunately Michelin is covering my damages claim but that, too, took a lot of leg work.

Point is, enjoy the time you have with your rig and know there are going to be down times. Concentrate on the good times...life's too short to stress about the maintenance and repairs that come along with owning a home that you drive down the road! Welcome to the forums!

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Old 07-29-2020, 05:17 PM   #12
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Morich, thanks for your reply! Since the water that was spewed forth was mostly clear, I suspect the problem is with the Gray Water Tank and not the Black Water Tank. Unfortunately, I don't think I'm going to be able to reach with my hand through the Wastewater Outlet all the way to where the Gray Water Tank Valve is - it's just too far (see picture). But I might take your suggestion and try to fill the Gray Water Tank and then dump it again to see if I can dislodge whatever is holding the Gray Water Tank Valve open.


I really hate having to do all this - the RV is brand new! Don't they check these things before they leave the factory? Shouldn't the dealer? This RV has already had a few problems and been back for a week's worth of service. And what worker would be so dumb as to dump factory junk into the holding tanks of a new RV on the line? But, I digress... Thanks again for the info!
JCH
It is an example of the worst human factors engineering that Winnebago still puts the sewage discharge outlet adjacent to the clean water inlet.
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Old 07-29-2020, 07:22 PM   #13
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Thru the years I have had small amounts of liquids leak into the discharge pipe behind the cap. There are a couple of solutions. I carry a quart plastic container (ice cream, cool whip etc) and place that on the ground under the cap, so that any material would drip into the container, rather than on the street surface or RV dump apron. Another way is to have one of the drain caps which has a hose barb cap at the bottom, and take that off before the main cap--catch any material which comes out in the "big sewer" hose...which is already hooked up to the dump station.
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Old 07-29-2020, 07:29 PM   #14
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Thataway4, I like your recommendations.
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Old 07-29-2020, 07:46 PM   #15
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Thataway4, I like your recommendations.
I’m still trying to picture that device...
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Old 07-29-2020, 08:04 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCH200 View Post
Morich, thanks for your reply! Since the water that was spewed forth was mostly clear, I suspect the problem is with the Gray Water Tank and not the Black Water Tank. Unfortunately, I don't think I'm going to be able to reach with my hand through the Wastewater Outlet all the way to where the Gray Water Tank Valve is - it's just too far (see picture). But I might take your suggestion and try to fill the Gray Water Tank and then dump it again to see if I can dislodge whatever is holding the Gray Water Tank Valve open.


I really hate having to do all this - the RV is brand new! Don't they check these things before they leave the factory? Shouldn't the dealer? This RV has already had a few problems and been back for a week's worth of service. And what worker would be so dumb as to dump factory junk into the holding tanks of a new RV on the line? But, I digress... Thanks again for the info!
JCH


This might be another good case for getting a borescope that attaches to your smartphone. I got one from Amazon about a year ago - a 4 footer for a bit under $20. It plugs into the smartphone and uses its camera system.
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Old 07-29-2020, 08:10 PM   #17
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It shouldn't be that way, but I'm discovering that you're right!
JC
Its sad to say, but you're not the Lone Ranger!
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Old 07-29-2020, 11:14 PM   #18
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Cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by creativepart View Post
Ah, the common sounds of RV ownership. Makes you want to go camping, doesn’t it?

Unfortunately, the way the RV industry works YOU are the quality control employee.

Sorry to say but you are a victim as are all of US to the quality of production, quality of design and quality of assembly and quality control of a US corporation bigly heck hugely. Competition from foreign companies has been kept at bay via rules and regs so that we can be capitalized upon hugely. The RVIA is a banal organization that serves the industry only and not the owners of the sloppy bucket of bolts some times missing a few pieces RV they create with inferior design, inferior build and inferior content. But hey we are willing to pay through our noses and self righteously with pride and prejudiced at being able to afford so it is what it is. Many are turning to self building of rigs and as time ticks away we all shall get custom coaches assembled from parts of our choosing and at the price point/design/engineering of our choosing! One of the best RVs I have seen was built on modified brand-new medium duty commercial truck/bus frame. It was posh, well insulated for weather, quiet, stable and high quality components. The fellow spend less that a "mass assembled" unit OTD price which are a bit lower than the MSRP in this strange market segment.


Your remedy is to keep making the payments on your rig, insurance costs etc and get in the long line for the Rig to be made usable! Think of it as a rite of initiation! Oh yes get ready well it is a moving house and so it needs you to put in work .... as well.
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Old 07-30-2020, 10:30 AM   #19
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We have a Vista 29VE and our waste valves do the same thing, a little bit of waste water comes out when the cap is taken off. I’ve had this looked at and the waste valves are sealing right. The explanation was that each valve is set back from the end by about two feet of pipe and the water is from what’s left in the pipe because the RV is not tipped down to the sewer? I thought that explanation was bs but I didn’t want to leave my RV the two weeks for them to sort it out. My solution is to put the sewer hose under the sewer opening to catch the dribble of water. Someone else suggested to put a valve at the end of the sewer pipe so you don’t have the problem when you take off the cap. The valves I’ve seen would put the sewer hose at too severe of a bend to go through the opening in the floor but it didn’t look that hard as to what valves are available, there might be one that doesn’t extend that far. For now I just catch the dribble with the hose.
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Old 07-30-2020, 10:48 AM   #20
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You are so right ! And Winnebago is the WORST for Quality control !


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