Beware of Winnebago

[Rlacroix8]

Dear Sir/Madam,

My wife and I own a Winnie Drop, model WD1780, VIN 54CTW1H13J303****, purchased in March of 2018 from Lazydays in Florida. During the one year warranty period the dealer had to attend to seven issues: a rear window leak, the awning that was loose on one side, the side skirt of the slide-out that was loose (and still is), the holding tank indicators that did apparently not function properly (they still don't), ceiling strips that were loose (they are again), the white strip on the slide-out that touches its rubber gasket, and all three external cargo doors that were warped and leaked.

After expiration of the warranty period we had to attend to the following issues:

1.A malfunctioning air conditioner, at a cost of $ 150.

2.Twice on a non operating heater, first at a cost of $ 120, later at a cost of $164, for a total of $ 284.

3.A fridge that freezes all contents (and still does), diagnosed but not repaired at a cost to us of $ 152.90.

4.An external support bracket of the sewage pipe, at a cost of $ 220.

(also cleaned out the connection between the toilet and the black water tank)

5.A cracked braking drum, requiring two new drums with bearings, at a total cost of $ 486.09 (potentially a very serious hazard)

If this was a car in Massachusetts it would probably fall under the lemon law. I am inclined to post a factual review on the popular social media sites, but will wait 2 weeks for your reply.

Regards

Ellen and Richard Lacroix

P.S. This review was submitted to Winnebago more than two weeks ago; we received no reaction.

[Marine359]

Dear Ellen and Richard,
Please permit me to console you on the misfortune you have experienced with your travel trailer. You paid good money for your RV, and you have a right to expect the product you purchased would perform as you expected it to.

I do not work in the industry nor do I represent any interests. However, I did sell very expensive motor homes for a few years, and I have owned 4 rvs and two boats. The issues you have had with your Drop are primarily component failures. It is important to distinguish between component failure and RV manufacturer build quality. Because all RV manufacturers buy their components from the same manufacturers, you simply cannot associate how good an RV manufacturer is based on component failure issues. I can attest that a $400,000 motor home has no greater or fewer frequency of component failure than a $15,000 travel trailer.

You have to judge RV manufacturers (which are really just assemblers) on their build quality. That is the things that the RV company actually builds, and how well they assemble their products. In my experience, on the whole, Winnebago as a brand that ranks in the top 10% of RV manufacturers with respect to build quality. That being said, there will always be a few build quality defects with any RV, or boat. I’ve had some with my new Micro Mini, but fortunately, I was able to fix them all myself, saving me the time and aggravation of filing warranty claims. But, I bought a Micro Mini because I knew from experience that I would have fewer problems with a Winnie than practically any other brand, except perhaps Lance and Airstream.

After reading your post several times, IMHO, all but a couple of your issues were not due to poor build quality by Winnebago, nor could most of them have been foreseen by Winnebago. RV manufacturers do not test every component separately at time of assembly. Testing of functionality of components falls on the dealer. Your dealer should have inspected and tested the critical components of your RV before you drove off the lot.

And, no the RV industry cannot be held to the same standard as the auto industry. I wish that were true, but it never has and never will be the case. Just to make sure you’re aware, component manufacturers have their own warranties that may not be the same as the manufacturer of the coach. Take a look at your owners packet provided to you by Winnebago. You will see owners pamphlets for almost every component. In those documents you will find warranty info. Your dealer should be able to help you navigate your warranty rights and claims with component manufacturers.

So, in the end, you can be mad at Winnebago, or you can be mad at the co pone t manufacturers, but you’d probably be more mad if you had bought a lesser brand than Winnebago.

Good luck on your RV adventures.

[Rlacroix8]

Dear Jim,

Thanks for your thoughtful reply. However, cars are also put together with components from various manufacturers. On those cars you get a manufacturer backed warranty, covering all components in it. It is time the RV industry does something similar and gives us a product with a real warranty. It is likely that the Winnebagos of this world would get their component manufacturers to produce a better product.

Best Regards

Richard Lacroix

[Cooperhawk]

What you are experiencing is normal. A new MH has many problems to iron out. Get it done! Each vendor should be responsible for their product. Calling Winnebago is fruitless. Call that vendor of that appliance. That's responsible party.
Winnebago does not take each unit out for a test weekend. That's your job.
Blaming Winnebago for their failures is beating a dead horse.

[creativepart]

So sorry you had a number of issues. Keep in mind that comparing an RV to an automobile might seem appropriate because they both have wheels and axels but it is misguided.

It’s a shame if you were misled about what to expect. But your experience is, unfortunately, the norm.

Should it be? Of course not. But it is common with all makes and models from the least expensive to the multimillion dollar coaches.

[tinglett]

Whenever I think of the automotive analogy I am reminded of the amazing progress that industry has made over the past few decades (remember the 70's?). Any new car is an absolute feat of engineering. And then I look at my RV's build and get a bit depressed. Perhaps someday RV's might reach that pinnacle.

I've since come to the conclusion that a better analogy for RV's is a house. You can buy a house used or have it built new. In both cases you are stuck with ensuring everything is good in the final walk-through, and perhaps (in the case of a new house) you'll be able to lean a bit on the builder for a while to handle "manufacturing" defects, including broken appliances. But after that, it's you and your house and your appliances, plumbing, electrical, etc. And you get to deal with the warranties. Perhaps housing will eventually reach the standard of automobiles, too, but I won't be holding my breath.

Not sure this will help, but maybe looking at the overall picture from a few angles will. Hopefully these things will get fixed and it'll all hold together well for you for many years to come. Not to say stuff won't happen, but hopefully the pluses will greatly outweigh the minuses as you get out and enjoy the new things you can do with your RV.

[Marine359]

Great analogy Todd.
Except an RV is a house on wheels that can experience a continuous 4-5 hour 6.5 Richter Scale “earthquake” every few days. Frankly, it’s surprising that in such a hostile environment, the components hold up as well as they do.

[RocknRoll]

Originally Posted by Marine359

So, in the end, you can be mad at Winnebago, or you can be mad at the co pone t manufacturers, but you’d probably be more mad if you had bought a lesser brand than Winnebago.

All excellent points brought up here. I think the OP has run up against a bit of bad luck and should probably trade it in for another. If he feels like it's a lemon, that feeling will never go away.

I bought a Winnebago based on their reputation and price point. The quality in the build itself is actually quite high compared to most brands. Think Toyota in the 70's

Another analogy is the marine industry. Boats hugely lagged in technology and quality until very recently, but they are still not without their troubles.

I believe that the boom in the RV industry will create a demand for even higher quality builds. Manufacturers will have to deliver or go under.

[creativepart]

I think we all would agree that the RV industry as a whole is the way it is because of long standing practices. It’s clear that manufacturers lack of standardization is a major problem. Finally, build speed, too widely diverse product lines and the boom and bust nature of the demand for RVs all play a roll in poor initial quality.

These companies are large now, but all were started a few decades ago by small family run outfits on less than a shoe string budget. To a large extent the industry is still run the exact same way as when these companies began.

However, right now they are able to sell everything they build and consolidation has made them more profitable than ever.

I do think the big three or four corporate entities that control the industry are trying to move toward a more standardized and organized factory build process. I assumes that WBGO’s new Class A factory will be a start down this path.

But it won’t come fast enough. For the OP and hundreds of thousands of first time buyers stoked by the pandemic these will be bitter lessons that are difficult to swallow.

[thebunker]

I am also disappointed in the frequency of visits to the shop for my 2020 2108DS. My average trip is about 1,500 miles and every single time it's back in the shop. I did buy the extended warranty which I NEVER do with an automobile. But as you can see on the forum apparently it's just the way it is. The industry needs to do better for sure.

[tinglett]

Originally Posted by thebunker

I am also disappointed in the frequency of visits to the shop for my 2020 2108DS. My average trip is about 1,500 miles and every single time it's back in the shop.

I don't want to fan the flames here, but I'm really curious what kind of stuff is breaking. I'm wondering if I'm just super lucky, or if I'm just fixing things without thinking as I kind-of like fixing things (ok, not THAT much!). I purchased my 2108DS used (only about 6mo old) and have never taken it into the shop yet. Hopefully I'm not overlooking stuff. On the other hand, all my adventures have been relatively short trips. I've never put on more than 500 miles in a single trip.

Those "Good-Ride" tires are certainly on my radar as potential trouble and will likely get proactively replaced this year. I've also upgraded other things (like the battery) that perhaps avoided a failure that I never got to see.

[Dynadave]

I too am sorry to hear of your problems and disappointments. In my 22 years of rving I have owned 14 rvs consisting of travel trailers, class Bs, class Cs, and class As, purchased both new and used. I had problems to varying degrees with all of them mostly caused by component failure rather than build quality. It rapidly became obvious to me that if I was going to enjoy this hobby I had better learn how my rv was constructed, how all the systems operated, how to trouble shoot problems and do my own repairs whenever possible. There is a real shortage of qualified repair technicians in the industry so we have to not only deal with breakdowns and malfunctions, getting it fixed in a timely manner and at a reasonable cost also is extremely difficult to do. In my opinion if you are not somewhat of a handyman or have a contact who is, there is a good chance you will not be a happy camper. There is no doubt the industry has a long way to go and many practices to change if they want to improve reliability and product quality. There is very little correlation or similarity in how a modern automobile is manufactured compared to an RV, unfortunately many people are unaware of this and and as a result are extremely disappointed, understandably so, when unexpected problems occur. In my experience Winnebago is one of the better manufacturers.

[sundog964]

There were some fit and finish issues with our 2020 Vista, and some very bad things "repaired" by the dealer before we purchased it "new".

I was able to fix most of them quite easily, with Amazon and more robust parts.

It isn't a Porsche, it is a home on a delivery truck frame. And for ~100K it really is a lot of value comparably.

[B RAD]

Any one who wants to own an RV should #1. Be a do it yourself type person.#2 have $$$$ for repairs. #3 have time to spend at the going, coming and waiting at the dealers. If not I would suggest renting an RV and leaving those problems to others. Probably much cheaper in the long run.

[Sun_Seeker]

Originally Posted by B RAD

Any one who wants to own an RV should #1. Be a do it yourself type person.#2 have $$$$ for repairs. #3 have time to spend at the going, coming and waiting at the dealers. If not I would suggest renting an RV and leaving those problems to others. Probably much cheaper in the long run.

"Totally agree!"

[Marine359]

I nominate B RAD for president of RVIA