travato 59G battery charging issues

[fred21]

Replaced batteries on my travato 59g and now can only charge them via solar panels. (I installed a victron monitor so it now shows me what is happening with the batteries)

generator won't charge battery
120 plug in power current won't charge battery
van running won't charge battery


I checked the power converter by using the battery disconnect switch and
then plugged in the coach and the lights and fridge would work (they are 12 volt
items) and would not work when I unplugged power..suggesting the power converter is working (can't get to it to test it)

everything will work with batteries just can't charge them (and not 100% charged)

any suggestions on what to look for given the common thread of only the solar charging? ( I have read schematics but can't seem to find a reason)

thanks for the help

[Morich]

Need to know year of RV as electrical parts change often.
Do you have a meter to check voltages?
It sounds like the monitor install may need to be checked but testing is needed to find where and what.

[fred21]

it is 2019 travato ...has pd9200 power converter in if that matters and I have checked batteries with volt meter and with the victor meter and both match. picture shows converter but is located at bottom of closet with like a 5inch by 12 inch opening which I can only get a camera in to take a picture (my fat head won't fit)

[Morich]

Okay, with the year, we can look at drawings of what to expect here:
https://www.winnebago.com/Files/File...ram/Wiring.htm

On the one for your RV, I find some info that may help.
There are tape markers placed near the battery cable ends to help ID them using this code:

Click this snip to get better view!


I also found a drawing of the batteries and cables there. I "think" we may be dealing with different names for the same thing, but not sure of that. I sometimes find they call the box which does the inverter or converter by different names.
I'm going out on a limb and guessing they are calling the converter which is what charges the battery but they are calling it "inverter" on this drawing??
Inverter USES battery to make AC!
They may be calling a converter/ inverter only inverter?? Guessing and prone to being wrong, so don't rust that if it looks different. I'm thinking you may have one box that does two things!
But a check of the inverter fuse might be good?


If you go directly on the cable from the converter to the coach battery, the voltage there should jump up immediately when you plug the RV in.

Also when you start the engine the chassis and coach should connect together, so you should see the coach voltage jump high as it connects to the engine alternator. Rev the engine and both coach and chassis battery should rise and fall?

Would it be that the inverter fuse is actually trips/blown and keeping the power from the converter (inverter?) from getting to the battery? That would keep you from digging down to the magic box!

[fred21]

I agree I think inverter actually means converter as I have a separate inverter that you have to turn on to change battery to ac (let's me watch tv on battery power)

so agree at battery I should see increase when plugged in....I will go down and check again but not see that with my victron monitor and don't see the batteries getting charged.

I checked all circuit breakers (converter has one) and checked all fuses in fuse box and all ok....can't check the fuses on the power inverter because I can't reach it. (has 2 30 amp fuses) but because the lights and frig work (only work on 12 volt power) I assumed the converter is working...

in my picture it looks like the converter only has one cable in it..(hard to tell) maybe the other one fell out and can't see it and that is what goes to the battery.

does anyone know if converter has two cables to it? the wiring diagrams are not all that great that I can follow.

how would I tell if that inverter fuse by the batteries is good? I will go down and see if I get voltage thru it.

[fred21]

so went back down to trailer and check at the fuse location...with no 120 power from my garage it reads 13.2 volts at that location (battery alone reads 13.2 volts) now if I plug the coach in I still see 13.2 volts at that location...and across the batteries I still only see 13.2 volts (and it doesn't matter what side of the fuse I am on....(so if fuse bad you wouldn't expect to see same current across it.

now doesn't seem like I am able to disconnect the coach battery from the 120 power as if I have it off it comes on when I plug it into power.


now when I get battery status on the panel I see 13.2 when just on battery and when I plug in 120 it states 14.4 volts but I see nothing different at the battery anywhere...so that 14.4 volts which I see on the panel is not getting to the battery from what I can tell.

[Morich]

Sounds right but I might mention something that can confuse us.
When we look at a battery that is being charged we would expect higher than 12.8 as the charger is putting out higher so that power moves to the battery.
Depending how low the battery, the charger will often put out higher like around 14 until the battery begins to reach full and then a good charger/converter will back the voltage down in three stages, Bulk for big charge quicker, standard and then float. The idea being to adjust how fast we are charging to keep from overheating or boiling the battery.

What can mess us up is we will se that higher charge for a while after we take the charger off. It takes time for that charge to move all through all the battery and get stable to show the actual charge of the battery! Right at the post we may see 13+ if we have been charging but the normal lead acid battery will only hold near 12.8, so if we see higher, we know it has been getting some form of charge form converter or engine alternator? Just the way the chemicals work, so a battery reading 13. 2, just says it has been getting charged from somewhere recently. come back in a few hours and it will never show more than 12.8!

So the tricky part to watch is this. If you run the engine for a while and the battery is getting a charge from the alternator, shut off and see 13.2 and then you connect the cord and it shows 13.2 because the battery doesn't need much voltage now, you may not spot that the converter is actually charging, just not too fast??
If you turn off the engine and unplug, the battery will likely go down to 12.8 range. THEN if you plug in, you might see it jump up some if the converter is working!
We normally "float"/ maintain the batteries a little higher than 12.8 but not up like 14!

Just a word of warning to not let this sneaky part confuse you into tearing a cabinet apart to get to the converter.
Maybe it is working or maybe not??

Meanwhile, I did some looking on the parts drawings here:
https://catalog3d.winnebagoind.com/menu/Parts.htm
Drilled down to 110AC parts here:
https://catalog3d.winnebagoind.com/2019/321948.htm
Click these snbips to get a better view!
I find an inverter here that looks like what you may see?


Inverter and inverter switch?
If we look closer, it shows the inverter is plugged into what looks like a 110AC box??


And if we look at the back side, it "may" show a pair of clamps but no wires?


NEW INFO?
I also just found the converter as a separate item!
Near the same spot as inverter I think but different?
Maybe even in outside compartment?


Looks to be toward outside behind a big speaker? Maybe find it easier than looking at drawings?



So new idea is that this converter is what should be charging batteries, not the inverter! Neither are shown on electrical drawings where I can spot them. And to confuse things, the inverter is on the 110AC parts and the converter is on the 12Volt dc parts.

But if we look far enough at the 110AC drawings, I find the converter AC input shown but lacking info on the output to the batteries, etc.
This drawing does show from AC cord or genset to breakers and to converter as a path to check?

https://www.winnebago.com/Files/File.../000042798.pdf

Page 1 shows converter location, page 3 inverter that I don't think you need but page 4 has the path to converter and that seems to be what you need right now?

[fred21]

so have been tracking wires down thru the system...apparently the solenoid is not working and going thru the other wiring and moving stuff around the house current is now charging the battery. I will spend the rest of the day looking at the wiring looking for a short or something loose and post back the results for other people that read the thread.

what is really saving me is the viltron shunt monitor which is allowing me to see what is really happening...would suggest anyone redoing their batteries to put one of these in....it may save tons of time and really understand what is happening with the batteries. (my guess is me not understanding is what caused my batteries to fail early)

[Morich]

Small point to consider is how the inverter will be using battery power all the time if not turned off. You may not be in the Rv and nothing using the ac that the inverter is making but there is still power from the batteries being used just in the inverter parts alone.

[fred21]

Mine has a switch to turn inverter off...so it doesn't drain battery when not using it and it also has a cut off switch that isolates the battery when not using it...

[Morich]

If the inverter is not running the battery down being left on, I think the main thing to look at is the converter if you can spot it as it it what should be charging the coach batteries. When I could not spot any converter when first looking, I thought maybe they had used a different name but now that I see a stand alone converter as well as an inverter, the converter is the one to charge batteries and make 12Vdc for lights and such inside.
They come in different forms and some of them plug into 110AC outlet like we see all over or have breakers or maybe even GFCI on the outlet where the converter plugs.

The drawing for your RV shows it on a 11AC drawing for how it gets power to the converter. But nothing shown for the 12Volt coming out and how it gets to the batteries!!?


But I do find more on location on a different type drawing!


And on the bottom? maybe there are two connections shown marked J and M.

Looking on the chart, those two circuits show this:


Both seems to show coach battery charge, which confuses me why two?
But it looks like J and M are located somewhere on that converter, maybe front or bottom??


So if that 15 amp breaker is passing power to the converter, it looks like the 12Volt should then come out on J or M or both???/ going to charge the coach batteries.

Looks like if you can get to the converter, you need to check it is getting 110AC in and sending 12VDc out on J and M< but they don't show us how it gets from there to the batteries. We just know it has to get there some way!

When it's time and you get to it, that would be where I might go next to look!

[fred21]

order a new solenoid and waiting for it to come in....I think that is part of the problem...I also went and check other connections at the same location and moved wires around to check various things (of course on my year the black box is right by the generator so I can't get to it easily....) and now stuff is working so maybe a loose wire in the black box (will tighten them)...

one thing I really learned was you need a battery monitor system on these batteries and can't rely on what they have on the trailer to really tell you what is happening to the batteries. I like the victron smart shunt to show me what is really happening real time.

once i get new part will install and then give everyone an update for future folks with the same problem.

[fred21]

Trailer - Travato 2019 with AGM batteries (which I switch to lithium as it supposedly supports them (an option on the screen inside the trailer so I switch from AGM to lithium) maybe not the ideal way to charge the batteries but time will tell.

I wanted to update everyone that reads this thread on the outcome and hopefully that may or may not help you trouble shoot.

so solenoid was bad and replace with same brand but new one. At the same time I check the connections in the black box where the solenoid and battery cut off switch is located (in my trailer 59G in the rear by the generator which makes it hard to get to and see) and found some loose ones.


so first thing you need to know is how and when it charges (disconnect state means the switch in the trailer for the battery disconnect is on or off)

condition/disconnect state/charge
solar/on or off/ will charge
driving/off or on/ will charge
Plugged in to shore power/off/will not charge
(now when you plug into shore power the switch appears to be on but when you disconnect the trailer power will go off so to operate correctly turn on the batteries before you plug into power then it will go to batteries when you disconnect - this seems very strange and maybe I should play around with it more.)
plugged into shore power /on/ will charge
(generator acts just like shore power)

next when I installed the batteries I install a viltron smart shunt 500A monitor via bluetooth to my phone - that is how I am getting the readings I show below

nothing on and trailer switch off
reads 13.15 v and 0 amps
van running but trailer switch off
14.02 volts 39.48 A
van running but trailer switch on
14.06 37.87 A
van turned off back to 13.41. and 0 amps

plug in but didn't turn switch on (but it came on) two lights on
13.36v 0 amps (so nothing being drawn from battery
disconnected plug lights turned off
13.36v 0 amps

now turned trailer switch on (two lights on)
13.28 v -.53 amps and -7 w
plugged power in (two lights on)
13.41v 5.85a 78w
two lights off
13.41 5.28a 71 w
unplugged power (nothing on)
13.34vv -.24a -3w

turned generator on
13.40 v 6.21 a 82w
3 lights on
13.44 5.17a 69w


final note if nothing plugged in and battery switch off - on solenoid car side reads 12.6 volts (my car battery voltage) and 13.34 volts on other side (house batteries) and small screw is 0 volts (which is how it should be)

I hope this info. helps some other folks trouble shoot there system. I didn't test solar as trailer was in my barn so no sun.

I plan to go on a trip soon so maybe will have more info. in the future.