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Old 05-23-2018, 11:06 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by Winterbagoal View Post
Sorry, errant semantics. It has nothing to do with the fresh water tank. It's a low point clean out for the gray tank with one of those square headed threaded plugs in it - for emergency dumping. I called it a low point drain, because you can remove the plug and let the gray water drain out of the gray tank onto whatever you happen to be parked above. Or, you can install a DIY valve and male 3/4" garden hose threaded connection that you attach a garden hose to, to direct the gray water to a nearby dump station hole or other appropriate sewer location. If the gray tank waste pump fails.

I called it a low profile. It used to be called the IQ model.
With the late model Navions, the cab over bunk is actually the option. If you don't want or need the extra bed (we figured it would be like a garage, collecting junk) don't get it as an option, and what you'll get is a Navion without the protruding forehead, with a large skylight forward facing window (with manual privacy blind) which follows the slope of the windshield up to the roof, instead of the bunk bed. We like the streamlined look, and it's actually functional in that respect. Less wind resistance than with the cab over, and Winnebago engineering told me it cuts about 120 lbs of GVW weight to skip the cab over bunk.

I think the OCCC was around 1249 lbs. - we added the stabilizers (I wish we hadn't now) which adds weight and I doubt they'll see much use, but we thought they might help if we decided to park it somewhere for more than a day or two. In hindsight, I should have skipped them and got after market hydraulic leveling jacks instead.

Yes, there are free government highway scales a few miles away. I know exactly (within ~10kg.) what we weight loaded. I weigh our Jeep there, as well.

If you're serious about getting a View/Navion, download a brochure from the Winnebago website. The section at near the end of it has all the standard equipment listed along with the optional stuff. It's where we started.

One more thing. I can't complain about the fuel economy with the MB V6 3.0L turbo diesel, after downsizing from a 2016 Sunstar 26HE, with the V10 and the 6 speed transmission. The Ford was noisy, the doghouse was a pita to negotiate, and it was a gas guzzler, at any speed and under any road and weather conditions. If I'm "gentle" with the throttle on the Navion, at 62-65mph, I'm getting just over 15 mpg, drop down to 55mph and it jumps to around 16+mpg, and at suburban roadway speeds, under 50mph, 17 and up mpg. If fuel economy might affect your choice of drive train. Old Crows made all the points about the maintenance, and he knows that aspect of it. I'm still waiting for the Navion to tell me what it needs or when it's time to change the oil. So far I've only added wiper washer fluid, diesel fuel, and DEF, and that was inexpensive truck stop bulk stuff. Power-wise, it has plenty when we're loaded and almost too much when we're not. It climbs hills effortlessly, and that was a surprise. I wasn't sure it was enough engine when we bought it, but it is.

Thanks for the info. We have driven the Navion, kicked the tires and brought brochures home. I just like getting the low-down from actual owners.

We got a trade-in "offer" from the dealer yesterday which pretty much curbed our enthusiasm for a new RV. Not in the mood to be screwed over by that outfit, so buh-bye.
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Old 05-24-2018, 09:33 AM   #62
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I agree with you on a trade with a dealer, oppps. stealer. I have used RVT or RVtrader in the past. Both are easy to use.
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Old 05-24-2018, 11:38 AM   #63
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I agree with you on a trade with a dealer, oppps. stealer. I have used RVT or RVtrader in the past. Both are easy to use.

Thanks. We will likely go the consignment route since we live fairly close to PPL in the Houston area. We are willing to take a hit on fees since they will deal with tire kickers, paperwork, etc. We're still thinking it over, though.
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Old 05-24-2018, 12:06 PM   #64
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Thanks for the info. We have driven the Navion, kicked the tires and brought brochures home. I just like getting the low-down from actual owners.
I hear ya'. It's really a great way to get a feel for the pros and cons of a particular make/model. Short of renting or a lengthy test drive on all kinds of terrain. Nothing exposes the faults like actual use.

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Originally Posted by SarahW View Post
We got a trade-in "offer" from the dealer yesterday which pretty much curbed our enthusiasm for a new RV. Not in the mood to be screwed over by that outfit, so buh-bye.
We took the standard hit on our Sunstar trade in last Fall. It was just less than a year old, and under 5,000 miles on the ticker, and we could have done better to sell it on Kijiji or eBay or something like that. However, at this stage of the game in our lives, we decided it just wasn't worth the time and effort to sell it privately, and wait for the right buyer. We did that earlier last year with our Roadtrek. That decision worked out well, and we got a great number for it, but the hassle of the actual negotiations, sorting through the tire kickers, rejecting the low ball offers, and hearing the follow up "critiques", and then the actual transfer of ownership was a pita.

Good luck with it. If you decide to go with a Navion or similar, there's a lot of great support on several forums, and a lot of negativity as well, but you've seen that in action. In this thread we've had visits from those on the "dark side".
If you decided to stand pat, or go with a smaller gasser, at least you'd mostly know the pros and cons of that choice, having driven a big gasser already.
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Old 05-24-2018, 12:41 PM   #65
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I hear ya'. It's really a great way to get a feel for the pros and cons of a particular make/model. Short of renting or a lengthy test drive on all kinds of terrain. Nothing exposes the faults like actual use.

We took the standard hit on our Sunstar trade in last Fall. It was just less than a year old, and under 5,000 miles on the ticker, and we could have done better to sell it on Kijiji or eBay or something like that. However, at this stage of the game in our lives, we decided it just wasn't worth the time and effort to sell it privately, and wait for the right buyer. We did that earlier last year with our Roadtrek. That decision worked out well, and we got a great number for it, but the hassle of the actual negotiations, sorting through the tire kickers, rejecting the low ball offers, and hearing the follow up "critiques", and then the actual transfer of ownership was a pita.

Good luck with it. If you decide to go with a Navion or similar, there's a lot of great support on several forums, and a lot of negativity as well, but you've seen that in action. In this thread we've had visits from those on the "dark side".
If you decided to stand pat, or go with a smaller gasser, at least you'd mostly know the pros and cons of that choice, having driven a big gasser already.

I totally agree that it is worth quite a bit to me to not have to deal with tire kickers and negotiations. Just dealing on a new one makes me grind my teeth, but the low-ball insulting trade-in offer made me jump to my feet and exit the dealership. Of course the salesman left a message on our home phone before we returned there, but I have no intention of returning that call. (Insult me and the deal is OFF, buddy.)

Some days, after reading my favorite RV forums and other people's experiences (nightmares ) I have to wonder why people spend so much money to have such frustration. It takes a special breed of person to be an RVer...and lots of cash.

We've been extremely lucky with our Bounder; so I'm thinking we will be best served to just stick with the "devil we know." Or maybe just sell it and move on.
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Old 05-24-2018, 01:17 PM   #66
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I totally agree that it is worth quite a bit to me to not have to deal with tire kickers and negotiations. Just dealing on a new one makes me grind my teeth, but the low-ball insulting trade-in offer made me jump to my feet and exit the dealership. Of course the salesman left a message on our home phone before we returned there, but I have no intention of returning that call. (Insult me and the deal is OFF, buddy.)

Some days, after reading my favorite RV forums and other people's experiences (nightmares ) I have to wonder why people spend so much money to have such frustration. It takes a special breed of person to be an RVer...and lots of cash.

We've been extremely lucky with our Bounder; so I'm thinking we will be best served to just stick with the "devil we know." Or maybe just sell it and move on.
We knew fairly soon after we bought it in 2008, that the Roadtrek was too small for "destination" camping, and started to consider alternatives at around the same time. We wound up hanging on to it for another 9 years, because of the benefits of it being nimble, and good on fuel. We put up with the lack of a dry bath and the close quarters, to let us finish our "touring" travels. It was the "devil we knew". We recently decided that much of our touring is done, and upsized to a class A gasser at the end of 2016, thinking that it would be our forever destination traveling home. We found out after one full trip that we were wrong.
The Navion (we actually considered one back in 2010, but couldn't pull the trigger) is our forever motorhome for now, because things do change, and someone somewhere said "never say never". But overall, I think we're enjoying it much more than the Sunstar, for previously stated reasons, and it has some of the touring capability of the Roadtrek. With a dry bath.
Best of both worlds? The apprehension over future repairs and maintenance costs is real, but manageable, so far. We rationalize that the increased fuel economy advantage over the gassers as gas/diesel fuel prices get closer to equal, will help cover that expense easily over time. We ignored fuel economy on the Sunstar because gas wasn't too bad in 2016, but bought our Roadtrek in 2008 when gas up here was approaching $1.45/Liter. That was us just being a little bit "schizo", depending on the economy of the day, and the price of a gallon of fuel.
I guess it comes down to what works for you?
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Old 05-24-2018, 06:08 PM   #67
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We knew fairly soon after we bought it in 2008, that the Roadtrek was too small for "destination" camping, and started to consider alternatives at around the same time. We wound up hanging on to it for another 9 years, because of the benefits of it being nimble, and good on fuel. We put up with the lack of a dry bath and the close quarters, to let us finish our "touring" travels. It was the "devil we knew". We recently decided that much of our touring is done, and upsized to a class A gasser at the end of 2016, thinking that it would be our forever destination traveling home. We found out after one full trip that we were wrong.
The Navion (we actually considered one back in 2010, but couldn't pull the trigger) is our forever motorhome for now, because things do change, and someone somewhere said "never say never". But overall, I think we're enjoying it much more than the Sunstar, for previously stated reasons, and it has some of the touring capability of the Roadtrek. With a dry bath.
Best of both worlds? The apprehension over future repairs and maintenance costs is real, but manageable, so far. We rationalize that the increased fuel economy advantage over the gassers as gas/diesel fuel prices get closer to equal, will help cover that expense easily over time. We ignored fuel economy on the Sunstar because gas wasn't too bad in 2016, but bought our Roadtrek in 2008 when gas up here was approaching $1.45/Liter. That was us just being a little bit "schizo", depending on the economy of the day, and the price of a gallon of fuel.
I guess it comes down to what works for you?

Yeah, a level-headed person will realize that an RV is never an "investment." (But no one ever accused me of being level-headed!) I am not going to be blinded by "shiny" and get screwed over on a bad deal, though.

Did you have to take a bath on the Sunstar? I know that we will take a hit on the Bounder, but I'm not willing to GIVE it away.

We are putting our RV shopping on hold for a while and try to decide what to do going forward. Thanks again for the input.
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Old 05-24-2018, 07:27 PM   #68
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We actually traded in our DP for the View. I know I could have sold it myself and cleared $10k more in the deal but it might have taken six months or more and I would have to wear a sidearm to deal with possible strange prospects. After 20 years of RV life one thing I can say with no doubt, RV ownership is a lot like horse ownership. You do it because you love it, enjoy it and never plan to actually break even or make money. Yeah, we had horses for many years before retirement and RV life set in and I trained some great ones but it was love and not money because, just like RV stuff, it was and is expensive. My plan is to leave this planet for whatever comes next with my DW in good shape financially and everything else is to have as much fun with her as possible in our retirement. Money does not matter as long as we have enough, whatever that is. So far we have been blessed.


Edit: I was shocked that I got the amount for our DP I needed to make the trade without a lot of bickering. I just looked blankly at the salesman at the first offer and he jumped up and said, let me check with my sales manager to see if I can get you another $10k. Came back, said he got the OK and I said - good to go.
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Old 05-24-2018, 07:32 PM   #69
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We actually traded in our DP for the View. I know I could have sold it myself and cleared $10k more in the deal but it might have taken six months or more and I would have to wear a sidearm to deal with possible strange prospects. After 20 years of RV life one thing I can say with no doubt, RV ownership is a lot like horse ownership. You do it because you love it, enjoy it and never plan to actually break even or make money. Yeah, we had horses for many years before retirement and RV life set in and I trained some great ones but it was love and not money because, just like RV stuff, it was and is expensive. My plan is to leave this planet for whatever comes next with my DW in good shape financially and everything else is to have as much fun with her as possible in our retirement. Money does not matter as long as we have enough, whatever that is. So far we have been blessed.

Exactly right! We are just trying to decide at this point if RVing is actually that much "fun" anymore.
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Old 05-25-2018, 11:04 AM   #70
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When the dealer offered me $40,000 less than what my Phaeton was worth, I walked out. I sold it a couple of weeks later after my neighbor told my mechanic who told another client of his that he knew where they could get a really good, well maintained Phaeton.

So sell your Bounder first and then go find your new View/Navion.
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Old 05-28-2018, 06:10 PM   #71
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I have a 2018 View 24V and couldn't be happier. The sewage management is not a problem even though I have a fused L4-6, two artificial knees and hip. The mascerator / pump serves a good purpose and the change of "tone" helps you know when the gray tank is empty. Granted, I'm not downsizing from a Class -A but I bought my rig from a great southern gentleman who was downing sizing from a Class -A and had a heart attack weeks after his purchase and was forced to sell. He and his wife love the size and mobility of the Class C and the great fuel MPG compared to the larger unit.


I've had no problem with my refrigerator...I've had no problems at all. I travel 70mph on the highway with no problems and enjoy the flexibility the Class C affords. I've recently purchased a Mini Cooper Countryman that I will be trailering behind the rig.


My wife typically packs everything but the kitchen sink and we yet we've had no problem with space or weights issues.


We did upgrade the mattresses of the twin beds with two custom Murmaid Mattresses which has definitely added comfort for a restful night's sleep.


The rig is louder than I expected on the road trip..especially on rougher grade tarmac but we use Bose Noise Reducing headphones and travel is good.


We're just now getting into the hotter months of the TN summer. Thus far the air conditioner has been adequate - good. We'll see how it goes later in July.


Another advantage to the Class C, especially when you're not towing, is you can slip into much nicer camp ground sites that Class A can not fit into. This makes a big difference to me.


We travel light and only manage water and tank volume carefully while on the road. I don't know if I need it or not but I'm having an additional solar panel installed at the Winne National Rally this July. I'd rather be safe than sorry for stored energy.


Hope this helps...good luck on your transition.


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Old 05-28-2018, 07:07 PM   #72
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I have a 2018 View 24V and couldn't be happier. The sewage management is not a problem even though I have a fused L4-6, two artificial knees and hip. The mascerator / pump serves a good purpose and the change of "tone" helps you know when the gray tank is empty. Granted, I'm not downsizing from a Class -A but I bought my rig from a great southern gentleman who was downing sizing from a Class -A and had a heart attack weeks after his purchase and was forced to sell. He and his wife love the size and mobility of the Class C and the great fuel MPG compared to the larger unit.


I've had no problem with my refrigerator...I've had no problems at all. I travel 70mph on the highway with no problems and enjoy the flexibility the Class C affords. I've recently purchased a Mini Cooper Countryman that I will be trailering behind the rig.


My wife typically packs everything but the kitchen sink and we yet we've had no problem with space or weights issues.


We did upgrade the mattresses of the twin beds with two custom Murmaid Mattresses which has definitely added comfort for a restful night's sleep.


The rig is louder than I expected on the road trip..especially on rougher grade tarmac but we use Bose Noise Reducing headphones and travel is good.


We're just now getting into the hotter months of the TN summer. Thus far the air conditioner has been adequate - good. We'll see how it goes later in July.


Another advantage to the Class C, especially when you're not towing, is you can slip into much nicer camp ground sites that Class A can not fit into. This makes a big difference to me.


We travel light and only manage water and tank volume carefully while on the road. I don't know if I need it or not but I'm having an additional solar panel installed at the Winne National Rally this July. I'd rather be safe than sorry for stored energy.


Hope this helps...good luck on your transition.


TN Wanderer
Thanks very much; I appreciate your comments. We are still kicking tires.
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Old 05-28-2018, 09:19 PM   #73
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I have a 2018 View 24V ... snip ...

I've had no problem with my refrigerator...

... snip ...
TN Wanderer
What model refrigerator do you have?
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Old 05-29-2018, 05:59 AM   #74
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Lot of folks don't get it but the problem refrigerator was not in all 2018 Views, only the 2018 24 D. All 2019 V/N should come with the DE0061 refrigerator however but his - no. I know Warren is aware of that but the poster is not. All V/N models which are pre 18.5 year except the 24D did not come with the DE0061 and therefore no "known" widespread problem other than 24D but wait for it.
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Old 05-29-2018, 12:17 PM   #75
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Lot of folks don't get it but the problem refrigerator was not in all 2018 Views, only the 2018 24 D. All 2019 V/N should come with the DE0061 refrigerator however but his - no. I know Warren is aware of that but the poster is not. All V/N models which are pre 18.5 year except the 24D did not come with the DE0061 and therefore no "known" widespread problem other than 24D but wait for it.

Thanks, Bill. Count me as one who "didn't get it". I assumed all the newer Navions (all floorplans) come with the same model Norcold...so that not the case?
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