V-10 Significant breakdown - Page 4

bigb · 12-01-2022, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Americanrascal

Yippee! We are headed to Montgomery AL tomorrow to pick up our motorhome. Well I was pleasantly surprised today when the phone rang and the service tech at the Ford Truck Service center at Stivers in Montgomery came on the line and said I could come pick my rig up it was fixed!!!! No 4 month wait for a new engine, no major tear down expense, the rig had been repaired and put back together. They and other mechanics had really thought the engine was shot and a new one was needed. Seems Good Sam's (service contract) insistence on a tear down to the point of failure was the right call and saved everyone a bunch of time and $$$$ with a new engine not being necessary .Turns out after beginning the tear down they found the exhaust valve spring had broken on number 10 cyl. giving the screwy compression reading because of a non functioning exhaust valve. $7.00 part and a whole bunch of labor cost and I am one happy and lucky cowboy. I am spending the night listening to Gene Autry sing : "I'm Back in the Saddle Again!!!!".. I think I'll sing along with him.

That's good news but it doesn't exactly speak well of the diagnostics performed by the mechanics.

Americanrascal · 12-01-2022, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigb

That's good news but it doesn't exactly speak well of the diagnostics performed by the mechanics.

I agree- the irony is that it was Good Sam's that insisted and made the call to do the tear down to the point of failure. Good call on their part and the griping about it by the shop and even me who was trying to save a buck were wrong.

I learned a lesson on that one.

bigb · 12-01-2022, 05:07 PM

On the other hand I can see a shop wanting to install a new engine to cover them, if they fix a broken one they are somewhat liable if the fix fails but with a new engine they have the Ford warranty and if the new engine fails it's not on their dime.
Many years ago I was looking at buying a transmission franchise and it was explained to me that fixing a broken transmission leaves liability as it could fail again at a inopportune time like in the middle of nowhere while being driven by an elderly person.

This was the reasoning explained to me why you sell a new transmission to every customer. (I ended up not buying a transmission franchise)

Americanrascal · 12-01-2022, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigb

On the other hand I can see a shop wanting to install a new engine to cover them, if they fix a broken one they are somewhat liable if the fix fails but with a new engine they have the Ford warranty and if the new engine fails it's not on their dime.
Many years ago I was looking at buying a transmission franchise and it was explained to me that fixing a broken transmission leaves liability as it could fail again at a inopportune time like in the middle of nowhere while being driven by an elderly person.

This was the reasoning explained to me why you sell a new transmission to every customer. (I ended up not buying a transmission franchise)

Yep!

Morich · 12-01-2022, 05:37 PM

Let's review what we have heard so far?
Looking back a bit to the report on 11-28 we had this.
Quote:
As suspected all along no. 10 cylinder is damaged (heavily grooved and scoured) and valves are seriously damaged but unclear to what extent yet. Cylinder was bore scoped and significant damage to cylinder wall was observed.

Gloom and doom and they actuallty could see the damage tot he cylinder walls! So what "healed" that serious damage they could see?

Was it maybe just the fact you did not automatically cough up a few thousand dollars so that they had to actually show that damage was there before they got the big bucks?

In the auto industry mags that is often called "profit enhancement" while the rest of us may have other terms to describe the action!

bigb · 12-01-2022, 05:39 PM

What I am curious about is how much of this did Good Sam cover? Did they cover the teardown?

Americanrascal · 12-01-2022, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigb

What I am curious about is how much of this did Good Sam cover? Did they cover the teardown?

Total bill is about $1900. I have a $1000 deductible. Good Sams will cover the $900 +/- and said I didn't have to eat an isolated tear down charge as the fix was found early as part of the tear down and became the repair. I still have a few minor ancillary charges on top of my $1000 deductible not covered by their warranty-- but all in all I am satisfied and happy with their prompt and proper service to me.

Its the third time I've had to use Good Sams over the past few years to satisfy a major repair : one on a slide failure, one on a Heat Pump failure and this event. On all three they came in promptly and covered me. I am going to continue to do business with them.

IOS 3 · 12-01-2022, 08:40 PM

Good news indeed! I thought they scoped the cylinder and documented serious damage to the cylinder wall.... How did that turn in to this???!!!! Wow....

Wyatt · 12-01-2022, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IOS 3

Good news indeed! I thought they scoped the cylinder and documented serious damage to the cylinder wall.... How did that turn in to this???!!!! Wow....

I agree with this and I’m kind of worried because it seems like they tore it apart until they found something they can blame it on and fix that, but didn’t address anything else further because as you say, they didn’t tear it down any further—perhaps down far enough to find the cylinder walls were also scored?

I’m not trying to keep you up at night worry about this but I’m kind of wondering about it…

Americanrascal · 12-02-2022, 03:47 AM

I asked them about the scouring they mentioned before and they advised that for an engine with 63000 miles it was in normal tolerances and there was not grooving. Rings seemed all intact and compression is not normal as the exhaust valve is now working again. They've done test runs on it and all has been well. Compression is normal.

For peace of mind I will likely get a bore scope and keep an eye on things myself going forward. They don't seem to be that expensive?

I'm wondering if its along the lines of what BigB mentioned earlier and that they may have over shot with their commentary and description to try to justify a new engine?

Guess I'll know more today if it makes the 90 miles back home from the shop? (But I intend to question them more about the cylinder condition)

Bo Walker · 12-02-2022, 04:00 AM

I'm happy with and for you. Thank you for keeping us posted on the whole problem and solution.
Keep traveling.

Americanrascal · 12-02-2022, 04:09 AM

Some anecdotal stuff here. I asked the folks down in Montgomery at the Ford shop how often they are seeing V-10 problems along these lines. He says they do a lot of V-10 motorhome work, but less on service trucks. The general thought around their shop-- no proof- is that in general motorhomes tend to sit for long periods of time then be used for a spurt . On the other hand box and service trucks with V-10's tend to run consistently which seems to make them a bit less susceptible to issues like this. Its only a general anecdotal observation but may have some validity to it???

The other local mechanic that worked on the rig initially, told me he saw V-10 valve and valve guide issues very frequently??? Many resulting in valves dropping through the piston for a big problem.

Oh well.

**Eagle5** · 12-26-2022, 03:28 PM

What weight oil do you have in the engine now, after the repairs?

Americanrascal · 12-27-2022, 06:37 AM

Mobile 1 5w-30- as I always have for the past 5 oil changes. Motorcraft blend before that

**Eagle5** · 12-27-2022, 09:05 AM

Hi Joe,
Yes, I am using Mobile 1 too. It is a great oil. Glad to hear that you are not using a 5W-20.
Thanks, Eagle5

Dan_S · 12-28-2022, 03:37 PM

So what is the problem with 5w-20? That's is the oil called for in my F53.

**Eagle5** · 12-28-2022, 08:21 PM

Hi Dan,
Ford once recommended using 5W-20 in the V-10, but has since switched to recommending 5W-30 for the same engine. Under the heavy load and hot conditions, the 5W-20 is too thin for good bearing and cam protection. Ford was pushing the thinner oil to get a tenth more miles per gallon out of their fleet averages.
I recommend that you run 0W-40 for even better protection.
Eagle5

grtharris · 05-19-2023, 09:13 PM

Follow up from way back in January. Drove the motorhome yesterday with a new remanufactured Ford engine.
The Ford shop would not take it after listening to the knock, said it was deep in the engine. Found an AAMCO shop about 50 miles away that was looking for motorhome repair business so I took it over there. After about 4 hours of deep troubling shooting there concluded it was in the lower part of the engine. They recommended overhaul or remanufactured engine. Went with a Ford engine with a 3 yr warranty.
Took 12 weeks to get the engine and about a week to install. They took it out the front.
Total cost was $10.5K Suppose to get feed back on the old engine.

dphorton · 05-19-2023, 09:18 PM

How many miles did you have on the Engine?

Morich · 05-20-2023, 07:55 AM

Sounds like the old song? Something about the rods are a'knocking?
The old cars used to have space enough to get the pan off and take a look but I'm thinking that doesn't happen on big RV engines!
If one's knocking, I'm not going with fixing just one as it takes way too much trouble to leave the rest being suspect.

Gettting a good straight idea of what's wrong is as hard on engines as it is getting the right answer from doctors!