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Old 10-03-2020, 11:07 AM   #1
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The trashing of our public lands.

saw this today in the Saturday edition of RV Travel Newsletter. and have posted it here for those who may not have seen it or who don't subscribe. please give it a read.

https://www.rvtravel.com/trashing-public-lands/
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Old 10-03-2020, 11:50 AM   #2
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It is horrible to see. This country is a great gift to us all, and it should be respected.
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Old 10-03-2020, 02:35 PM   #3
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It is disheartening. I am in South Jersey and amazed at the trash I see along the highways and byways. Not just a can or cup tossed out the window, but FULL bags of trash simply dumped on the side of the road. When I camp hosted in MN a few years ago, I dedicated an hour each evening to picking up trash along Highway 61 just outside Grand Marais. There was no shortage of items to pick up.
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Old 10-03-2020, 04:31 PM   #4
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Just travelled through California, we were shocked and appalled at the tons and tons and miles and miles of trash along the freeways. Also was blown away at the so-called homeless camps next to the freeways (the source of most if not all of the trash). What a sad thing for what was once was a beautiful state. Live there in the early Ď70s ... now we likely wonít revisit again.
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Old 10-03-2020, 04:54 PM   #5
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This was a very sad article to read but it is becoming more common everyday. I find myself picking up other people's trash because it bugs me to see it there. I'll even gather the shopping carts that these lazy slobs leave all over the grocery store parking lot, often within 20' of a cart corral. The selfish and self-centered people of our country are ruining all that we hold dear. We have become a nation of selfish slobs. People won't even protect themselves and others from the Covid-19 pandemic by wearing a simple mask. Or burning down our forests by not extinguishing their campfires or by blowing something up and starting a fire for a gender reveal party? What the hell is wrong with us? The most simple rule such as "Pack It In - Pack It Out" is ignored because they can't even follow that. Did Mom and Dad pick up after them their entire life? Now we will see a no fee, free area be closed or fees start being charged in the future. I'd like to see these people fined heavily if caught but with so few National Forest Service personnel on hand that may be impossible. I sometimes wonder if we could bring back the Civilian Conservation Corps from FDR's time back to help our national parks and forests recover from this onslaught and employ young people in such a meaningful occupation. Maybe we could pay some salaries with heavy fines imposed on the violators?
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Old 10-03-2020, 11:33 PM   #6
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I spent 5 days in the Poconos last month in the Delaware Valley National Recreation Area. This is a day use area only with a $10 fee required. You pay the fee, fill out the receipt, and display on your vehicle dashboard. Something like this should apply in all federal lands with a $1,000 fine if you get caught without the receipt. A lifetime ban should also apply to anyone found guilty of littering or failing to pay the use fees.
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Old 10-04-2020, 09:00 AM   #7
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Based on the article, Iím wondering how much was from campers, and how much was from others who are using the free trash bins.

So many people have been negatively impacted by COVID, that there is a big change in peopleís behavior.

My parents taught us to leave a place better than you found it. Even if that meant packing out others trash, or cleaning up the remains of a fire not in a pit.
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Old 10-07-2020, 05:24 PM   #8
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This is one example of what can happen when our refuse centers start charging excessive fees for trash disposal. Mostly ignorant people with no sense of pride are always on the lookout for free places to dump their trash. This happens virtually everywhere in this country. Remote areas usually get hit the worst.

I hosted at Dash Point State Park in WA, located between the cities of Seattle and Tacoma on Puget Sound. You would not believe the way people come here, mostly from the cities, to "camp" and leave massive amounts of junk, including living room and patio furniture, upon departure. Many leave their tents behind too. Even human waste was left in the middle of one of the campsites. Locals would walk their dogs on the extensive trail system so that they would not have to pick up after them. And lastly, the homeless frequented the park like they owned the place. This was my least fun place to host, ever. It's a real shame as it is a real gem located between two large metropolitan areas and should be better appreciated.

The really sad part is that rule enforcement here was very lax to non-existent due to political pressure. Does this make sense to you? It escapes me.
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Old 10-07-2020, 06:21 PM   #9
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Here in Arizona the Prescott National Forest has been closed down due to trash. Some of our forest lands look like homeless encampments full of trash! Problem is there's no homeless people within 25 miles, it's the lazy campers that apparantly think others will clean up after them.
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Old 10-07-2020, 11:38 PM   #10
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I live in Prescott and I am always fearful of the slob campers that come up here. Especially the fire danger to this beautiful little place because we are in the middle of the biggest Ponderosa pine forest in the world. It's not a matter of if, its a matter of when it happens here. We already lost 19 of our 20 man Prescott Wildland Hotshot firefighters in Yarnell a few years ago. I remember a few years ago it was reported that up in Flagstaff the NFS rangers put out 125 still smoldering campfires there after a Memorial Day weekend.
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Old 10-08-2020, 07:28 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeC View Post
This is one example of what can happen when our refuse centers start charging excessive fees for trash disposal. Mostly ignorant people with no sense of pride are always on the lookout for free places to dump their trash. This happens virtually everywhere in this country. Remote areas usually get hit the worst.

I hosted at Dash Point State Park in WA, located between the cities of Seattle and Tacoma on Puget Sound. You would not believe the way people come here, mostly from the cities, to "camp" and leave massive amounts of junk, including living room and patio furniture, upon departure. Many leave their tents behind too. Even human waste was left in the middle of one of the campsites. Locals would walk their dogs on the extensive trail system so that they would not have to pick up after them. And lastly, the homeless frequented the park like they owned the place. This was my least fun place to host, ever. It's a real shame as it is a real gem located between two large metropolitan areas and should be better appreciated.

The really sad part is that rule enforcement here was very lax to non-existent due to political pressure. Does this make sense to you? It escapes me.
I was just in a campground in TX and they had a sign stating that if there was trash in there campsite when they left it would be charged to there credit card.
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Old 10-08-2020, 01:36 PM   #12
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Too much of our lifestyle comes way over packaged - that's one problem. Secondly, any public facilities run by state, local or federal government is generally underfunded, and falling apart, so "garbage collection" will suffer. The condition of most "parks" we visit is simply deplorable and shows extreme budget starvation effects. Let's be perfectly honest here, "public facilities" of any kind are at the bottom of every government budget priority.

But hey, I'll bet the area around nuclear missile silos is as clean as a whistle.
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Old 11-05-2020, 04:32 PM   #13
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Even worse is having our national forests sold off to foreign timber companies on the cheap or having fracking and strip minining on the nation's public lands. Trash can be picked up but a strip mine or coal dump lasts forever. Parts of California where the devastion caused by the gold miners and loggers is still clearly visible 150 years later. The coal extractors are removing entire mountain tops and dumping it all into the rivers and destroying the fisheries and poisoning the people's drinking water and causing widespread birth defects.
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Old 11-05-2020, 09:41 PM   #14
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I don't know about CA's environmental recovery potential but in the 1800's, PA was nearly completely stripped of timber because of coal mining by moving mountains etc. It was a huge disaster area. Wildlife suffered dearly. However, looking at it today you would never know. In the early to mid 1900's the whitetail deer population exploded to about 1M and was rated as the #1 deer hunting capitol in the country. Why? Deer need low growth vegetation to thrive and that was what replaced the barren landscape.

I'm not saying go ahead and destroy the environment, just that mining and other industries can leave a smaller footprint and nature, in time, will the recover. Just probably not in your lifetime or mine. Unfortunately, unscrupulous politicians will sell out our country and line their pockets with money in the process while making nobody accountable for environmental damage. It is possible to have it both ways, just that we generally only want to go one way or the other.
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