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Old 05-08-2022, 11:07 AM   #1
Owner and Traveler
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Grapevine, Texas
Posts: 23
No coach 12V power

2018 Vista 27PE
Original Owner
Original batteries

- no lights or other 12V power in coach when not plugged into 120V
- plugged into 120V while in storage
- everything works while plugged into 120V except radio power switch (that allows radio to run off house batteries)
- have not tried genset, but suspect it won't start on house battery only
- house battery cutoff switch shows faint green light; switching on/off does nothing I can notice, and light stays green
- TPMS booster connected directly to house battery does not light
- engine starts fine on chassis battery (12V+ reading while plugged into 120V)
- house batteries, <4V reading while plugged into 120V

Before jumping to "get new house batteries" conclusion, anything I should check? Anything a service repair guy will try and talk me into?

Just got out of surgery, so contortionist moves by me not possible right now.

Thanks, John
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Old 05-08-2022, 02:00 PM   #2
Winnebago Master
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Pflugerville/Austin, Tx
Posts: 7,537
Good day to you!
Hope the RV is not spoiling a pretty nice day. But looking at the problem, you've given some very good info and I hate to say but it is quite likely to be worn out batteries on the coach set.
Some things that say that are the weak green light and really low battery voltage. Voltage can be tricking us if we read too soon after there has been any charging going on but when it is that low, it's sure not telling us you have been charging!

One point that often moves me toward checking the batteries is that RV tend to get rundown, either before we get them while they are setting on dealers lots or even after if we don't watch the water in them well enough. The way we use RV is lots harder on a battery than what we see in cars where we drive every few days. Letting them get down too low or stay down too long can damage them.
But let's not jump there just yet?

Taking the RV or batteries to an auto parts store can let them do a "load test" which puts an artificial load on them to see how they hold up. This is often free! Likely you don't want to be lifting them in/out right now!

But first? If you have some type of battery charger, it works best to check the water is good in the batteries and charge them over night or so to help make sure they can do their best.

I go with this first if possible because there are so many things on the RV that require good battery to connect and work right, even though we may be plugged in and the converter is expected to keep things charged. Things like the battery switch have to have power to move the actual relay that makes that connection.

As another way to get some info, if you can start the RV engine, from the start battery not being down, that does possibly tell us some things.
The start battery is NOT charged from being plugged in unless there has been some stuff added to do that charge.

But if that starts the engine, there are several other automatic things that happen if all is well.
There is a connection from the ignition circuits when the engine runs that move a solenoid on older but I think you will have a newer solid state item (that you can't hear!)that connects both battery sets together as well as the engine alternator, so that we get charge from the alternator going to ALL batteries to recharge them.

In theory, we could just run the engine long enough to recharge the coach batteries but it is a 6-8 hour process, so not practical but as a test we can confirm the power from the alternator is getting to the all batteries. If you can test the coach voltage, it will show up quite quickly and that high reading may spook you into thinking the batteries are super good because you may see 13-14 volts really quick! Not true as that is the charge from the alternator and drops off quick if you stop.

But that would tell you that the cables from other parts are getting to the batteries---or NOT if the cables are dirty at some point along the line and need cleaned. If testing there with a meter, test both on the post and the cables and compare to see things are making good contact?

Three year old and down to 4 volts? Sounds suspect but check first. It can be a dirty cable and the charge is getting as close as the clamp on the battery but not INTO the battery? Or maybe there is no water in the thing because we got too busy with other, bigger worries?

My knee rules on some days !
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Old 05-08-2022, 02:29 PM   #3
Owner and Traveler
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Grapevine, Texas
Posts: 23
Thanks so much for the response. I will await assistance to take the batteries out and have them checked. In the mean time, I will check the water levels, and get some voltage readings while running the engine.

It is possible that I had the battery disconnect off for a month or so, which may have hindered charging via 120v.

Thanks again for your informative and comprehensive response.

John
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Old 05-08-2022, 03:52 PM   #4
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Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Pflugerville/Austin, Tx
Posts: 7,537
Hope it heads you in the right direction!
Just keeping things running is hard at times and RV have lots of "funny" things that make it easy to miss. I worked on older relay type stuff where you could look and listen for it moving and when they came around to using the solid state things that don't actually move, I had to adapt to testing more and not just listen and feel. I really liked doing the older stuff that we could change out one part and see progress. Now much of troubleshooting electronics is just get a two hundred dollar board and swap to see if that was the right one!
Not my cup of tea but I'm out of the market anyway!
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Old 05-08-2022, 06:52 PM   #5
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Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Elk Grove, CA
Posts: 3,583
Morich -

Give me a leaky or swollen electrolytic capacitor or cold solder joint any day. Between the two, you can probably fix 80% of the problems with old pre-surface mount printed circuit boards.
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Old 05-16-2022, 08:30 AM   #6
Winnebago Owner
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Location: Northern KY
Posts: 52
Just an added thought. At only 4 volts the batteries are likely sulfated from setting with a very low charge for so long. Any test will likely say they are bad and need to be replaced. My charger would try to charge for 2 hours and then issue a bad bat code. It took several such cycles and bad bat codes to get the battery voltage up to the point where the charger would stay on overnight. Once the battery had a charge above 12.4 volts I had it tested on a load tester at the local auto parts store. It still came up as a bad battery. It was so badly sulfated that while it showed voltage it could only provide a fraction of the amperage it was rated for. I needed it for a quick departure and shelled out $200+ for a replacement. Ouch that hurt but got me to investigating to see if a battery could be desulfated and restored to near original condition.
I found two items on Amazon the first is a BatteryMinder Plus
https://www.amazon.com/BatteryMINDer...NrPXRydWU&th=1

The second from Amazon was a Performance Tool 12 volt digital battery analyzer (inexpensive way to test the batteries at home)
https://www.amazon.com/Performance-T...NsaWNrPXRydWU=

So far, I can attest to both of these fairly inexpensive devices and have been able to fully recover a 12 volt AGM battery that set on my bench too long and lost charge down to that 4 volt range. It too tested bad and took several attempts with the charger to get the voltage back up into the 12 volt range once up, I tested it with the analyzer and it came up as a bad battery. I hooked up the BatteryMinder that only charges with 1.5 amps but has some sort of capacitor system that pulses the battery charge to desulfate the battery and after a full week on the BatteryMinder the AGM now tests at its original cold cranking amperage. It's made a believer out of me but is not a fast process. If you have the time and patience it might save you $$$ and help recover those 4 year old batteries.
Dead batteries in an RV that sets in storage are an age old issue. I was constantly chasing problems with our first RV and ended up adding a battery disconnect knife switch to take parasitic loads off the batteries and avoid pulling fuses on the main panel to save the battery from discharging. The fact that yours were not charging from the converter while plugged in, is a concern, and could simply be a loose battery connection that allows 12 volts when plugged in to 120 but the charge voltage is not getting to the battery. If not a loose terminal connection then an internal short in one of your batteries causing them to discharge faster than the converter can charge them might be the cause. Checking the water level might tell you if one or more cells has been boiling off its fluid. If you can see a whitish gray substance on the cell plates these are sulfate crystals and the battery might be recovered but only with a long time on a desulfator. The larger the CCA on the battery the longer the time on a desulfator. Some may require more than one week to recover but progress can be measured using the analyzer.
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