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07-21-2006, 03:50 PM
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#1
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Winnebago Camper
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Suffield, CT
Posts: 13
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We are being forced into a 50 amp service on our next motorhome and I need some education! If I have absorbed things correctly, we are looking at two legs of 110 vac - 50 amps each. Are these both on the same phase, or is there a 220 vac differential across the two legs?
It would seem that almost everywhere we go, we will be forced into using a 30 to 50 amp adaptor (dogbone?). What is this adapter really doing?
Does anyone have a website that adequately explains the 50 amp wiring concept?
Norm
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2007 Winnebago Adventurer 35L
Workhorse W24 chassis
2008 Subaru Forester AWD
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07-21-2006, 03:50 PM
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#2
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Winnebago Camper
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Suffield, CT
Posts: 13
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We are being forced into a 50 amp service on our next motorhome and I need some education! If I have absorbed things correctly, we are looking at two legs of 110 vac - 50 amps each. Are these both on the same phase, or is there a 220 vac differential across the two legs?
It would seem that almost everywhere we go, we will be forced into using a 30 to 50 amp adaptor (dogbone?). What is this adapter really doing?
Does anyone have a website that adequately explains the 50 amp wiring concept?
Norm
__________________
2007 Winnebago Adventurer 35L
Workhorse W24 chassis
2008 Subaru Forester AWD
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07-21-2006, 05:28 PM
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#3
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Winnie-Wise
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Sheboygan, WI
Posts: 306
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I think all the answers you are looking for can be found in the following page of the RV Tech Library website.
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Mark & Leann Quasius
2016 Cornerstone 45A
2007 Allegro Bus 42QRP (Sold)
2012 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited - Rubicon
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07-21-2006, 05:44 PM
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#4
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Winnebago Master
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Back at the ranch
Posts: 2,041
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--John
2005 Horizon 40AD, 2005 Jeep Liberty CRD
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07-21-2006, 05:57 PM
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#5
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Winnebago Owner
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Indiana
Posts: 91
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Please don't look at it as though you are being force into 50 amp. look at it like this, your smart for making that decision. You can always hook up to 30 amp and enjoy 1/2 of what you can enjoy at 50 amp. The adapters work well, you just have to learn how to adapt your useage. With 50 amp, it's easy, just plug-in and play.
Been there done that.
radarr
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07 Monaco Dynasty 43Q4
"An Unbelievable Coach"
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07-22-2006, 12:44 AM
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#6
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Winnebago Owner
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Chattanooga, Tn.
Posts: 100
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Be sure to include a good surge guard and voltage protection device for the electrical source like Surge Guard or equivelent. With the electronics you will have aboard you will want to protect them.
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Mike, RVIA & RVSA Certified Master RV Technician
Amy, Dr. Assistant - Roxie & Mei Ling, four legs each
2000 Gulf Stream Scenic Cruiser 450 hp & 1330# torque
06 Saturn Vue, 06 Chevy Z71 4x4 & 2014 Corvette Z51 M7
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07-22-2006, 04:00 AM
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#7
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Winnebago Master
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Motor City, Mich
Posts: 1,004
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New motorhome? Selling the 31Y?
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Tim.
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07-22-2006, 06:37 AM
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#8
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Winnebago Camper
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Suffield, CT
Posts: 13
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by tderonne:
New motorhome? Selling the 31Y? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
We will actually be trading it in - I don't want the hassle of selling it myself!
__________________
2007 Winnebago Adventurer 35L
Workhorse W24 chassis
2008 Subaru Forester AWD
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07-23-2006, 02:58 PM
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#9
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Winnebago Master
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Sarver, PA/Crystal River, FL/Shelocta, PA
Posts: 1,196
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Norm Newhall:
Are these both on the same phase, or is there a 220 vac differential across the two legs?
Norm </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Norm;
The legs of the 50amp outlet should be out of phase and come off a different buss. If wired correctly, you should see 240v between the legs.
If the legs come off the same buss you'll see 120v between the legs and this is incorrect wiring.
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Sarver, PA/Crystal River, FL/Shelocta, PA · FMCA 335149 · W3TLN 2005 Suncruiser 38R · W24, no chassis mods needed · 2013 Honda Accord EX-L · 2008 Honda Odyssey EX-L
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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07-23-2006, 05:15 PM
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#10
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Winnebago Owner
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Fulltiming. Living wherever the jacks hit the ground.
Posts: 66
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A 50 amp service is 120/240 volt, same as the service in your house. If you were to put in a double pole breaker, you would be able to power a 240 volt appliance, like a clothes dryer, or a welder.
It is 3 wire, single-phase, mid-point neutral:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split_phase
http://www.myrv.us/electric/index.htm
http://www.bobhatch.com/electricStuff/30to50amp.htm
What does a 30 amp to 50 amp dog bone do, and how does it work?
http://www.bobhatch.com/electricStuf...pter/index.htm
Why should you want 50 amp?
30 amp times 120 volts = 3600 watts.
50 amps times 240 volts = 12,000 watts, or
100 amps times 120 volts = 12,000 watts.
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Bob Hatch
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07-25-2006, 06:02 PM
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#11
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Winnebago Camper
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Beaverton, OR, USA
Posts: 18
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If your new rig has an EMS it should detect when you only have 30 amp power (only one leg of the 50 amp cord powered) and behave accordingly.
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Alvin/KB7VHI
2002 35R Southwind, W22 8.1L Vortec UltraPower, 19.5' wheels
Toad: Wrangler, lifted and on 35" tires
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07-25-2006, 07:08 PM
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#12
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Winnebago Watcher
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Prattville, AL USA
Posts: 4
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Tom N
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">If the legs come off the same buss you'll see 120v between the legs and this is incorrect wiring. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I think you would see 0 v between the legs.
You wouls have 120 V to neutral
Tom
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01 Sunnybrook 33 BWS
00 Chevy 2500 6.0L 3.73
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07-26-2006, 04:03 AM
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#13
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Member
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Cypress, Texas USA
Posts: 102
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Yep, 240VAC between the hot legs if the wiring is correct, 0VAC if it isn't.
The reason this is important is that the neutral conductor will carry current equal to the sum of the hot legs. If one hot leg is carrying 40 amps and the other 35 amps, the neutral leg current would be 40 + (-35) = 5 amps if the hot legs are 180 degrees out of phase (correct wiring) but would be 40 + (+35) = 75 amps if the hot legs are in phase (incorrect wiring). In the latter case, the neutral conductor would be overloaded.
Rusty
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07-26-2006, 05:51 AM
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#14
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Winnebago Camper
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Punta Gorda, Fl.
Posts: 10
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We do a considerable amount of traveling and have almost always had the use of a 50 amp plug in.
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Tom, Pat and Buster (the Boston terrier)
2004 DSDP 3807, 370HP Spartan
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07-28-2006, 11:19 AM
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#15
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Winnebago Owner
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 68
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by alvinc:
If your new rig has an EMS it should detect when you only have 30 amp power (only one leg of the 50 amp cord powered) and behave accordingly. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Almost correct - but when using a 50/30 amp converter - that is a "Dog Bone" to connect your 50 power cord to a 30 amp service (Power Pole) the single 30amp feed is connected to both of the 50amp leads in your 50amp service cord. That way everything in the MH is powered but you only have 30amps available.
PHESPE
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07-29-2006, 04:37 PM
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#16
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Winnebago Watcher
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Texas
Posts: 1
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For those of us that have older units with 30 amps, there is a relatively simple way to utilize the 50 amps available at most RV parks. For example if you have and need to operate two AC units and you have only a 30 amp coach. If anyone is interested I will be happy to provide details.
[email protected]
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07-29-2006, 04:46 PM
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#17
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Administrator Emeritus
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Virginia Beach, VA
Posts: 1,319
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NHVandagriff, Welcome to the forum!!!
Saw your other post was in regard to toad braking and NO ONE welcomed you!!
We're glad your here and I hope someone might ask you to share that knowledge...
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07-29-2006, 06:05 PM
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#18
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Winnebago Owner
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 93
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RustyJC
Not wanting to stir the pot but your explanation of amperes and phase is not quite how it really is.
The power supply companies supply either single or three phase power.I would venture to say that 100 percent of RV power pedistals are single phase,with a 110 volt circuit (30 amp connection and a 15 amp connection)or a 50 amp 240 vac connection in combination with the others.There is no such thing as single phase power being out of phase.
When using 240 vac power to most any motorhome which is setup for this,you are really using two 120 vac circuits feeding two seperate buss bars in the circuit breaker panel in the motorhome.These two buss bars are feeding the circuit breakers for the differant appliances. The neutral leg is to complete the path back to the pedestal.You do not take single phase power and make it 180 degrees out?impossible.
Ed Gardiser
Escondido,Ca.
04 Vectra
87 Nissan PickUp
FMCA
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07-29-2006, 06:25 PM
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#19
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Winnie-Wise
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Crossville, Tennessee
Posts: 417
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Norm,
The bottom line is you will enjoy the 50 Amp. we enjoyed it so much that I changed my wife'snickname from "the California Babe" to "the 50 AMP Chic." you'll love it!
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Dennis & Trish (and Sparky Doodle)
2013 Meridian 42E
2011 Ford Explorer
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07-29-2006, 09:21 PM
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#20
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Winnebago Camper
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: middleburg,fl
Posts: 18
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Ed Gardiser:
RustyJC
Not wanting to stir the pot but your explanation of amperes and phase is not quite how it really is.
The power supply companies supply either single or three phase power.I would venture to say that 100 percent of RV power pedistals are single phase,with a 110 volt circuit (30 amp connection and a 15 amp connection)or a 50 amp 240 vac connection in combination with the others.There is no such thing as single phase power being out of phase.
When using 240 vac power to most any motorhome which is setup for this,you are really using two 120 vac circuits feeding two seperate buss bars in the circuit breaker panel in the motorhome.These two buss bars are feeding the circuit breakers for the differant appliances. The neutral leg is to complete the path back to the pedestal.You do not take single phase power and make it 180 degrees out?impossible.
_______________________________________________
Right on the money.
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Dale & Betty
04 Lapalma 33'
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