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Old 11-15-2017, 09:20 AM   #1
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Question Does the Sink Cabinet move in a 38Q?

Very much a rookie to owning a motorhome and I have a specific question for Winnie/Itasca owners. I own a 2016 Itasca Suncruiser 38Q where the passenger slide, fits over the L shape sink counter. Had the misfortune of my passenger slide going rogue on me and didn't catch it soon enough. Was closing the slide and it began pulling in the rear side of the slide while the front stopped working. (I should have stopped sooner than I did...lesson learned)

The slide was cocked and the vertical wall of the cabinet counter that moves over the sink counter was rubbing against the sink cabinet, particularly on the counter surface edge and the front cabinet door. As I began bumping the slide out, I heard a pop, like something was wedged and then finally broke free. I thought it was popping over the cabinet door edge. I finally got the slide out and was pushing on things to see if anything broke. No marks on the sink or cabinet door. When I pushed forward and up on the whole sink, the cabinet lifted up off the floor just a bit. I could tell the sink cabinet was attached at the back base of the cabinet and could see the tie down bracket at the back wall of the sink cabinet . Couldn't see the front but I need to check again today.

I've never had a need to push on the sink cabinet this way so I don't know if it is supposed to be tied down in the front or something broke free. I tried calling Winnebago and looking at their cortona dwg system but it did not show the detail of where the base bracket is tied down to the chassis.

So my question... are there any 38Q, Adventurer or MH owners with similar L shaped layouts out there who can tell me if they have some movement if you try to lift the sink cabinet up from the front or is the sink securely attached in both the front and back wall of the cabinet. Would really appreciate the check and feedback. I'm a bit worried I've really botched things up. Thank you.
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Old 12-27-2017, 11:43 AM   #2
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No input from this issue, but thought I would post finding in event anyone has similar problems. Turns out when passenger slide was cocked it did indeed break a right angle bracket to the front of the sink. The slide became cocked because one of the drive motors failed. One had to feel around below the sink cabinet and the head of the screw tieing the sink down in the front was broken. The sink is tied down in both the back and front.
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Old 01-02-2018, 04:32 PM   #3
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Good to know. We own a 2014 38Q. Hope your slides are better installed than ours were. All three had to be reinstalled. Also the bed tilt.
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Old 01-02-2018, 10:06 PM   #4
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38Q gray tank question

Hello Cochise, thanks for replying...was beginning to wonder if there was any 38Q owners on the forum. Have a question for you. My rig is winterized so I canít check this. 38 Q has two gray tanks. Do you know if the tanks share the gray water? I called winnebago to ask if there was a check valve limiting flow between them and they told me there was no check valve. Last time we were out we would fill the tank to the kitchen but the shower tank hardly filled. I was told possibly the shower tank might not be registering levels correctly but Iím unable to check now. Any experience with gray tanks sharing or not?
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Old 01-03-2018, 06:23 AM   #5
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DaveRB55-

Sorry for a late response but just saw the post. I have the same exact model but in the WBGO version. I sure hate hearing about the problem you have had but there have been a lot of issues with late model 38Q slides. Every slide mechanism on ours has failed at some point over the past year.

I hate to tell you but the design is such that the sink peninsula portion of the cabinetry is fixed solid and is not movable. I know of some other 38Q folks that have had similar problems to yours and we may be able to get them to weigh in here shortly.

You may have broken components in the 2016 Powergear rack motors for the passenger side slide. Many have had this experience on the 38Q. There is a thread on IRV2 where a fellow is/has replaced his by himself. It was too intimidating a job for me and thus all mine have been replaced by the dealer or factory.

I was lucky that when my Powergear racks broke and came out of alignment I caught it in time before it bound up with cabintery. But I did wind up with a lot of downtime awaiting parts and repair. Ultimately things got resolved for most of my issues with a trip to the factory at Forest City.

I suspect more will be able to weigh in here with advice and experience soon.
Joe
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Old 01-03-2018, 06:34 AM   #6
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With regards to the tanks I do know they interconnect and do share flow between them, but only with a bit of gurgling and struggle to balance sometimes. My gauges are useless on the gray water but have I've never overflowed the gray water. I sense there is a poorly designed venting arrangement between those tanks contributing to the difficulties and proper function of these tanks.,

The black water tank is a whole another story. The washer drains into the black water instead of the gray and can cause a fun camping experience like a visit to a volcano during the next toilet flush cycle. I've managed to flood the passenger side rear compartment during that experience with black water. What FUN THAT WAS! Whenever I forget to drain the black water after washing , the bathroom usually winds up with a major cleaning and overhaul thanks to the explosive results!
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Old 01-03-2018, 09:10 AM   #7
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Hello Joe, thanks for responding.

Regarding slides, the problem was that one of the motors failed. Despite my best efforts to be present when they replaced the motor, the RV repair facility did not call me as requested when the work was being done. In speaking with the tech, wires to the motor has rubbed until shorted. They did replace both motors to ensure a matched set, so I'm hopeful we will be ok for a while.

Thanks for the info on the tanks. I'm anxious to see if my second gray tank sensors are even working! I'm aghast to hear of your apparent pressure problem with your black tank and having trouble understanding how this could be happening. The black tank (all tanks for that matter) are vented to the roof, there should be no pressure unless I'm misunderstanding how this works. I bought my RV used and there were no vent covers when I inspected the roof allowing anything to fall or crawl into the tanks! (was corrected before buying) Is there any chance your vent tube is blocked?
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Old 01-03-2018, 03:08 PM   #8
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Seems the top of the black tank vent (on the roof) along with the top of the washer discharge pipe being higher than the bottom of the toilet bowl---- well when the black tank fills it seems there's only one place for it all to go when you hit the toilet pedal!

(I figure a good 2 lbs of pressure if I remember my hydraulics of .434 lbs for each foot of elevation?)

In my case it topped the waste pipe for the washer first, then on the next flush I got a good lesson in plumbing on the next flush. After cleaning that mess up, I then found the overflow on the washer drain visited all my tools stored in the lower right rear compartment. Boy that's a memory!

I'm now a full blown believer and drain the black water after every wash!
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Old 01-03-2018, 05:09 PM   #9
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Joe,

Sorry to hear you had to go through an experience like that! I don't mean to harp on this but I want to ensure I understand what happened. I think my wife would nix any further RVing if I had any internal dumping!

If I understand correctly, your event happened when your black tank was nearly full and then the washer emptied creating a pressure. Is that right?

I can't understand how any other scenario would result in pressurization like that. Whether the trap is higher or not as long as the tank has room and is vented there should be no pressure in your line.
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Old 01-03-2018, 07:19 PM   #10
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We can get 1 full load with extra rinse, and part of a second wash load (or sometimes a small short load with no extra rinse)in our black water tank before it gets full- if the tank is relatively empty. Part of it depends on the size of the wash -- we load that puppy up!-and we tend to always run extra rinse. So quite a bit of wash water goes into the black water tank. It fills quickly especially if the black water tank already has been used for a while prior to the load being run in the washer.

The open drain pipe on the washer that receives the washer drain hose is about 4 feet (?) higher than the tank top and the base of the toilet. The main vent for the system ties at tank top level in the bathroom with the shower. So when the tank fills, and the washer discharge fills , the vent pipe partially fills. That slightly pressurizes the black water level at the base of the toilet. But I assure you its enough pressure to make Old Faithful look trivial when you hit that toilet foot valve- especially on a hot day. If the tank is not drained when its filled, then the first one to hit the toilet valve gets to see the volcano!

We've been pretty good about staying on top of all this and being good black water drainers when we do the wash for the past year. But about 2 weeks ago I forgot to open and drain the tanks and it filled. My wife flushed -- and was looking down-- and well you can guess what happened. I was lucky though that it had not filled to the level of the top of washer discharge so I didn't get Niagara Falls in the right rear compartment!

I wish I could show you the schematics for this. WBGO has them for your rig on their web site and you can zoom in and see how they did all the plumbing (all systems for that matter). Not sure they could have done it any other way but it would have been nicer if they had hit the gray water tanks instead of using the black water on this model

I know I can't explain this very well, but check the WBGO web site for your rig. It will jump right out at you.
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Old 01-03-2018, 09:06 PM   #11
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Joe,

We are getting quite a conversation going on this! Thanks for the explanation. From your comments, I can see that with the black tank is nearly full and backing up with the pressure from the pipe height differential. You and I have both a 16 38Q, you with the adventurer and me with the Suncruiser, (mine is a 15 chassis) however, we both have 79 gal black tanks and the same waste plumbing. I looked up the plumbing diagram on WBGO (use it all the time- great feature) and I can see how when the black tank is nearly full and a washer flush could result in a pressure buildup.

What I'm surprised at is the fact you get one to two loads of wash done and the black tank is full. We have the Splendide ARWXF129W Ariston stackable washer. A google lookup says the washer uses between 5 and 16 gal depending on cycle for a wash. Seems you would have enough room for a couple of cycles without concern but it will certainly depend on how full you are to start with. I know in our last camp outing we did not have sewer and my wife did at least 3 loads without a problem. (maybe we were right on the cusp and didn't know it!

Also you mention that you load up your washer. In thinking about this, I would venture to guess that the more clothes you put in results in less water used. The washer should have a limit switch to tell the washer it is full. The more clothes in less water to get to the limit. The ratio of water to lbs of clothes is less and probably the reason clothes do not get as clean. Now maybe your black tank is more full when you start but if only a third full seems like you still should have room for a couple of cycles even with an extra rinse.

Didn't mean to belabor this point. I just wanted to gleam any experience I can to avoid problems. Black tank level will certainly will be something I will keep an eye on when deciding to run a load of wash! I may run a test when the weather warms to run a wash cycle and see how much water is actually used. Might help to avoid the gush effect!
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Old 01-04-2018, 07:11 AM   #12
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Dave:
I could likely get 2 loads without overfilling but i'm done experimenting! No extra rinse though.

I've watched the washer cycles (mostly for entertainment on a few wet days with nothing else to do LOL- ist more fun than TV sometimes) and have been surprised at the amount of water used. I try to mentally time it against how much time the washer demands water as opposed to how much time it would take to fill my fresh water tank with a hose just to get a feel for how much water I see being used. Its not an accurate measure by any stroke but its surprising. And remember we ALWAYS do the extra rinse cycles. To be fair we usually have already used some capacity (not a lot) in the tank as we tend to wash at the end of a day.

I have the same washer and I think the 16 gallon number is on the light side by a good bit especially with the extra rinse cycle. I've noticed the more load we have in the washer- the more demand for water filling and rinsing. Based on tank discharge rates I've always sensed the tank was pretty full after a load and an additional 1/2 cycle. I do get a decent reading on the black water tank meters unlike the gray water tanks. After a days use by the 2 of us, followed by about 1.5 load cycles with extra rinse, the meter usually reads at least 2/3 full. I yank the valve quickly after that.

I think I could get 2 light loads in the tank without extra rinse but after a few volcanoes I quit experimenting to keep my marriage intact! No way would I'd never try 3 though. I like sleeping in the bed and not outside LOL!

All the best- keep me posted on your experiences.

Joe

(By the way that noisy dryer drives us nuts! We try to hermetically seal the rear of the motorhome to kill the sound!)
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