Sealing an 18-Year-Old Roof 2007 Aspect 26A

[S.Rodimus]

Brought our 2007 rig to the service center to have the roof looked at in the normal course, as that hasn't yet been done since we bought it a couple years ago. Sort of unsurprisingly, they are suggesting (due to wear and tear + sheer age) that we have the entire roof sealed with silicone paint. To the tune of about $4,500 - $5,500!

1. Does this seem like an outrageous price?
   
   
2. Has anyone here done this (sealing a roof with silicone paint) job themselves, and can share tips & tricks? Such as --
   ** what product(s) to use;
   ** best time of year/weather to do it;
   ** does it have to go on before or after the roof protrusion seals are touched up (or does that not matter);
   ** whether it's Ok to put silicone sealant on top of Fiberglass;
   ** Etc.

Thank you!

 

[S.Rodimus]

There is also the debate of if we reseal with silicone, that's it and we can never do anything to our roof again / i.e. the question of whether anything sticks to silicone. I've seen some threads where people say it will stick, and others where people say it won't. Service center is saying once we go silicone, nothing sticks to silicone, that's it and when it starts to fail, it's time to figure out what our next rig will be. Your thoughts on this, too, please.

Bottom line, I have to let them know in the next day or so whether to just spot touch up the normal roof protrusion seams, or do every single one of them and then top it with a full silicone coat.

 

[creativepart]

Was this the Winnebago Service Center or some other Service Center??

 

[S.Rodimus]

Was this the Winnebago Service Center or some other Service Center??

Local (non-Winnebago specific) service center.

 

[Morich]

I assume this is a fiberglass roof? Is the question one of making it last and not leak or is it an appearance thing? If it needs painted, you have a different thing than if it just needs to be waterproofed!
I've never thought fiberglass items like boats or RV needed much work other than the normal polish and wax plus the normal sealing of any edges. I recommend moving past the sales folks and just do it the way the manual recommends!
There are boats setting in docks where the weather is much worst and they last for a good long time if we keep them fit!

Silicone on RV works much the same as when we seal an old aquarium. Getting new silicone to stick just requires getting the old off and cleaning the surface to allow the new to stick. If it's really a mess, it may need lots of scraping to get the gobs of old caulk off and then a really good wipe with alcohol to get the silicone traces off. If that silicone is not removed, the new is not actually sticking to the roof but just riding on the old layer of silicone!
One of the problems with RV is that we can never fully know what sealers may have been used on the seam in the past, so if we are doing it to las we have to do the removal and sealing as if it had been done with silicone in the past.

I would not touch the idea of silicone paint!

 

[S.Rodimus]

I assume this is a fiberglass roof? Is the question one of making it last and not leak or is it an appearance thing? If it needs painted, you have a different thing than if it just needs to be waterproofed!
I've never thought fiberglass items like boats or RV needed much work other than the normal polish and wax plus the normal sealing of any edges. I recommend moving past the sales folks and just do it the way the manual recommends!
There are boats setting in docks where the weather is much worst and they last for a good long time if we keep them fit!

Silicone on RV works much the same as when we seal an old aquarium. Getting new silicone to stick just requires getting the old off and cleaning the surface to allow the new to stick. If it's really a mess, it may need lots of scraping to get the gobs of old caulk off and then a really good wipe with alcohol to get the silicone traces off. If that silicone is not removed, the new is not actually sticking to the roof but just riding on the old layer of silicone!
One of the problems with RV is that we can never fully know what sealers may have been used on the seam in the past, so if we are doing it to las we have to do the removal and sealing as if it had been done with silicone in the past.

I would not touch the idea of silicone paint!

It's fiberglass. I don't care about appearance; I care about waterproofing. Can you elaborate on your statement of "If it needs painted, you have a different thing than if it just needs to be waterproofed!"?

 

[Morich]

Yes, what I meant was that the normal sealing is a matter of working on the edges where water might get in. But if the paint is bad enough that you don't want to drive it, THEN you may need a paint job!

I consider paint to be for appearance and then sealing to be a different issue and the sealing is really important to keep the water from sneaking in and rotting the frame or going in deeper where it can get into the interior walls!
I have no experience with silicone paint but I am pretty sure it has to be done with as much care as we need to use for resealing the edges or any hole that goes through the roof or sides.
One of the things that silicone is semi-famous for is the way new won't stick to old!
If we try to just put a new layer on old, the new is not actually stuck to the roof or sides but just kind of hanging onto the old residue. There are lots of folks who do not favor using silicone because of this. Once silicone is on, it takes a really careful, thorough cleaning to get the last thin layer off. Rubbing alcohol is one thing used to get the last bit and that takes somebody who really cares about what they are doing!

I just have a hard time trusting them to use that level of care and if it is not done correctly, you can get a layer of silicone sprayed on but not sticking well at those critical edges. Out in the middle of the roof, it may stick quite well as there is not old silicone caulk out there. But that is not a problem because in the middle of the roof, where there are no breaks in the fiberglass, it is not likely to leak anyway!
Along the edge of things is where we get leaks and that is also where we are more likely to find the old silicone caulk that somebody may have slobbered on 6 years ago!

If the edges are not holding tight, the rest is not all that important because it is places like the edge or around lights that are far more likely to leak. I watch those and really look close at the lights at side and back and if those are good, the rest is not as important.

 

[S.Rodimus]

Yes, what I meant was that the normal sealing is a matter of working on the edges where water might get in. But if the paint is bad enough that you don't want to drive it, THEN you may need a paint job!

I consider paint to be for appearance and then sealing to be a different issue and the sealing is really important to keep the water from sneaking in and rotting the frame or going in deeper where it can get into the interior walls!
I have no experience with silicone paint but I am pretty sure it has to be done with as much care as we need to use for resealing the edges or any hole that goes through the roof or sides.
One of the things that silicone is semi-famous for is the way new won't stick to old!
If we try to just put a new layer on old, the new is not actually stuck to the roof or sides but just kind of hanging onto the old residue. There are lots of folks who do not favor using silicone because of this. Once silicone is on, it takes a really careful, thorough cleaning to get the last thin layer off. Rubbing alcohol is one thing used to get the last bit and that takes somebody who really cares about what they are doing!

I just have a hard time trusting them to use that level of care and if it is not done correctly, you can get a layer of silicone sprayed on but not sticking well at those critical edges. Out in the middle of the roof, it may stick quite well as there is not old silicone caulk out there. But that is not a problem because in the middle of the roof, where there are no breaks in the fiberglass, it is not likely to leak anyway!
Along the edge of things is where we get leaks and that is also where we are more likely to find the old silicone caulk that somebody may have slobbered on 6 years ago!

If the edges are not holding tight, the rest is not all that important because it is places like the edge or around lights that are far more likely to leak. I watch those and really look close at the lights at side and back and if those are good, the rest is not as important.

What they are saying is that due to wear and tear + sheer age, our fiberglass roof has some "soft spots" which are indicative of microcracks. The microcracks -- as is -- can let moisture seep in, more by osmosis that an actual "dripping" like a leak would -- and sooner or later will become actual cracks, and thus real leaks. This is why they are suggesting a full normal resealing and then the silicone paint all over. Hopefully that gives more/better context.

 

[Morich]

Okay, that may be a different situation than what I normally think of seeing.
Doing this remote stuff does leave room for some real misses on what it going on.
Weather has lots of things that change how different surfaces react. I was thinking of boats that can last 40-50 years out in the weather but I also know that surface is much thicker and may not be at all the same !

 

[S.Rodimus]

Yeah, I am kind of at a loss what to do here.
They essentially want clean my entire roof, re-seal the protrusions using Dicor self-leveling lap sealant, and then (due to the micro-crack soft spots wear and tear + age of the roof overall) cover the entire roof with a silicone "paint." I see conflicting information all over the internet re: whether that silicone will stick to Dicor. Does anyone know the real answer to this?

 

[Morich]

I do not know the answer at all. Silicone paint is not one I know about.
One way I might think about judging the value is how well they might go on warranty?
I'm not a big fan of warranty as they can write in secrets that I will miss. The person with the most and best legal advise seem to win way too often! It's hard for an individual to come out on top when faced with whole company.
But it can lean toward how they feel about it.

Not much actual help there, just personal thoughts!

One firm idea that I do have is the need to watch ALL the openings in the sides, rear, front as well as the roof. Small points like around the windows and lights can be leaking and we don't know it until the water has run in and found the wood inside. If it does it for a few years, we can get little bubbles begin to show but when we try to fix the bubble, we may find there is not much wall left!

 

[Bones2003]

For what it is worth, I bought my 2003 Winnebago Sunova used with no real RV experience before that. It was a big learning experience for me. As far as I could tell, the previous owner never washed, waxed, or sealed the roof or the seams on the side of the roof and the seams on the front and rear cap. The fiberglass roof was deteriorating and had micro cracks. I would get fiberglass slivers if I rubbed my had across it. After researching various options, I applied Dicor acrylic fiberglass RV roof sealant and then resealed all the seams. I did all the work myself so it was less than $120 at the time. The roof looked fantastic even after 5 years in the Florida sunshine but I did wash it twice a year to remove accumulated dirt and dust.

I don't have any financial interest in Dicor but can recommend their product. You must follow their instructions to properly clean and apply the product or it might not stick properly. Dicor caulk/sealant sticks very well to their roof sealant.

 

[S.Rodimus]

For what it is worth, I bought my 2003 Winnebago Sunova used with no real RV experience before that. It was a big learning experience for me. As far as I could tell, the previous owner never washed, waxed, or sealed the roof or the seams on the side of the roof and the seams on the front and rear cap. The fiberglass roof was deteriorating and had micro cracks. I would get fiberglass slivers if I rubbed my had across it. After researching various options, I applied Dicor acrylic fiberglass RV roof sealant and then resealed all the seams. I did all the work myself so it was less than $120 at the time. The roof looked fantastic even after 5 years in the Florida sunshine but I did wash it twice a year to remove accumulated dirt and dust.

I don't have any financial interest in Dicor but can recommend their product. You must follow their instructions to properly clean and apply the product or it might not stick properly. Dicor caulk/sealant sticks very well to their roof sealant.

Amen to that! This is also our first rig, and the amount of things we have learned in the past 2 years is enormous. Just what I've learned about roofs the past couple days is kind of astounding, and has greatly informed the questions I've been asking the service center for figuring out what we need/want to do about our roof v. cost and compared to the life left in the RV generally as a whole.

As frustrating as the seemingly money-pit can be, I am still thankful for it all, really.

We are just waiting for a few more bits of info from the service center before we decide how to proceed. That should hopefully come this evening or tomorrow. I will update here accordingly.

 

[RayIN]

There are much lest costly options, and they are not silicone. IMO silicone and RV should never be in the same conversation..
Check out Dicor roof coatings Their products are expensive, but the most dependable on the market IMO.
Second choice would be Henry's roof coating.

 

[creativepart]

IMO silicone and RV should never be in the same conversation..

But surely Ray is fully aware that Winnebago SPECIFIES silicone for all sealants on their RVs. So, perhaps Winnebago has a much different opinion and that should be noted.

 

[S.Rodimus]

Check out Dicor roof coatings Their products are expensive, but the most dependable on the market IMO.
Second choice would be Henry's roof coating.

I have been looking into both of these. Still waiting to get more detail on how many, where exactly, and how bad the soft spots are. Hopefully more info on Tuesday when they re-open. Then we hopefully can decide what sealant (Dicor or ProFlex) to use, as well as whether they or I will be applying which overall coating product.

 

[S.Rodimus]

But surely Ray is fully aware that Winnebago SPECIFIES silicone for all sealants on their RVs. So, perhaps Winnebago has a much different opinion and that should be noted.

This is what's so frustrating. There seems to be no concrete answer to anything. All I want is a roof that's good now and allows me some chance of being able to do spot patches later on.

 

[RayIN]

But surely Ray is fully aware that Winnebago SPECIFIES silicone for all sealants on their RVs. So, perhaps Winnebago has a much different opinion and that should be noted.

I think what W uses is a silicone blend, not pure silicone; and I think they use neutral-cure stuff in the blend.

 

[S.Rodimus]

Alright everyone --

As a final update to this thread, I spoke at length to the service center, as well as with a couple of folks from Geocel (including a regional manager); and even directly with AZ Expert himself. Our due diligence is now complete and we have made a decision on how we wish to proceed.

Here's what I learned:

• "Dicor is a bad choice for a Winnebago roof, silicone coating will work on a Winnebago roof...Winnebago uses silicone lap sealant...dicor won't stick to...silicone coating won't stick to dicor"
  - AZ Expert's own words.
  I do believe he might have thought I was asking about applying new sealant over old sealant without removing the old, though. But still, this is good information.

This is when I questioned the service center about whether or not they were really going to use Dicor, and that's when they said No, they would be using ProFlex. (Sounds like probably Dicor is their standard for non-Winnebago roofs.)

So down the ProFlex rabbit hole I went....

Dicor has 6 RV-specific products.

Speaking to the ProFlex (Geocel) people, I was told that:

• The top 3 products in this photo are essentially the same formulation, just thinned out or with fibers added for different application purposes/methods. They are solvent based and will all stick to each other before or after curing. All three are for making repairs, not for "start from scratch" projects.
• The orange tube in the second row is a newer version of the red tube. (But only the red tube says on their website that it's good for fiberglass (I.e. compatible for Winnebago roofs). I called him back to clarify this, and he said he can't really speak to that specifically but that the red tube -- the one that does say fiberglass on the website -- is their flagship product, so it's probably what everyone uses.
• The two cans in the bottom row are for "coating" roofs after they are fixed. The Silicone product (ProFlex® RV Rubberized Silicone Roof Coating) will stick to itself before or after curing; better still if the old coat gets thoroughly washed, rubbed with acetone for good measure, and maybe roughed up a little before painting the new coat on. He flat out said you can keep doing "thickening" coats forever if you want to.
• As for lifespan, he can only quote for stationary roofs (i.e. houses, not RVs). The Elastomeric gives 10+ years, while the Silicone gives 25+ years. But again, that's for a house, not an RV, and may explain why our service center is only confident telling us that we will get ~5 years.

Now, back to the service center I went to find out exactly which of the ProFlex products they planned to use. They said (and showed me photos of from their store) they would be using the red tube (Pro Flex® RV Flexible Sealant) and the bottom-right blue can (ProFlex® RV Rubberized Silicone Roof Coating) -- exactly what I wanted them to say given everything above that I learned.
And of course they sell ProFlex® RV Rubberized Silicone Roof Coating (and other ProFlex® products) in their store for folks -- like me! -- who want to do repairs (or as the Geocel rep said, add thickening coats) themselves later on.

I also had them provide me with the exact location(s) of the soft spot(s), as well as a photo of the microcracking. Here's how the microcracking looks:

So, given all that, we are going to go ahead with them performing the following:

1. Thoroughly and properly wash the entire roof.
2. Use proper solvent(s) to remove all old seals and any possible silicone residue; including the front and back cap seals, as well as the Winnebago-unique seals at the bottom of each radius.
3. Replace all seals with ProFlex RV Flexible Sealant; including the front and back cap seals, as well as the Winnebago-unique seals at the bottom of each radius.
4. If deemed necessary, cover the front and back cap seals with sealing tape such as Eternabond.
5. Apply ProFlex Silicone Rubberized Roof Coating.

There are always different things people choose to do for different reasons, and no one answer is always the right or only answer. Could we have chosen to use a Dicor roof coating that is formulated specifically with/for fiberglass? Yes. Or gone down the Henry's Tropi-cool path? Sure! But, either of these options means doing all the work ourselves now -- because ProFlex are the products our service center uses (not the others). Where we live, finding a good service center within reasonable driving distance is difficult, and they have been really good to/for us so far -- so after much research, we are confident enough and happy with the plan; and know that it gives us at least some chance to touch up or repair things down the road.

Please bear in mind that this is our first rig, which we bought very used, and for the time being we are happy with a philosophy of "pay a pro to do the work for us." On our next rig (whenever that ends up being), we will apply all we have learned with this one to do a lot more of the work and maintenance ourselves. So, please....no judgment or telling me we're crazy for paying this price for this job. Despite any of its issues, we love this rig and want it to last as long as possible while we continue to use it to learn all the things. For us, letting someone else better equipped actually perform the work that we're getting educated about all along, feels like a good plan -- and we're thankful that we're in a position to be able to do so at all.

 

[Horse54]

I realize this is probably after your decision has been made, but I have some curiosity questions.
1. Did you look into the Flex Armour roofing? I am not sure of the cost, but I hear great things.
2. You said you have soft spots. Maybe I missed it, but what are they doing about those? If they are just going to cover everything, it will not fix the possible water intrusion that has already happened. It will just continue to rot. Actually even faster if you take away the air by sealing it in.

Just my thoughts...good luck.