Micro Minnie FLX Xantrex/Go Power! Parameters

[electric]

I could wire the side port to that second battery. (correct?)

Not directly, there must be a safety breaker in the circuit.
2nd battery is wired directly in parallel to the 1st battery, so both batteries are protected by the big 250A breaker (each battery is also protected by their internal BMSs).
Stock solar controller output (B1 reading on its display) should be wired to a 30A breaker, which is then wired to the big 250A battery breaker.
Your external solar port should be wired the same way, first to a 30A solar breaker, which then goes to the 250A breaker.
Since stock SCC is rated to 30A and wired to a 30A breaker, adding external SCC to the same breaker could trip this breaker if combined solar output exceeds 30A, so the correct solution is to add another 30A breaker between the external port and the main battery breaker.
I tried to draw it in the diagram I found in this thread, hope it makes sense.

 

[SactoSteve-WO]

Suitcase solar distance from Solar on side

I know there were comments regarding this subject but I’m getting frustrated with this boards search function. Something about how to rewire to optimize portable panel positioning. Seems important part of tweaking solar on side usage.

- Steve

 

[creativepart]

There's no doubt that the board's basic software has inadequate search functions. That's a problem of the software used here and at a million other forums. So, it's a given you'll have to accept and move on. The "Google Search " box above is generally better.

But realize that not everything has been detailed in posts here. We wait for people to figure this kind of thing out on their own and then post about it with detailed info.

What is it, specifically, do you want that's not been detailed? Seems what member "Electric" posted above directly answers your question.

 

[SactoSteve-WO]

There was a post recommending a configuration in which one was required to have the suitcase solar very near the trailer but proposed another in which one could have a much greater range of positioning the suitcase. Personally I don’t for see us needing to utilize the solar on side option, so I didn’t give it much attention. But I remember it seems plausible approach, and one folks were/are interested in.

I was/am hoping those involved, or remember, the discussion might bring the specifics up again since this topic seems currently active.

Since I don’t remember the specifics, searching is challenging.

- steve

 

[SactoSteve-WO]

What is the objective in the use of the solar on the side port

I finally found the thread I was trying to locate https://www.winnieowners.com/forums/f260/adding-solar-panel-for-micro-minnie-flx-366078.html#post3938993

The above link/post, in my opinion, speaks to an objective of having a means of alternative/additional solar charge input to the “stock” battery. I believe the the most nominal scenario would be the trailer is parked in the shade but abundant sun is available away from the shade the trailer is in. The post postulates an implementation optimizing the ability to reposition the external solar panel. This, to me, seems like the most basic desire of a FLX owner.

The diagram from “Electric” a couple of posts prior, provides a possible alternative strategy, which to my understanding would not facilitate optimizing the repositioning of the external panel as described in Jim’s post. And maybe that wasn’t its objective.

There are, no doubt, several different objectives in using the solar on the side port and each may have different constraints and benefits in various possible implementations.

It seems to me the most basic unknowns, which shouldn’t be, are how is the SOS port wired, and what was the designers expectation in how the port would be used? A decent schematic of the FLX solar wiring would be essential for anyone to attempt upgrading the stock implementation as well as a more than a superficial knowledge of solar electric systems.

I’m not a EE, but I was a Systems Engineer for 30+ years, and the most important, and least trivial, thing to know is what is the objective.

Unless we can articulate one or two basic objectives I think we may be wasting “Electric’s” time and, tho it doesn’t show, patience.

- steve

 

[electric]

I just replied in that other thread.
Design objective must have been for external panels to always have their own controller and external port to always be wired to the battery thru the safety breaker. Any evidence of PV voltage at the port is likely due to miswired units, which needs fixing, or could be due to an open breaker, where stock controller is sitting at open circuit and open circuit voltage could be close to PV voltage due to controller's inherent design limitations.
Having external panels with their own controller gives truth to the marketing claim that any panel(s) can be used.

 

[SactoSteve-WO]

SOS port, battery and controller readings

Attached picts taken within minutes. 2108 ds FLX. No electrical mods.

I believe this indicates the port is indeed wired to the controller? Rightly or wrongly.

chasing wiring is vexing when the wires are behind the coroplast or in the walls.
Not sure what sequence the photos upload but sos plug wires blk and red connect to red and white going into front bulkhead, seem to appear behind charger?
30 amp breaker below charger.
2 red wires come up from below and connect to 250 amp breaker.

This all seems to be “by design”?


My point in all this is just to collect observations for evaluation and to help folks with an interest in extending the capabilities of the FLX line somewhat on the same page in our discussions.

-steve

 

[electric]

I believe this indicates the port is indeed wired to the controller? Rightly or wrongly.

Yes, definitely wired to the PV side of the stock controller, which I believe is not by design, rather a manufacturing mistake.
I don't recommend to use it as-as, even if you find panels with matching voltage, it won't be most efficient as 2 sets of panels will work against each other due to mismatch in amount of sunlight, different angles, shades, etc.
In this specific case I recommend to rewire the port to the battery, adding a new breaker at the same time, then pick panel kit with controller, or separate panels and controller.

 

[Downytide]

Fellas, so I'm not the only one with this problem from ****.

I've been waiting for an answer from WGO for almost 2 weeks, but the repair shop have spoken to WGO/Lithionics and found out apparently something with the solar system is causing the overcharging with at least one more known case.

So to recap
- This trailer has blown 2 inverters, both time caused huge smoke.
- Overcharged 2 batteries.
- Various electrical components failure, control panels, stereo, slide out controller.
- It blew 40amp trailer fuse on the truck

All this happen without the trailer being plugged into shore power, simply just turn the battery on and the breaker on, and within 20mins or so I'd get over voltage warnings and things just blow up.

The repair shop has found various bad grounds and harness that literately had screws go through them.

 

[SactoSteve-WO]

Any coordination with GoPower!?

- steve

 

[Downytide]

As far as I know, the Gopower controller may no be the culprit right now, it may be a fault of something else along the system, the issue with this whole process is a a tic tac toe, WGO doesn't tell me anything, thank God the repair shop is keeping me in the loop but can't proceed with repair/diagnostic until WGO/Lithionics get back to them on next step.

My frustration is well documented in the locked thread.

 

[KJ2108FLX]

Steve: I have been following your posts. I have a 2022 2108 DS FLX. I did a full check of the system, isolating each equipment. I have also added disconnects on the MPPT Power as well as the solar panels in order to isolate them, which I recommend. I have the same observations as you, and today I found that the GOPOWER MPPT Power input is coming from the TONGUE Battery lead Acid standard ! This was a surprise and answers a few questions and adds a few going forward. Try disconnecting the Tongue Battery and see what happens to the MPPT. By the way, when I only have the Toungue battery connected and all other power sources disconnected (Xantrex, Solar, MPPT, Black breaker, Blue Light, Truck, Shore Power ALL OFF) I am getting strange voltages at the Black Breaker. With only the battery connected, the lower connected is 1.86 volts and the upper connector is 9.19 volts - this across the Black Breaker in the OFF position.


A few more experiments to run, including some AMP readings, but there is some kind of bypass that I have yet to trace. Also not sure why the Gopower is connected through the tongue battery, but in the past it has charged the Lithionics.

Tanks for your observations

 

[SactoSteve-WO]

Try disconnecting the Tongue Battery and see what happens to the MPPT.

Thanks for your observations!
I have no idea what a tongue battery is?

-steve

 

[KJ2108FLX]

Steve: There is a standard lead acid battery just in back of the propane tanks on the "tongue" of the trailer on the outside. This is the conventional location for battery supply and would load the trailer lights, brakes, and any standard 12 volt in a non lithionics battery supplied trailer.

I unscrewed the negative terminal lug and the MPPT finally went off. That looks like the power supply for the MPPT. Why ? I dont know yet, but I am thinking some un-necessary voltage adjustment there and not true for the Lithionic input.

It also looks like I have a "fault" fropm tht system that carries charge over to the system and may be your phantom connection.

Let me know what you find !

Cheers

 

[SactoSteve-WO]

Ahh, the “phantom” connection is just the solar feed to the “bottom” of the big disconnect breaker. It will “back feed” the 12 V service during daylight when the lithionic battery is off, or off and disconnected. Considered “nominal” but serves no useful purpose, but considered not a problem.

The Tongue battery has to be somebodies modification (origional owner? dealer service dept?). As far as I’ve seen FLX were not delivered with this Battery.

-steve

 

[KJ2108FLX]

Steve: many thanks. My FLX is one of the first from Winnebago. I got it at the Tampa Show when they first introduced and was the Demonstration model from the show. I did not realize that later models eliminated the conventional battery from the tongue. I will check that with W for sure. Many thanks.

 

[Downytide]

Repair shop finally got all the parts, only took.......... 5 months.

Steve, one thing they've noticed which you've also mentioned in the earlier post is that 12v stays on with solar, even when the battery is shut off and main breaker is off, has this ever caused an issue with you?

Repair shop is baffle by this and believe this may have caused the issue of blowing up the inverter, and they want to install a switch from the solar controller to the battery, so when it's full or in storage mode, everything can be truly power off.

 

[KJ2108FLX]

Folks:

Literally just got back from checking power supply connections on my FLX. It has 2 batteries, the Lithionics and a Lead Acid battery on the tongue. I have disconnects now on the Solar and MPPT power connections so I can isolate each function. The Gopower MPPT is connected to the lead Acid Battery, and when I disconnect the LA battery it goes dead, without the solar on. However, when I switch on the Solar cells it powers up, so it looks to be self powering through solar connection.

I have one more disconnect to put on the Lead Acid Tongue battery so I can fully isolate the stored energy systems (LA and Lithionics batteries) from the entire system. Without the LA battery disconnect, it was feeding into trailer, probably through the Gopower conenections or faulting ground somewhere. I know have all disconnects off and the LA battery disconnected / unscrewed for a full shut.

Industrially, I am used to effective LOTO, and am disappointed in how the FLX is laid out with virtually no isolation on the stored power systems. I also am skeptic on electrical systems, which is why EE's like to work with me.

Next step: Disconnect for the LA battery.

 

[SactoSteve-WO]

My FLX is one of the first from Winnebago. I got it at the Tampa Show when they first introduced and was the Demonstration model from the show.

That’s kinda cool.

Seems to me winnebago ought to have been interested in your first impressions and experiences.
- steve

 

[Downytide]

That’s kinda cool.

Seems to me winnebago ought to have been interested in your first impressions and experiences.
- steve

That requires some form of planning at WGO, the repair shop tried to reach back to the fella from earlier and found out he was an intern, they tried to reflect back their concerns and there's no one there to talk to.

One thing we've noticed, when changing setting on the GoPower, it doesn't save, the moment battery is selected as Lithium, it has all the presets, but when changing them it'll change battery type to User, GoPower is not sure why and this is a brand new controller and panel, anyone had same issue?