Help! I believe I have made a horrible decision

[Bzerull]

Just purchased a 2001 Winnebago Itasca Spirit 24’ class C with just under 28000 miles. Beautiful new interior with almost new tires. Paid $19,800. Owner said everything worked. My mistake was believing them.

Tried to run water through the system, nothing works, toilet does flush. I am convinced that this motorhome, comming from California to Wisconsin in January was never winterized. So far I have exposed most of the plumbing, but haven’t yet found the main leak, which is in the back, coming out under the chassis. I have hooked up to the city water connection, haven’t even attempted to try the on board water system. How much damage do you think I am looking at? I assume all fixtures, water heater, water pump and maybe more. What would you do at this point? I have driven it 250 miles and the chassis seems fine. Ford V10 engine. One of the dumbest decisions of my life, because i believed what seemed to be a very nice person. I am not new to rv’s but i am new to motor homes. Thank you for any input you can offer.

 

[Romer1]

Download the manual here:
https://www.winnebago.com/owners/owner-resources/manuals-and-diagrams/operator-manuals/2001


Go to the Spirit manual and then go to section 7 to locate all the valves for the water system.

 

[Morich]

I would not quit yet as the fixtures and appliances are not as likely to be broken as fittings or lines. Looking at your profile, says you might live in really hard freeze country but that doesn't mean it all broke because the first point that breaks can also begin to drain things!
For sorting out how bad, I would start with looking at the tiny little plastic filter on the water pump as an indicator! If it is not broken, the system most likely had some draining done!
The traps can also indicate what they did/did not do as they should hold water and if they are split, it can indicate a total lack of care!
From there, I would replace it if a pretty cheap item before I begin with the pressure system as a way to sort where and what is broken.
One biggie to check first is the holding tanks as I consider broken holding tanks fatal! Just way too much time trouble and certainly expensive to replace them!

The manuals can be a big help or really leave us confused, so I like to combine them with the parts and plumbing drawings as a way to look where they mean when they may only mention a rear compartment!
Parts here:
https://catalog3d.winnebagoind.com/menu/Parts.htm
But for plumbing, I tend to find more specific here:
https://www.winnebago.com/Files/Files/Winnebago/Resources/Diagram/2001/01_324v_plumb.pdf

Do a little thinking to avoid having so many drips or leaks that you can't tell which way the water is coming out where you see it. How you start on avoiding too much "wet all over" is personal choice but I do suggest going slow and thinking which section to put water in first.
The black tank can be one that is not too involved as you can add water with a hose or bucket at the stool and then the only way out is the black water drain or leaks!
Since the fresh water system is the most complex, with lots of lines going many directions, it may be better to wait until you verify the big deal killers!

If the gravity flow has a gravity feed, I might add half tank to it as a test of that expensive item. If the bottom or side of the tank is split, I back off and would consider quitting!
But it might also just be the fitting at the nearest connection, so I would verify before punting!

About my first 5-6 RV were things that nobody wanted and some were real bargains that were reasonably easy to repair.
Be mentally prepped for the worst but also look for the better deal as there is still a chance!

 

[Bzerull]

Thank you very much. I don’t believe the tanks are split. Based on your suggestions, i am going to do some investigating.

 

[Morich]

One of the biggie, I have learned on RV water is how confusing it can be as it works different than home plumbing!
In a house the water leaks and runs in a consistent direction, normally downhill!
But when we move ab RV, downhill can be different every day, so it can mean water runs out the left one day and the leak out the right may be the same leak, just running a different direction!
A leak dripping on top of a tank can set there and may you think all is fine but when you move the RV a day later, you can find a leak coming out in some spot where there IS no water line????

I got really handy at using strips of paper towel about an inch wide as indicators of which way water was running across the floor!

One other biggie was learning not to get so much water leaking out that I could not say if it was coming out of a drain or out of a supply!
Try to only let one or the other be a possible leak!
That's why I suggest checking the holding tanks pretty near the start as they are much less complex. Once you feel you can trust them, you can have fewer head scratching stress!
The drain is not much pressure but the pressure water can do weird things like spray water up on top of a tank! Once you find water standing near the fitting where the vent goes into the TOP of the grey water holding tank, you can get really confused!
A trained mouse to go look would be nice but now that I'm no longer chasing leaks as much, I might consider one of the long scopes to fit on a cell phone that can be threaded back into places I can't see?

 

[Romer1]

I suggested the valve locations because the main water tank valve is under the bed and could possibly be open,

 

[Morich]

I suggested the valve locations because the main water tank valve is under the bed and could possibly be open,

Yes, definitely agree that this valve needs to be closed. Maybe I skipped over saying to close all drain valves you know about as first step?

Click to get better view!


This communications stuff is harder than it looks and things can get skipped!

 

[RayIN]

Take a deep breath and calm down, Richard is excellent with Winnebago drawings and schematics. He'll guide you through how to deal with the plumbing system in logical steps.

 

[Bzerull]

I have a rear kitchen in mine and the fresh water holding tank is under the sink. I have since found the valves under a removal panel in this area. Operation of the water system is similar to my RV trailer(much newer) just a little more challenging finding the valves.

 

[Bzerull]

I have looked at a lot of the plumbing drawings and they are not always easy to figure out.
I have since found I have this situation: When I connect water to the city water inlet, water flows out one of the tubes at the bottom of the fresh water tank. I believe the tank is less than 1/4 full. I know the fresh water tank fill is outside rear of my unit. Why does city water fill dump out a lower (drain/overfill) tube? Is there a control valve somewhere inside that directs the city water to more than one source? Your input is tremendously appreciated.

 

[Romer1]

Sounds like an open water line drain used for winterizing.
Looking at brochures, I can't find any Spirit with a rear kitchen.

 

[Morich]

One biggie to know on any line that comes out underneath where you can see it! Those will almost always be drains and it means a valve is still open!
The owners manual should have a section listing the valve locations but sometimes not as clear as we need. So we can look underneath to spot the drain and the valve will often be just above that! The valve is kept inside where it is less likely to freeze but close.
In your case, it may not be the tank drain but what is called a "low point drain" that is placed to drain lines.

Note? Fully agree that the drawings for that year group are not the best. RV info seems to change and some gets far better, while some gets worse!
In the after 2010 group, we get interactive type drawings that are great as we can turn the RV all around, look over, under and through to see what we need!
But at the same time they made that great upgrade, they dropped the wire by wire schematic drawings for electrical!

It will take a look at the owners manual to tell which type valves and what it takes but there is often a selector valve on the water that lets us choose where the water goes, into the tank or normal use in the RV. Some RV only have the pipe we call gravity feed to fill the tank but many later models have the selector valve.

One point that will be needed is making sure we are looking at the correct drawings! Your profile shows it as a 24 foot but is that pointing us to the correct model? Is that 24 foot based on the actual model number or just a kinda/sorta description of the RV?
There should be a label near the driver with the correct model number and that would let us look for the correct info with more confidence that we were right!

To get the right info we need to start with the right year, make and model or floorplan as that is the way they are filed for lookup! I've been looking at the 24 foot model but that doesn't seem to match what you are finding , so I like to confirm! Can you spot which you have?

Then to get the right drawing we need to know which options your RV has as it changes the fresh tank location and plumbing. The options change with the bed and dinette type/locations, so you will have to compare what you have to find which sheet of drawings to use!


This is based on looking at the 24 foot model but if that is not the correct model, we need to start over. Option 49X is different than if you have option 439 or the Canadian option 33R!
There should have been a sheet listing the options in the info pack but those are often lost over the years with different owners, so we have to look harder!

 

[Bzerull]

The model # on the door of my motorhome is none that are listed.
It is IF324F.
This is where i get hung up. Can't find this and it is a winnebago label.

 

[Bzerull]

I called Winnebago and just made a very important discovery. I have a 2001 Ford chasis, but my motor home is a 2002! I guess this is not an unusual situation, but i never thought of this. Now I have the correct manuals and diagrams. Should be a tremendous help.

 

[Morich]

It's one of the little known facts that we often find missing!
Reading the owners manual does tell us a lot about things that we need to know. Things like the label next to the drivers side which tells us about what we have!
A good place for anybody to start is finding out what they have to use and repair and that label gives that information!

With the right info we can look at the correct drawings and it is also nice in this case that the 2002 drawing is much more easily read!

Looking at page one of the plumbing drawings, I see a point that may need some added info on how they draw things up?
On that page 1, there is a marker for a more detailed view and they show where that view will be "looking" from. Two letters, A-A in this case with a line between them? That tells you there is a detailed drawing labeled " detail A-A" somewhere on this set of drawings and they are normally either on that sheet of next.

When looking at sheet 1 and come to the "furball" that you can't read, that is time to go looking for Detail A-A to get a better look!
Click to get a look at a very bad drawing!

No way to tell where that goes, so go to sheet 2 and find detail AA for a better look.


Still not great but we can see some better? The blue line is coming from the pressure water fill port, past several uses like shower and vanity and then apears to go past or through the furball and turn into the tank?
See valve one marked in green? It looks like a diverter valve that sends water on into the tank or if turned the other way it sends water up and some place other than the tank!.
Just guessing that if the valve 1 is set wrong water goes into the tank and if valve 2 is also left open, the water just goes into the tank and out the tank drain like I marked in red!
Some of this is guessing and needs tested as the drawing is NOT a good one but I think these two valves are the current problem and to use pressure water, one close the tank drain after it fills, then also change valve one and I fell like that will let water go to the faucets, etc.

Maybe you can get a better idea of what the furball might be and try this idea to see what works? I might guess the furball is the water pump but that is without looking further! If you can see the pump, check the little filter is in place and not frozen!

I wish you luck and just keep butting that dam and it will break through at some point!
Some of us even write down some notes so we can remember for the next season!!

 

[Bzerull]

Thank you for your input. I am positive the furball is the water pump. Shouldn't the water pump and fresh water source work automatically depending on which source I choose without flipping valves? I know that's how my travel trailer works.

I am now pretty sure that the low point drain is most definitely open. You have been a big help Richard.

 

[wahoonc]

Thank you for your input. I am positive the furball is the water pump. Shouldn't the water pump and fresh water source work automatically depending on which source I choose without flipping valves? I know that's how my travel trailer works.

I am now pretty sure that the low point drain is most definitely open. You have been a big help Richard.

On every unit I have ever owned there is a valve by the hose inlet you flip for city water or to fill the water tank. The pump when switched on pulls water from the tank. I have seen a few very high end units that had an auto pressure switch for the water pump, you turned on a faucet and it would automatically turn the pump on. Most units you have to switch the pump on then it will cycle when you turn a faucet on.

Aaron

 

[Morich]

Yes, I would expect the water pump to be able to draw water from the tank when all the valves are correct. I have never seen one which required valve changes to be made when switching from pressure to pump.
But that is part of what needs to be looked at. When fighting trouble, I have to go one step at a time to avoid having such a huge problem I can't think!

If the water is running out underneath, I do not worry how to set valves or if the pump even works until I find how to keep water in the tank and not running on the ground!

Just by the nature of things, the pump will move air much easier than water. It will not build the pressure needed to pull or push water through the pipes if it can draw air!

I would start with picking some item to fix first. For me, it you know you have water running out, that would be a really big issue as it stops all other operations!

The pump nor pressure water can build pressure or suction to move water correctly if there is a leak for air to enter, whether it is an actual pipe leak or a valve open.
To push water put to a faucet that is higher than the pump, it has to build pressure and that is not possible if it can just blow it out underneath!
It is much like filling a barrel. It is nearly impossible to fill the barrel if there is a big hole in the bottom as the water just runs out!
No point in trying to get water into the RV if there is a big hole in the bottom!
Thought about how to set the other valves is not a high priority if you can't keep water in the pipes!

I usually don't even look at the pump pressure and how it works until I have the pressure side working as it is so much simpler. No electrical questions, no funky little things like rust stopping it from running and all I have to do is hook up the hose and start sorting the problems.
Step one is keeping water in the RV and that shows up real quick and easy with the pressure water, so I go there and fix that!
When I was doing most of my RV buying, repairing, and swapping, I did not have the benefits of internet or online manuals to study and guide me.

With manuals to tell me how to set valves and drawings to find where the lines go, it is now just a matter of getting the mind together to look at where the water has to come in and how it gets from that point to the next!
I may not understand what the manuals says the first time but the lines will only have a very limited number of options.
Like being a cornfield maze, if one path doesn't get me where I want to go, I have to back up and choose the other path! If we start at the inlet and find where that water goes, at the first valve, it will only have two options to follow, right or wrong! That is where I have to look at one thing at a time and only change one valve at a time.
It's possible you will find broken pipes or fittings, so my first move is to keep water in the RV! Then I want to see water come out at the right places like the faucets. Last thing is getting parts like the water heater and pump to work as they are the more complex things that involve so many more parts like switches, settings, and controls.
No need to worry about them if I can't keep water in the pipes and tank.

I call it efficient to put off the tough stuff and not do it until I get there!
My wife thinks I'm avoiding work!

 

[Bzerull]

Very good suggestions on the plumbing trouble shooting steps. Winnebago has a terrific source of parts/diagrams for the age of my motor home. With regards to the parts, do they still offer these parts for sale, or is this just for reference?

 

[Morich]

The parts list can be used for specific part numbers and we can often order them or find them at a local RV parts store. However, it is often much better to find what type and part it is and go to a local store like Home Depot to get the same part but not made or sold for RV specific use! Things for RV are often twice as high as the same part for your house!
If you find a broken 1/2 inch elbow of some type like PVC, that part can often be near half price if we go to the local store. Some parts like the tank and water pump ARE only found on RV but most of the lines are the normal stuff we find used in houses. Not the copper or steel pipe used in houses but often PVC or some form of plastic is the same as houses.
Drain pieces like a trap are common items but the big waste drain valve is RV item only!

If I have to have a part from RV only, I can sometimes find it or it can also be a search to find some leftover item if the RV is too old.
I often take the broken piece off and take it with me to ask or compare to some other part that does the same thing and fits the other parts I have.

If it HAS to be RV stuff and I have the part number from a list, I do an online search for that part number and hope to find it cheaper. Sometimes they wind up on places like E-bay where somebody is selling it as salvage or he ordered the wrong part!
I like to shop in person so I can see the new part fits on the end of the others!