1998 Minnie Winnie Water Pump

TowerRat · 11-25-2020, 11:18 AM

Ok, so I felt I needed a few new challenges, and decided that a 22 year old Winnebago should fit the bill.... quit laughing.....

Today’s challenge, no water pump. City water supply is fine, filled the fresh water tank, planning on sanitizing it (RV has been sitting for about 3 years), turned on the water pump, red light shows for pump on my control pane, but NO pump noises. All faucets are opened, pump switch activated while I had my head near the pump, no noise.

I’m ready to test at the pump for 12v DC, but the location is an issue. (see pics) It’s in the back storage bay, on a shelf, under the middle of the coach. My 6’2” 225 body CANNOT get all the way up in there. I was hoping it was accessible via under bed opening, but the floor appears to be plywood over aluminum (pic from below at the pump shows no opening).

1. Anybody know of a secret access for the old Minnie Winnies?
2. How many fuses do I need to check, one in main breaker box, but I understand there is one normally within 12” of the pump?

Any help is greatly appreciated, so is any humor to get me through this......

BTW the last pic was taken by sticking my arm up there, my head wouldn’t fit much less the rest of me......

**Eagle5** · 11-29-2020, 01:23 PM

Hi TowerRat,
I was waiting for somebody else who had actually done this to comment back, but no luck. It appears that this location is a truly bad design decision on Winnebago's part. I would carefully go through the fuse panels and hope like crazy it is just a fuse problem. If it isn't a fuse, then look for a child who is mechanically gifted.
Good luck on this one.
Welcome to the Forum.
Eagle5

Morich · 11-29-2020, 06:27 PM

I see a meter, so I might suggest a different way to test, rather than getting to the pump itself.
Are you up on testing to be able to spot 12 volt battery that goes to the pump, but testing at the switches? I've got a feeling that it will be there but the switches are suspect for defective or open wiring.
Two big questions to make this idea work, though! One is if you know of a 12 VDC power outlet near where a TV might be mounted? Also do you know where there are more than one water pump switch? I think I'm reading on the drawing that there are at least two but there may be more. Like one at the monitor panel and likely one/two other places like the bathroom or an outside shower where one might be prone to wanting to turn the water on without going inside?
This drawing:
http://www.winnebagoind.com/diagram/1998/126974.pdf
On sheet three and about the middle of the page, we find this portion which I cut and pasted. If you can get enough wire out of the wall, the wire ID should be printed on the wire side as the last two or three letters and described in this chart:
https://www.winnebagoind.com/diagram...ical_guide.pdf
Click the picture to make it easier to read, if not going to the main drawing.
What I find is that wire JA is from the breaker to the pump switch and other things like the outlet for the TV power I mentioned. JP is the ground and at the switch, FJ and FK go to another switch. FJ and FK may be 12V or not, depending on how the other end of the three way circuit is left, so check all for power when you have it open.
My thought runs like this! If you find the right outlet for the possible TV and it has power, then the switches are more likely to be the trouble, not the breaker as it is the same feed. Reading power at that outlet should be fairly easy as it is likely just a "cigarette lighter" plug and the center pin should have power, if not, check for the breaker tripped idea.
If there is power there, then I would move to the pump switches and look for power but that can get a bit tricky as they are wired like a house that has more than one switch to control a light. Gets tricky as there are different ways the power flows depending on which switch is on or off. Not as simple as the normal single switch wiring.
This power does go through multiple places where cables are plugged together but those are often very solid and I "feel" less likely to go open than a wire at a switch. ALSO----lots harder to find, get to and test!
So look for the easy way and see if it gets you the right answer without calling out the 12 year old!

TowerRat · 11-30-2020, 08:11 AM

Thanks guys. Over the weekend, I SQUEEZED my fat butt up in the hole and took the pump out, tested the purple wire and got 13v when activating the galley switch. Got no sound out of the pump when I had the wife moving the switch. Replaced the Shurflo with a Flojet, and replumbed it to be in front of the hole (SO proud of myself). Turned on the switch ...... and nothing ....... rechecked the wiring, apparently, my green wire is NOT grounded......

I WAS currently recovering from getting some toes amputated (diabetes, it happens) but NOW I will have to pull my foot outta my &$$ ........ so, back in the hole to chase the wires today.... again, thanks.

**Eagle5** · 11-30-2020, 10:33 AM

Hi Bill,
Glad that you have found the ground problem; it should now be easy to get it under control. When you are all done, it would be nice to see a photo of your new pump mounting location. Think thin and have fun!
Eagle5

ground control

**Eagle5** · 11-30-2020, 10:40 AM

Actually, this version of the song is the best:

Walter Mitty

JoeC · 12-02-2020, 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eagle5

If it isn't a fuse, then look for a child who is mechanically gifted.
Eagle5

Great idea! Or maybe a dwarf or "little person", whatever is acceptable these days. Good Luck! And pray it's just a blown fuse. But then, why did the fuse blow in the first place?

Take the bed frame apart? Apparently it was installed before the bed frame. That's all I have.

Mine is under the bed frame removeable panel, that I put a piano hinge on (take note for all of you newer Mini owners), under the mattress. Much easier than your setup but still not a walk in the park.

elynne · 12-03-2020, 06:00 AM

sounds like you may be in for a big challenge as we are with our 1998 mini winnie. We have practically rebuilt from scratch up on this baby. Had to replace ceiling, flooring and all water lines due to one leak after another :( . Slowly but surely getting there after many tears and sleepless night [every stormy night]. Good luck to you and would appreciate prayers for our sanity!

**creativepart** · 12-03-2020, 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TowerRat

Turned on the switch ...... and nothing ....... rechecked the wiring, apparently, my green wire is NOT grounded......

Just a thought, can’t the green wire be grounded anywhere? Since you moved the pump isn’t the red (positive) wire switched and the green is a chassis ground?? No need to go chase the green wire to anyplace specific, I’d think.

Morich · 12-03-2020, 08:14 AM

But the green wire should be very short and easy to chase as it is tied on a bus bar really close.

TowerRat · 12-03-2020, 08:34 AM

Yep, that’s what I realized at 2am this morning. I have the electrical drawings for a 429WS (Thank you Morich) and it shows the water pump green going straight to vehicle ground. I had been worried that it went to other devices, then Ground. So today, which looks like a good day, I’m going to wire direct to the chassis.

For JoeC, I WISH I could get at it through the bed frame, but on mine, the floor above the pump appears to be a solid sheet of metal, then plywood, then NEW carpet...... New carpet in a 22 year old Minnie Winnie makes me kinda suspicious.

For ELynne, what model have you guys got? My 431WQ only appears to have the one water pump switch on the kitchen panel, have you got another switch in the wet bay or anywhere else?

Thanks everyone for the thoughts and help, it makes ya love being part of this community!

TowerRat · 12-03-2020, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morich

But the green wire should be very short and easy to chase as it is tied on a bus bar really close.

Ya’d think so, huh? Followed it thru 3/4s of the vehicle, under the grey tank, around the black, OVER the gas tank and finally to the kitchen..... can’t find any issues with it, but lost sight of it multiple times. Most of my green wires appear to end up on a post behind my steps, I haven’t found a true Ground Bar yet, but I ain’t no quitter, I’m still lookin’. I’m hooking the pump to the chassis today, but I’m real curious as to where the original problem came from.

This unit had been sitting for two - three years, through 2 owners that were clueless, when I bought it. I’m trying to fix every little issue, but the neglect took its toll. Once I solve this problem, the next most major issue is a three way Norcold Fridge that only works on 110v..... getting close.

My current plan is a short overnight test run, then Florida for Christmas! (I’m only 30 miles from the Fla line, so it’s not a HUGE trip!)

Morich · 12-03-2020, 09:40 AM

Is it not at the location shown on the drawing? I've not been able to pull up the wiring for the last few days but I thought it indicated in some location near the rear wheelwell??
click the picture to get a better view.
Okay, I see the flaw. Without full details on which 98 model Minneie, I had chosen the wrong one. This should get you better info:

Van · 12-03-2020, 12:53 PM

I am not laughing. I just bought a 1974 Winnebago travel trailer...

TowerRat · 01-02-2021, 08:47 AM

Okay, again, Thanks Everybody! I’ve worked my way through almost everything, the original problem WAS the ground wire, and going straight to the chassis fixed it. I’ve kept the FloJet and it worked flawlessly on my Christmas run to Pasco County. The propane for my fridge started working on it’s own (Thank you Luck!) and the only issues all week were toilet related.

I had replaced an annoying throne with a Dometic 310 and the hand sprayer was leaking when I wasn’t watching. Turned out to be a loose fitting on the sprayer itself, tightened right up. THEN, on the day of departure, got an overflow. Remember, this thing had set for over 3 years, with 2 clueless owners, and the “pile” was very built up. Apparently nobody (including me) has run a full cleaning cycle on the tanks in a LONG time, so I’m fixing that now with Borax and Dawn.

So ALMOST everything is working perfectly, and I have apparently been able to turn a $8k horror show (my wife’s original description) into a fully working Happy Lilypad!

Morich · 01-02-2021, 10:08 AM

Good to hear it is mostly working but that is kind of temporary on most RV!
So a thought for the future may be helpful. To explain what I was talking about on using the drawing info, this is my method on the Winnebago drawings.

We have the drawing that shows the water pump has two wires, JY and JS and then going to the Wire ID chart we find JY is the ground as well as the note of where that ground bar is located (chassis rail near battery compartment) so with the info that we need to find wire JY at the ground bar near the battery compartment and with the wires labeled, we should be able to spot the wire and check if it connected on that bar!
While at that bar, if one is corroded, what about the others? Do they needed cleaned up , too, to avoid the next wire going open?

No need to trace it all through the RV as most cases of trouble will be at the connections!

Wire ID chart here:

https://www.winnebago.com/Files/File...ical_guide.pdf

Example of the wire ID on wires

Slinky57 · 02-07-2021, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TowerRat

Ok, so I felt I needed a few new challenges, and decided that a 22 year old Winnebago should fit the bill.... quit laughing.....

Today’s challenge, no water pump. City water supply is fine, filled the fresh water tank, planning on sanitizing it (RV has been sitting for about 3 years), turned on the water pump, red light shows for pump on my control pane, but NO pump noises. All faucets are opened, pump switch activated while I had my head near the pump, no noise.

I’m ready to test at the pump for 12v DC, but the location is an issue. (see pics) It’s in the back storage bay, on a shelf, under the middle of the coach. My 6’2” 225 body CANNOT get all the way up in there. I was hoping it was accessible via under bed opening, but the floor appears to be plywood over aluminum (pic from below at the pump shows no opening).

1. Anybody know of a secret access for the old Minnie Winnies?
2. How many fuses do I need to check, one in main breaker box, but I understand there is one normally within 12” of the pump?

Any help is greatly appreciated, so is any humor to get me through this......

BTW the last pic was taken by sticking my arm up there, my head wouldn’t fit much less the rest of me......

TowerRat--If it makes you feel better, we have a 2001 427P that we love and it's been great ( with proper care and feeding, of course). 90,000 miles so far. And yes, it was a PITA, but I took the time and moved our water pump which was mounted in a spot similar to yours. Safe travels and enjoy your Winnie! --Slink