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Old 01-29-2008, 11:00 AM   #41
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DAVE: Very well stated and well written. You chronicled what took place in the automobile business and described exactly what is happening in the RV business today, with out any hint of reform yet. Nice post.
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Old 01-29-2008, 11:17 AM   #42
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Although this discussion has pretty much run its course, I was wondering if someone was going to bring up Dr. Deming and his work with the Japaneese to improve the quality of their manufacturing sector.

During my 33 years in management at Hewlett-Packard, we spent a great deal of time and effort studying Dr. Deming's work and even hired him as a consultant many years ago. It's true that he attributes >85% of a business' outcome to the system rather than the performance of individuals and that the responsibility for this rests with management.

While I share some of the concerns about the quality of new coaches, I personally don't see this as anything but a management issue.

Philip Crosby published a book in the 70s called "Quality is Free" where he points out that it is much cheaper to create a quality product the first time than it is to ship shoddy quality and rework it later. This is really where I see the leadership at some coach manufacturers missing an opportunity to set themselves apart by creating a closed loop quality control and improvement system which could be funded by reduced wty claims.

Maybe I should come out of retirement and do some consulting...
Rick, Nancy, Peanut & Lola our Westie Dogs & Bailey the Sheltie.

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Old 01-29-2008, 11:19 AM   #43
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I am going to make one more observation and then be done with it. It seems on this Winnebago forum any more you just do not dare be very critical of Winnebago, even if it is constructive. Some one always seems to make it personal. I know brand loyalty is kicking in. I have one and would buy another, but never another new one. This forum did not used to be this way. I have been with it for a long time back when Warpath started it. We used to kick the wheels off in hopes some progressive change would occur. Now we flame each other. Not going to get us where we need to go. IMHO
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Old 01-29-2008, 01:01 PM   #44
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Homer, as you may have seen, I've taken the time to make some edits...

We are certainly ALL entitled to our own opinions, even some non-constructive ones toward a manufacturer are expected....
I've heard personally from representatives of Winnebago and know for a fact they read these forums.
I've also been told on SEVERAL occasions they understand there will be negative posts and they DO read those as well...

As stated in the rules, "differences of opinion are expected", but at no time will we ever allow those "differences of opinion" to lead to "personal attacks" of any kind against any member, moderator or admin member.

We sincerely appreciate ALL the support of each and every member, all we ask is that each member abide by the rules.

THANK YOU ALL for your continued support.


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Old 01-29-2008, 03:27 PM   #45
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REBELSBEACH: I know you do your best on editing. I also in no way meant to infer that Winnebago Inc. in any way influenced the negative and personal attacks that have developed in the past year or two. I am positive they have no part in these at all. However, having said that, they have not paid much attention to the complaints, or improved QC, it seems to get worse.
We have a different breed of adventurers today. They are not campers as much as they are RV owners with big investments. They are more affluent than previous road vagabonds and lack the comradery we used to enjoy. JMHO
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Old 01-29-2008, 07:33 PM   #46
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Janjanjan:
Well, we're out traveling for 2 months again, and as usual, every week something major breaks on this 2.5 year old Adventurer.

Another year or so and your rig will be perfect ... One thing I have wondered about - has some group done research on is which items fail more over other available options? What are the statistics? For example the automatic awning - this is one option I have questioned. I worry that it would get stuck out. The manual awning is easy to setup. But what is the failure data say? How about automatic water and electric shore connections reels, the automatic gen start, and the auto pointing sat dish. It would be great to see the actual stats on MTBF and MTBR. It seems the more simple the system the better off we are for things that are RV specific. Things such as TV's, DVD's, etc. are complex but have high crossover so other markets have made them solid.
02 Itasca Horizon 34HD FL XC Chassis/CAT 3126 330HP, 05 Explorer, Falcon II bar, ReadyBreak.
Toys: 6x12 enclosed, YZ250FX, YZ250, KTM250XC, XR80, Regal LSR 2100
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Old 01-29-2008, 08:46 PM   #47
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Winnebago, along with all the other motorhome manufacturers need to really take a look at quality control. This is not much to ask.

On a separate note, I did blame Winnie on a major problem I had when I first bought my current motorhome, but it turned out that the dealer was at fault, and I regret blaming Winnebago and bashing them.

The times where I have had problems with Winnebago, the service guys on the Winnebago Service line helped me with my problems, and worked with me to solve the issues.

On one hand, I do have an issue that some people actually take GLEE in driving to Forest City for repairs, and that shouldn't be happening if our local dealers were taking care of their customers. On the other hand, I'm glad that Winnebago allows factory service work....I just wonder how much longer they will provide this service.
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