Beginner questions - Solar boondocking a micro minnie

[Marine359]

You can connect a second panel in parallel easily using a mc4 “y” connector. It’s plug and play. All you have to do is get a second panel that approximately matches the first panel’s output voltage.

The Victron is Bluetooth. And, I’m real happy with my Victron Bluetooth Smart Shunt battery monitor. Their Smart CCs use the same app. Plus Victron is generally regarded as the best quality of any electrical component maker. Mppt will charge much faster than pwm. Pwm controllers are dirt cheap. You can buy a 10a Pwm controller for less than $20. Easy to see why WBGO used that Pwm. Kinda like they do by using cheap tires. Swapping your CC should be easy-peasy. Just make sure you disconnect panel at gland before working on wires in the pass thru.

[Fred 2106DS]

Originally Posted by Marine359

Thanks Fred,
I’m thinking maybe one 100w fixed panel on roof, and one of the new Renogy lightweight 100w suitcase. If the panels are electrically similar, I should be able to wire them into the pass thru to a 1/2/both/off disconnect switch, then wire the switch to CC then to my Blue Sea spade fuse block. We have low power demands when boondocking, except our compressor fridge consumes 25-30 ah/day. Battery is big enough to go for a week with no genny if I can replace 30 ah per day. I don’t want to park MM in sun to collect the ah needed. Do you think the lightweight suitcase will give me enough if placed in the sun? You tubers say it delivers 5 amps.

Jim, The rating for my 100 watt mono-crystalline panel is 5.7 A / 17.7 V under ideal conditions, assuming you have full sun for 5 hours a day you should get close to the 30 Ah you are looking for.

[Fred 2106DS]

Originally Posted by jwiebe

My 2100BH came with 100W solar pre-installed (GoPower). It has the GP-PWM-10-SQ solar controller installed in the pass-through storage compartment. Do you think I could install an additional Renogy 100W flex panel on the and use the existing MC-4 connectors on the roof? Or would I have to run new wiring?


I suppose an alternative option would be to buy a standalone suitcase setup with it's own controller and just run that directly to the battery with alligator clips. Or would I need to connect that into my existing controller?

jwiebe, if the wiring coming from the roof is at least 10 AWG or larger, you have adequate wire size to add an additional 100 watt panel in parallel using a MC4 Y-connector as Jim stated. Your GP-PWM-10-SQ charge controller is rated for 190 watts @ 12 volts, so you will need a new charge controller as you stated.

Your alternative option of buying a suitcase with its own charge controller and attaching it directly to the battery will work.

My 120 watt suitcase has a Zamp 10 amp PWM charge controller and I have it wired so I can use the Zamp controller or bypass the Zamp controller and plug the suitcase directly into the solar port I installed on the side of the MM and run it through the onboard Bogart SC-2030 PWM charge controller.

[jwiebe]

Originally Posted by Fred 2106DS

jwiebe, if the wiring coming from the roof is at least 10 AWG or larger, you have adequate wire size to add an additional 100 watt panel in parallel using a MC4 Y-connector as Jim stated. Your GP-PWM-10-SQ charge controller is rated for 190 watts @ 12 volts, so you will need a new charge controller as you stated.

Your alternative option of buying a suitcase with its own charge controller and attaching it directly to the battery will work.

My 120 watt suitcase has a Zamp 10 amp PWM charge controller and I have it wired so I can use the Zamp controller or bypass the Zamp controller and plug the suitcase directly into the solar port I installed on the side of the MM and run it through the onboard Bogart SC-2030 PWM charge controller.

Thanks Fred. I’ll check the wire gauge this weekend. Any tips on installing a solar port? That might be a good way to go for me. I guess this is mostly all for naught if I don’t increase my battery capacity anyway. Still just a Group 27 12V deep cycle battery.

[Marine359]

Originally Posted by jwiebe

Thanks Fred. I’ll check the wire gauge this weekend. Any tips on installing a solar port? That might be a good way to go for me. I guess this is mostly all for naught if I don’t increase my battery capacity anyway. Still just a Group 27 12V deep cycle battery.

Jwiebe,
Deciding on battery upgrades boils down to budget. It does you no good to add solar if you don’t have a place to store the amps from the solar. AGM is the most cost effective route. You can add battery capacity without having to upgrade other components. Going to LiFePo4 should only be undertaken if you know you’ll keep your rig for 3 years or more. That’s the paybAck period for the added expense (batteries plus new charger). 200ah of AGM is enough for most people. That delivers 100ah of useable power at a pretty low cost. You can do the math.

[Fred 2106DS]

Originally Posted by jwiebe

Thanks Fred. I’ll check the wire gauge this weekend. Any tips on installing a solar port? That might be a good way to go for me. I guess this is mostly all for naught if I don’t increase my battery capacity anyway. Still just a Group 27 12V deep cycle battery.

To me it was pretty straight forward. Determine where you want the port. Using the correct size hole saw, drill a hole through the side of the MM. Mount the port and wire it up to the onboard solar charge controller. Lastly, add the mating connector the the suitcase wiring.

I installed my port on the passenger side, at the top-front of the pass-through. I used a Furrion 10A port. Here's a picture of the installed port.

[Fred 2106DS]

Jim and jwiebe, Keep in mind if you go with a suitcase panel and use the included charge controller you will be very limited to the distance you can place the panel away from your MM.

If you bypass the included charge controller and use your onboard charge controller or move the included charge controller close to the battery you can increase your distance quite a bit.

This is due to voltage drop and the location of your charge controller in relation to your solar panel and battery.

Here is a video from RVProject that explains this. If you look at the description below the video there is a series a videos that deal with installing and using a suitcase panel.

[Marine359]

Thanks Fred,
Knowing this, I’m planning to buy a suitcase without cc. I’ll mount Victron mppt in pass thru next to fuse block within 3ft of battery bus bar using 6awg. Curios why you chose Furion port instead of a plain SAE port. Trigger ready, but seems Renogy no longer has the soft lightweight suitcase on their website. If they don’t change that soon, I’ll have to buy Rockpal or Acopower. Did you fuse incoming 10awg from panels, or just fuse between cc and battery. I’ve heard it both ways.

[Fred 2106DS]

Originally Posted by Marine359

Thanks Fred,
Knowing this, I’m planning to buy a suitcase without cc. I’ll mount Victron mppt in pass thru next to fuse block within 3ft of battery bus bar using 6awg. Curios why you chose Furion port instead of a plain SAE port. Trigger ready, but seems Renogy no longer has the soft lightweight suitcase on their website. If they don’t change that soon, I’ll have to buy Rockpal or Acopower. Did you fuse incoming 10awg from panels, or just fuse between cc and battery. I’ve heard it both ways.

I looked at both. SAE would have been an easier to install and would do the job, but I wasn't sure how the rubber cover for the contacts would hold up over the long term. My experience with rubber covers are that they dry out overtime and the lanyard part breaks and I end up losing the covver. The Furrion has a hinged plastic cover that snaps in place and I could get it in gray to match the MM.

Both my rooftop solar (8 awg from the combiner box on the roof) and suitcase solar (10 awg) wiring are combined in the pass-through. From there, I ran 6 awg to a 30 amp breaker and then to the CC. I also have a 30 amp breaker between the CC and battery, used 6 awg for this run also. I choose 30 amps because that is the max current for my CC.

[R_Lefebvre]

Originally Posted by Marine359

Thanks Fred,
I’m thinking maybe one 100w fixed panel on roof, and one of the new Renogy lightweight 100w suitcase. If the panels are electrically similar, I should be able to wire them into the pass thru to a 1/2/both/off disconnect switch, then wire the switch to CC then to my Blue Sea spade fuse block. We have low power demands when boondocking, except our compressor fridge consumes 25-30 ah/day. Battery is big enough to go for a week with no genny if I can replace 30 ah per day. I don’t want to park MM in sun to collect the ah needed. Do you think the lightweight suitcase will give me enough if placed in the sun? You tubers say it delivers 5 amps.

Hi Jim, where did you get the figure for the 30 ah/day for the compressor fridge? Did you measure it yourself?

This is very much lower than I have seen others quote. I believe you are probably right as I have some experience with the smaller chest compressor fridges for overlanding, and they use very little power. I expect the fridge would use 4-ish times as much power for 4 times the surface area. That guestimate agrees with your number.

I see other saying the fridge draws 15A, and clearly that can't be right. I don't think the fridge in my house even draws that many watts.

Just planning a solar setup on an 1800BH, planning on 400W on the roof, because we are usually camped in a wooded area. Just wondering if this will stand a chance of keeping up with fridge.

I have an EU2000i already if needed. And planning on using a Renogy 30A DC-DC charger/CC with a 50A Anderson plug back to the truck. Unfortunately, my truck is diesel, so it's pretty loud at idle, not planning on using that to charge the MM, but this will work well any day we are travelling. We typically move around more than staying in one place.

-Rob

[creativepart]

Rob... batteries are a the vital part of this equation. What are you using and how many amp hours to you have? It’s your batteries that run the fridge not your solar panels. Solar panels are just a way to recharge your batteries not really run your systems.

[Marine359]

Hi Rob,
Yes I measured amp hour consumption for the fridge. I did it twice, each time over a 24 hr period, and both were within one amp hour of each other. However, the ambient daytime temp was 65F, and it was colder at night. Both tests were done with pre-chilled (24 hrs) fridge and some ice in the freezer. Measured with my Victron smartshunt BM. So, although I don’t have test data, I’m estimating up to 30AH in warmer ambient temps. I didn’t measure amperage when the compressor cycled on, but it only came on about every 15 minutes. Of course this would change if open the doors often.

Just bought a Lensunsolar 110w soft folding panel. I had originally planned to get two of them, but I backed off to see how well one would perform. The panel and the mppt I ordered haven’t arrived yet. Hope to be able to report real world usage info soon. All I want is to be able to replace most (75%) of the amps I use without running my generator. If I can do that, I can boondock for a week without ever starting the generator.

[R_Lefebvre]

Originally Posted by creativepart

Rob... batteries are a the vital part of this equation. What are you using and how many amp hours to you have? It’s your batteries that run the fridge not your solar panels. Solar panels are just a way to recharge your batteries not really run your systems.

Don't have the batteries yet, but I'm looking to start with probably two 100Ah lithium batteries.

We typically don't stay in one place for longer than 3 days (actually that has never happened yet). So even if I'm "one step forward, two steps back" for a couple of days but can squeak by without running the genny, and then recharge while on the road, that would be acceptable performance.

Even if I had to run the genny for like 1 hour per day, that wouldn't be too bad. In the past I've had a pretty crappy setup. The generator, into a car battery charger at max 20A, charging one or two deep cycle LA's. It seemed that most of the time, the generator was just idling and the batteries were trickling. Very "inefficient" in terms of time/noise/power.

And where I camp (provincial parks mostly) is very unusual to run a genny, so you feel like a real jerk when doing it. When I first started out, I had a 3500W cheap "full bore" generator. I fired that thing up and within a minute I couldn't be "that guy" anymore and shut it down. We just ran it for a few minutes at a time to run the microwave as we had to thaw out food. But otherwise just did without power for several days.

All too often, even if you pay for a powered site at Provincial Parks, most people don't have long enough cords. They put the power heads a LONG way away, like 100 to even 300 feet.

Yes I measured amp hour consumption for the fridge. I did it twice, each time over a 24 hr period, and both were within one amp hour of each other. However, the ambient daytime temp was 65F, and it was colder at night. Both tests were done with pre-chilled (24 hrs) fridge and some ice in the freezer. Measured with my Victron smartshunt BM. So, although I don’t have test data, I’m estimating up to 30AH in warmer ambient temps. I didn’t measure amperage when the compressor cycled on, but it only came on about every 15 minutes. Of course this would change if open the doors often.

Fantastic! Thanks for the detailed info. I'm up in Canada so average summer temps are typically around 80F. It's rare if it's above 90F. And as I said, normally camping in shade, so my performance should be similar to yours.

[Marine359]

Originally Posted by R_Lefebvre

Don't have the batteries yet, but I'm looking to start with probably two 100Ah lithium batteries.

Rob,
LiFePo4 batteries are the most expensive part of the system. Just my opinion, but people who don’t boondock for more than 3 days at a time probably don’t need 200Ah of lithium. Remember that about 90% of your LiFePo4 rated AH are useable. Just look at the math. I’ll be using 40ah per day (I have cpap), which is pretty miserly allowing for 30Ah for the fridge. If I had 100ah lithium, I’d have a little over 2 days of boondocking with no gen. That increases to 3 days with a portable panel. I’ve got 150ah useable, so for me solar is the least expensive way to extend to 5 days or more. When you’re driving, you’ll be capturing, I believe 3-5 amps from your 7 pin.

Also, I didn’t shell out $1,000 for a single 100ah Battle Born. Great batteries, but I paid $800 for 170ah (nearly half the price of BB). You may be better served by pocketing the money you’d spend for two BBs and buying 2 solar panels. I dunno. You gotta figure out what works for you.

[R_Lefebvre]

Hi Jim,

Yeah, I agree with your math and reasoning.

I'm not sure at this point what my total loads will be. I know my wife will probably be using about ~15 minutes (conservative) of hair styling appliances. That's potentially another 30Ah per day right there. Maybe more like 10-15 in reality. Some microwave use. Let's say 5 minutes per day, I figure 10Ah for that. If we used a pod coffee machine for 5 minutes, that's another 10Ah.

So including the fridge, that's 65 Ah per day, for the loads I can think of. But lights, fans, device charging, etc. I have no idea what to estimate for those. Let's say round up to 100 Ah per day, then 200Ah is two days without accounting for solar charging.

I don't know what to assume for that, as I have no experience here. Solar charging in Canada is difficult, particularly if I'm under trees which is common.

I guess one could look at this and say that it's "sloppy" power use. But that's actually sort of the point. In the past, we've really struggled with trying to survive off-grid, and maybe I'm over-compensating for that. Not to say I struggled because I was sloppy in the past, we basically had to deal with virtually no power. Just the phantom loads, some LED lighting, and "housekeeping" loads seemed to kill us in 2 days. I just don't want to have to worry about this as much. It's a stress I don't want to deal with when vacationing. If spending an extra $800 on an extra battery that maybe I could get by without, I can live with that.

[Marine359]

Rob,
If you’re saying you’re gonna use ac power while boondocking, cha-Ching, more money for inverter. Please keep in mind that if you go LiFePo4, you gotta spend at least another $350 for a LiFePo4 charger, transfer switch, good wire, etc., or spend even more for an inverter/charger.

The panel I’m waiting for delivery on, puts out 6amp in ideal sun conditions. Because it does not have a built-in cc, the panel will be sending all 6amps to the mppt in my pass thru with virtually no voltage drop. That means you can place the panel up to fifty feet away in the sun, and orient it to the sun, maximizing capture.
I bought direct, but you do have to pay $25 shipping. Couldn’t be sure I could get the same panel on Amazon.
https://www.lensunsolar.com/Products...product_id=479

The mppt is a 75/15 Bluetooth Victron on amazon for $120. Then some odds and ends for about $50.

If I need more power, I’ll buy another $200 panel before I ante up for another $1,000 battery. Although we boondock 75% of the time, we are older, and my wife likes glamping more than camping, which is why we have an inverter/charger.

My battery has actually gone up in price (due to demand). I think it’s now about $1,000, but they will discount if you ask and shipping is free.
https://bigbattery.com/products/12v-...70ah-2-176kwh/

[R_Lefebvre]

Yes, I'm planning on the Renogy 3000W Inverter/Charger, and the 30A DC-DC Charger/Charge controller. I have a budget it $3-4000 to use on the setup. It's not so much about making any economic sense as it is just being about to enjoy our vacation time without stress of managing a system.

3000W is probably more than we need, but it's only $100 more than the 2000W. All of this could also serve as a backup in case of a power failure at home too.

[Fred 2106DS]

Originally Posted by R_Lefebvre

...It's not so much about making any economic sense as it is just being about to enjoy our vacation time without stress of managing a system.

Couldn't agree more! That's the main reason behind all my mods.

[Marine359]

I have pictures of my install in the albums in my profile. PM me if you want some money saving ideas on installing LiFePo4 and inverter/charger in pass-thru.

Got most ideas from Fred

[Pianotuna]

Originally Posted by R_Lefebvre

Hi Jim,

Yeah, I agree with your math and reasoning.

I'm not sure at this point what my total loads will be. I know my wife will probably be using about ~15 minutes (conservative) of hair styling appliances. That's potentially another 30Ah per day right there. Maybe more like 10-15 in reality. Some microwave use. Let's say 5 minutes per day, I figure 10Ah for that. If we used a pod coffee machine for 5 minutes, that's another 10Ah.

So including the fridge, that's 65 Ah per day, for the loads I can think of. But lights, fans, device charging, etc. I have no idea what to estimate for those. Let's say round up to 100 Ah per day, then 200Ah is two days without accounting for solar charging.

I don't know what to assume for that, as I have no experience here. Solar charging in Canada is difficult, particularly if I'm under trees which is common.

I guess one could look at this and say that it's "sloppy" power use. But that's actually sort of the point. In the past, we've really struggled with trying to survive off-grid, and maybe I'm over-compensating for that. Not to say I struggled because I was sloppy in the past, we basically had to deal with virtually no power. Just the phantom loads, some LED lighting, and "housekeeping" loads seemed to kill us in 2 days. I just don't want to have to worry about this as much. It's a stress I don't want to deal with when vacationing. If spending an extra $800 on an extra battery that maybe I could get by without, I can live with that.

Hi Look at SiO2 batteries instead of Li. Cheaper initial cost with no need to recharge to 100% (once a month recommended to 100% soc)



A 100 watt panel in ideal conditions *may* do 25 amp-hours per day. In real life, probably far less than that.