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Old 11-25-2018, 06:14 PM   #41
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We owned a 2015 Navion V. Loved it EXCEPT the weight issues. You start with 1030 lbs ccc. Add Heavier Helwig Sway bar, HWH Leveling jacks, Wife and I (350 lbs) ,26 gallons of water. We had less than 400 lbs for EVERYTHING ELSE!!, Add Sumo Springs like someone said, you will have maybe 350 lbs for EVERYTHING ELSE. We sold it. Check out your TRUE CCC AFTER all your levelers, sway bars, sumo springs, etc. Are installed. What's Left ? For ccc. We now have a Winnebago Sightseer 33c, 3100 lbs ccc, Includes Washer and Dryer. That also includes my Sumo Springs, 2 Solar panels and Safe T Plus Stabilizer. I beleive you need to check out your ccc, including your toad. Just my opinion.....
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Old 11-25-2018, 06:18 PM   #42
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I have always been a Chevy man, but recently bought a 2018 Class C Mini 26A that is on a Ford 450 chassis and has the V10 Triton. I'm 71, and have owned more cars and trucks than most folks. The Triton V10 is the most powerful Gas engine that I have ever had. I get 9-9 1/2 mpg with it driving 62 mph. It goes over the mountains at under 3K rpm, where as my Chevy 6 L Vortec would be winding up to 4k and still not have the power of the v10 triton. My Chevy Duramax of course had more power...……. until it blew up! So, to my very pleasant surprise, I found out why most Class C coaches use the Ford Triton V10..... no other Gasser will out pull it.
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Old 11-25-2018, 06:37 PM   #43
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1) Poor fuel economy. Anyone who tells you they're getting 8-10 on it, is driving in perfect conditions, downhill, with a tail wind. I know, I had one.
Well I suppose that I am "anyone". I have one. I get 9-9 1/2 mpg with my Ford V10 in my 26A Mini. That is traveling from the central valley of California over the coast mountains and return, a trip that I have made hundreds of times in 15 different RVs that I have owned. The Country Coach class C with the Big Dodge engine was by far the worst, at 6 mpg. The Chevy Diesel was the best at 12.5 mpg. I am a very easy driver. I don't do Jack Rabbit starts, and I cruise at 62 mph and use the cruise control. The very first trip in this rig only yielded 8 mpg... that was because I was so impressed with the huge amount of power and acceleration that the V10 Triton had, that I was using it too much. Once I calmed down and started drive more sensibly, it improved.
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Old 11-25-2018, 06:52 PM   #44
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Low torque, high revving, engine, not too good on gas mileage and really not designed for heavy loads. It pulls a 28' with 2 door Jeep in tow okay until you hit the really serious hills out west. I'm sure the 31' version has even more difficulty. So depending on your RV size and whether you are towing, It may meet your expectations, or not.
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Old 11-25-2018, 07:05 PM   #45
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I have a 2000 Winnie 32V Adventurer Class A with a V10.
Although I’m not a Ford guy, I am most happy with it so far. When going down the road in O/Drive the motor is actually pretty quiet. The only time I hear it is when climbing and passing. I can get about 7.5 mpg pulling a 79 VW Beetle. I formerly ran an 88 Southwind 27Y with a 454 carb engine and it was much noisier. I think the 454 had a bit more torque to pull hills but that could be the weight difference between the two units. The V10 is stout and I like it so far. Do all the test driving you can if possible. Good Luck!
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Old 11-25-2018, 08:33 PM   #46
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There are not as many to choose from but the GM 6L on the 4500 chassis delivers a solid 10 mpg for my first 12,000 miles. Ohio based but travel to Perry GA, Gillette WY, MI, and MA.
One thing to definitely check is to have your co-driver compare the foot well space between the Ford and GM chassis. "Dog House is wider on the passenger side on the Ford chassis.
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Old 11-25-2018, 08:57 PM   #47
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The advice to "step on the Gas every 30 seconds" is utterly stupid and accomplishes nothing - except probably forcing still another downshift. Are you sure that came from Ford? If your MH has the tow/haul button on the end of the gear shift stalk, push to engage and it should reduce the tendency for excessive shifting.
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Old 11-26-2018, 11:24 AM   #48
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It is a good dependable engine which will give you enough power to tow a toad behind. You will get about 8 to 10 mpg if you keep your speed 65 or under.
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Old 11-26-2018, 11:34 AM   #49
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It is a good dependable engine which will give you enough power to tow a toad behind. You will get about 8 to 10 mpg if you keep your speed 65 or under.
I concur.
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Old 11-26-2018, 11:42 AM   #50
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It was ford. They even told me to learn ow to drive. I was livid. 3.5 million miles in crusiers, rescues and trucks i think i can drive.
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Old 11-26-2018, 12:48 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by Winterbagoal View Post
1) Poor fuel economy. Anyone who tells you they're getting 8-10 on it, is driving in perfect conditions, downhill, with a tail wind. I know, I had one.

<snip>

Honestly, I was a Ford guy until I tried the Navion with the diesel. Now, I don't think I'd ever go back. It's just that much better for us/me.
This discussion is a Class C with the Ford engine. I believe you had a Class A, which would probably account for the difference in mileage.
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Old 11-26-2018, 12:59 PM   #52
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Go Class A

I assume you are looking at new? Its important because the single biggest factor on the v-10 is the new 6 speed Allison designed and Ford build transmission. It allows far move flexibility with RPMs for a given load and reduces the noise factor. As for gas mileage...if that is an issue find another form of recreation. They are all bad.

I would encourage you to look at smaller class A's. Why....they are quieter, they are more maneuverable with a tighter turning radius. Much easier to get in and out of places. They also don't have the "trike" effect of a class C from having the front end on a narrower track than the rear. Class A also gets you out of the "Doghouse" that is noisy. Cost wise, the A is remarkable close to most class C's.

I am new to Motorhome ownership and bought a 2018 Winnebago Vista LX 35F. 35.5 feet long and we love the V10. Other posters are correct in that this is high reving engine producing most of its peak performance about 4,000 RPM. It is noisy at this level. However, I find it quite a good performer (not towing) around 3000 to 3200 for modest grades. On the flat...2200 RPMs at 65MPH and fairly quiet. I think 6 speed started in 2017

Good Luck
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Old 11-26-2018, 01:50 PM   #53
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I bought my first rig in 1978, a 18 foot Cruise Master by Georgie Boy with a Dodge chassis with the bulletproof 318 V8. I owned it for 39 years, and only decided to replace it when I retired and didn’t want to have to climb down from the cab over bed any more - and neither did my wife. (Stories abound about that wonderful old rig that I passed on to my son.)

In choosing our replacement, the 2018 Winnebago 22M with the slide out a two piece queen bed, we found nothing but Ford V10s in either the E350 or occasionally an E450 chassis. We ended up with the E350 on a 2017 chassis, and was my first Ford. I put about 3000 miles on it this past year and am very happy with it. Since I almost exclusively boondock, I travel with a full water tank (40 gallons), and a full gas tank (55 gallons). The Ford V10 provides vastly more power than my old Dodge, and it’s pretty astonishing to be able to use the dash a/c whenever I wanted and not worrying about the grades. Overall, I seem to average about 9 to 9.5 mpg, although I have to concentrate to avoid going over 65mph, as I find going 70 or above really eats into my mileage. Of note, my old Dodge got 9.5-10 mpg so about the same mileage with a lot more weight. The shock comes, however, when I go to fill up, as the tank is over 20 gallons larger! Big single hit on the credit card! But it’s all so worth it!

After the first year, I’m totally sold on the Ford V10.
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Old 11-26-2018, 03:44 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RvExplorer View Post
I assume you are looking at new? Its important because the single biggest factor on the v-10 is the new 6 speed Allison designed and Ford build transmission. It allows far move flexibility with RPMs for a given load and reduces the noise factor. As for gas mileage...if that is an issue find another form of recreation. They are all bad.

I would encourage you to look at smaller class A's. Why....they are quieter, they are more maneuverable with a tighter turning radius. Much easier to get in and out of places. They also don't have the "trike" effect of a class C from having the front end on a narrower track than the rear. Class A also gets you out of the "Doghouse" that is noisy. Cost wise, the A is remarkable close to most class C's.

I am new to Motorhome ownership and bought a 2018 Winnebago Vista LX 35F. 35.5 feet long and we love the V10. Other posters are correct in that this is high reving engine producing most of its peak performance about 4,000 RPM. It is noisy at this level. However, I find it quite a good performer (not towing) around 3000 to 3200 for modest grades. On the flat...2200 RPMs at 65MPH and fairly quiet. I think 6 speed started in 2017

Good Luck
You have a 3 valve engine with higher horsepower than the 2 valve engine in a Class C. So its apples VS oranges before you go any further. There is not a lot of difference between the 5 speed and 6 speed transmissions as in normal operation, the 6 speed only uses 5 gears.

The steering travel in a class A on the F53 chassis is limited by the leaf springs and it does not have a tighter turning radius than an E450. The diesel class A's have air suspension and do have a tighter turning radius. There are some quite lengthy threads on suspension modifications to make the F53 chassis found in most Ford Class A's handle better. You can make modifications to an E450, but the significant change to improve handling is to increase the caster in the wheel alignment. The other changes people make are not needed in shorter sizes but help in 30+ foot ones.
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Old 11-26-2018, 04:02 PM   #55
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The upgrades that would make a Minnie handle better are already on the Jayco Class C's with the J-Ride.
Wish Winnebago would automatically include them on the Class C's
One of the trade-off's to weigh against the Minnie vs Greyhawk while the Winnie's have other advantages over Jayco.
This deciding which Class C to buy is enough to cause hair pulling
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Old 11-26-2018, 08:29 PM   #56
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You have a 3 valve engine with higher horsepower than the 2 valve engine in a Class C. So its apples VS oranges before you go any further. There is not a lot of difference between the 5 speed and 6 speed transmissions as in normal operation, the 6 speed only uses 5 gears.

The steering travel in a class A on the F53 chassis is limited by the leaf springs and it does not have a tighter turning radius than an E450. The diesel class A's have air suspension and do have a tighter turning radius. There are some quite lengthy threads on suspension modifications to make the F53 chassis found in most Ford Class A's handle better. You can make modifications to an E450, but the significant change to improve handling is to increase the caster in the wheel alignment. The other changes people make are not needed in shorter sizes but help in 30+ foot ones.

Just as a For What It's Worth bit of additional info: The 5 speed also has 6 internal ratios. The computer controls which ratio is used for one of the TorqShift 5 speed transmission's 5 "gears" - based on outside ambient temperature.
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Old 11-26-2018, 11:39 PM   #57
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Well, as most people say, life is full of tradeoffs. It is especially true of RVing. As you are doing, we can only educate ourselves the best we can, make the required decision, and press on down the road!
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Old 11-27-2018, 09:19 AM   #58
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I also agonized over the E450 vs Mercedes decision. The deciding factors were available interior space and comfort, CCC (3100# on the Access we bought), a proper queen-sized bed (not in a slideout), and availability of service. All these are better with the 450 class C (IMO).
And a post from a fleet owner who was phasing out Mercedes for E450s due to maintenance cost and dependability issues.
I haven't found maneuverability to be an issue - our C handles very well.
Good luck with your shopping!
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Old 12-05-2018, 08:30 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterbagoal View Post
1) Poor fuel economy. Anyone who tells you they're getting 8-10 on it, is driving in perfect conditions, downhill, with a tail wind.
I mentioned in an earlier post that I had two RVs with the Ford V10, a Class A and a class B, and that I got 8-9 mpg with the Class A. That was my average over all of the time I had the RV and did not involve driving in perfect conditions. What I found was that speed was the major defining factor in gas mileage. If I kept my speed under 65 mph I got decent mileage, if I went over I got poor mileage. And I always tried to keep a light foot on the accelerator.

The same thing seems to be true with my current Class C diesel RV. Keep it under 65 and I get about 16-18 mpg, go over 70 and the mileage goes way down.

All in all the gas V10 served me very well and I would buy one again if I were getting a gasser.
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Old 12-05-2018, 11:04 AM   #60
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I mentioned in an earlier post that I had two RVs with the Ford V10, a Class A and a class B, and that I got 8-9 mpg with the Class A. That was my average over all of the time I had the RV and did not involve driving in perfect conditions. What I found was that speed was the major defining factor in gas mileage. If I kept my speed under 65 mph I got decent mileage, if I went over I got poor mileage. And I always tried to keep a light foot on the accelerator.

The same thing seems to be true with my current Class C diesel RV. Keep it under 65 and I get about 16-18 mpg, go over 70 and the mileage goes way down.

All in all the gas V10 served me very well and I would buy one again if I were getting a gasser.
Did either of your 6.8L V10s have a real time or averaged fuel economy dash display, either L/100km or MPG? My 2016 didn't, but my 2017 3.0L V6 diesel Navion does. I think there's a reason for that? I even asked the dealer about it, and he said no there isn't a fuel economy display on the V10. We left it at that.

I've let the Navion's fuel economy display run for a week at a time to get an overall average. It averages out a little over 15 mpg over a week's driving in all conditions, variable speeds, and freeway/city traffic, flats and hills, driving the backroads and through the countryside where the speed limits are lower. That's the overall average.
My Ford V10 might have gotten around 8 mpg + or - on the highway alone, under ideal conditions. That's not the overall driving average, like I get with the Navion, because the driving conditions were quite different between the 2 types of motorhomes that I owned. I don't know anyone that prefers to use their class A to drive in city, or other non-freeway traffic. On that basis, I would hazard a guess that most of the gas mileage calculations and claims for the Ford V10 are based on freeway driving almost exclusively.

I do agree with your "lead foot" observations. The diesel seems particularly fussy about speed and fuel economy, which is very predictable (even without my dash display). I found my best trade off between making good progress from A to B, and squeezing every drop of power out of a gallon of diesel is somewhere around 60mph. 55mph increases fuel economy and 65+ mph kills it.

Lastly, if you were getting a gasser, you'd probably only have one choice, anyway.
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