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Old 07-09-2020, 12:42 PM   #1
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Nose Down

I was just wondering I have a 2005 sightseer that I feel runs nose down is this right or is this a problem. Did not want to replace shocks if I do not have to 41k carry 40lbs in front airbags. I also hate my hydraulic brakes but it has been a great traveling motorhome.
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Old 07-09-2020, 01:09 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aprange View Post
Did not want to replace shocks if I do not have to 41k carry 40lbs in front airbags. I also hate my hydraulic brakes
Huh? You lost me with these statements.
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Old 07-09-2020, 01:25 PM   #3
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Sorry did not know if 41k was enough miles to effect shocks and had anything to do with camper running nose down I also have airbags upfront with 40lbs in them. Brakes have nothing to do with this sorry
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Old 07-09-2020, 01:55 PM   #4
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Got it. All that kind or ran together before.

Sure 41,000 miles is enough to need new shocks, but shocks don't set your ride height really. They mainly control jounce cycles so your RV doesn't keep bouncing after you hit a bump.

Air bags are not standard on a Sightseer. I assume you have them set up similar to Sumo Springs where they sit between the frame and the middle of the leaf springs.

A sagging front end would pretty much be caused either by over loading the front end or worn out, broken or undersized leaf springs. The most common of these would be too much weight on the front of the coach.

Take everything out of the storage bins forward of the middle of the coach and see if it goes back to level.

By the way, the Air Bags could most likely be used to raise the front end, but that will make the ride harsher.

Climb under there and see if you've broken any leaf spring sections or if anything is sagging. Check your shocks to see if there are any signs of leaking. Though in general, your shocks are not what sets your ride height.
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Old 07-09-2020, 02:44 PM   #5
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Airbags are inside the coil springs. I will look some more at spring thanks for your input
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Old 07-09-2020, 03:22 PM   #6
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Quote:
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Airbags are inside the coil springs. I will look some more at spring thanks for your input
Wait, you have a Workhorse chassis I'm guessing. Ford chassis don't have coil springs. I know all newer Sightseers have Ford Chassis.

Disregard my previous post pretty much entirely.
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Old 07-15-2020, 07:57 PM   #7
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I have a 2005 Sightseer 29R....and yes, I've felt it looks like the nose rides low. However, the shop said all is fine, the interior is level, so I just ignore the look and keep on driving. Lots of miles and years have passed with no adverse effects from the "nose down race car" look.
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Old 07-15-2020, 08:11 PM   #8
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I have a 2008 29r and have never felt it road nose down.

If you are curious about weight hit a scale. I just did it for the first time last week. Fully loaded (short a bit of fuel) with the scooter on the back each wheel was within 50 lb of the opposite side. Overall we were 150 lb below gvw. I was pretty happy with that. Although I’m not about to let the wife know.
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Old 07-16-2020, 04:48 AM   #9
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Workhorse chassis?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aprange View Post
I was just wondering I have a 2005 sightseer that I feel runs nose down is this right or is this a problem. Did not want to replace shocks if I do not have to 41k carry 40lbs in front airbags. I also hate my hydraulic brakes but it has been a great traveling motorhome.
Changing the shocks might help ride and handling, but won't help the nose-low condition.

I'm guessing you have a Sightseer on the Workhorse chassis. I have a 2002 Winnebago 30B on the Workhorse chassis. Mine runs nose down too, by at least a couple of inches. I have looked at images on line and seen that many of the Workhorse chassis Sightseers sit nose-low, but the Ford chassis Sightseers usually don't.

You can inflate your front air bags up to 80 pounds. That might help. I can't add air to mine because they both are leak. My mechanic suggests that I could replace the air bags, and he also said I could install heavier springs at the same time, which would probably solve the problem and improve handling.

BTW, I hate the Workhorse Hydro-boost brakes. Very little boost. My right knee starts to ache if I drive in stop-and-go traffic very long.
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Old 07-16-2020, 08:33 PM   #10
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Some times you need to deflate the air bags, jack the coach up to unload the front axle and then re-inflate the air bags as they have been known to bunch up in the coils and limit their range of lift.

Also be sure that your load is balanced and the coach is not front heavy. Having the coach too light in the back even though the front is not technically overweight can cause a nose down effect when the reality is that the rear is riding high from being too lightly loaded compared to the front. It is somewhat of a balancing act.

The 29R had the P32 Chevy Chassis (considered the Bread Truck Chassis by many) as an Option. Independent front suspension and AutoPark hydraulic parking brake operated by an electric motor which are both considered to be its weak points. Be sure to flush and refill the master cylinder and hydraulics for the AutoPark brake thats hidden under the chassis to the right of the transmission every 2 years just like the main braking system. Caliper mounts and guide pins should be cleaned and greased with Silicon Brake Grease every 2 years when the brake flush is done.
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Old 07-17-2020, 12:13 AM   #11
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Just "feeling" a nose down attitude may not mean its actually nose down. It might be best to make measurements to confirm you actually have a problem.
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Old 07-17-2020, 05:15 AM   #12
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Brake and AutoPark fluid changes

NeilV has a good point about changing the brake fluid. Brake fluid can absorb water from the air over time causing poor brake performance and corrosion in the system.

As for the AutoPark fluid, I haven't had to change mine due to leaks in the system requiring a total refill a couple of times, LOL. However, I did rebuild the release cylinder to stop the leak. BTW, don't believe what you might read or hear about the cylinder not being rebuildable. I got the glans and seal at a local hydraulics shop for about $25 and did the work myself. It's a very simple single action cylinder.
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Old 07-17-2020, 09:39 AM   #13
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Thanks For INFO

Hey thanks for all the imput I really do like my sightseer other than the brakes are horrible put 36000 miles on last year to the coast twice guess I will live with nose down Keep traveling Thanks
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Old 07-17-2020, 06:56 PM   #14
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Funny how thing work in life.
I read this post the other day, and when I saw that it was for a Workhorse, I realized that I didn't have any technical expertise to offer. I will admit to liking the 8.1L/Allison combo more than the V-10/5 spd I have in my '06 Sightseer 29R.
But, I digress. I was bored while sitting in the lobby of the doctors office this morning as my wife's visit dragged on. I happened to see the 2006 Workhorse Chassis Guide I had loaded on my tablet some years ago when we were shopping for a motor home. I read through the document and stumbled across the exact advice offered above:
"Service Tip - For units that appear to have a low front ride height due to operating at near front suspension capacity or if air bag cylinders have been run below minimum recommended pressure:
1. Jack up the motor home by the middle of the front cross member and allow the wheels to hang.
2. Remove the air from the air bag and re-inflate the air bag to the proper pressure.
3. Lower the unit and bleed off air (as necessary) to maintain proper air bag pressure.
This may provide some ride height improvement as the air bag tends to stretch lengthwise slightly with this procedure."

Also found this info that may be helpful:
"P SERIES (MODEL YEARS 1999-2005)
The P Series chassis have a coil spring independent front suspension system. The control arms are unequal length, short (upper)/long (lower). The coil springs are located between the lower control arms and the cross member; thus the lower control arms are the load-carrying members. Double acting shock absorbers are also attached to the lower control arms and connect to the frame. All P Series Workhorse RV chassis are equipped with air bag cylinders to provide an adjustable front suspension for ride quality and load-carrying capacity. These air cylinders are positioned in the center of the coil springs and can be adjusted by valves located on the bottom of each bag. Workhorse offers two versions of this independent front suspension design, the standard track and the wide track. Both have the same basic design as described above but are offered in different track widths and carrying capacities.
The standard track independent front suspension measures 69.7” front track width (measured at the center of front tires). The standard track front suspension has a 4,880 lb. GAWR on the 12,300 lb. GVWR chassis or a 5,500 lb. GAWR on the 14,800 lb. and 16,500 lb. GVWR chassis. In the 2000 model year the wide track independent front suspension was introduced and measures 82.95” front wheel track (measured at the center of the front tires). The wide track suspension has a 6,000 lb. GAWR and was standard on our 15,000 lb., 17,000 lb. and 18,000 lb. GVWR chassis.
P SERIES FRONT COIL SPRINGS AND AIR BAG CYLINDER
The air bag cylinders should be inspected periodically for signs of deterioration, damage or leaks. To verify possible leaks with the air bag removed from the vehicle, inflate the bag and submerge it in water and check for air bubbles. The standard track suspension system, 4,880 lb. or 5,500 lb. GAWR, utilizes an Airlift Heavy Duty Bag, Workhorse part no. W8803508. The wide track suspension system, 6,000 lb. GAWR, utilized a high-pressure air cylinder from its introduction in Nov. 1999 to Aug. 14, 2001, Workhorse part no. W0001111. Beginning on August 15, 2001 a new coil spring, Workhorse part no. W0000991, was integrated along with the Airlift Heavy Duty Bag, Workhorse part no. W88035508, on all wide track 6,000 lb. GAWR suspensions. The new coil spring originally was blue in color for ease of identification during the change then returned to the standard black starting in the production week of December 1, 2003. Regardless of the spring color the new coil spring is approximately 12%
stiffer then the previous spring and is a direct replacement for all P32 chassis. Inflation
pressures in either air bag cylinder should be maintained at 50 PSI minimum to avoid chafing.
Maximum pressure for the Airlift bag used on the 4,880 lb., 5,500 lb. and the 6000 lb. post Aug. 15, 2001 GAWR suspensions is 90 PSI. The high-pressure air cylinder use from Nov. 1999 to Aug. 15, 2001 on the wide track 6000 lb. GAWR suspensions has a maximum of 110 PSI.
Air bag cylinder pressures will vary depending on load and preferred ride quality. Workhorse suggests initially setting the cylinders at 50-60 PSI for the 4,880 lb. axle and 80-90 PSI for the 5,500 lb. and 6,000 lb. axles. Finally air bag pressure should be adjusted for personal comfort and load within outlined recommendations. The general rule is higher inflation pressure firmer the ride quality.
Note: From the factory, Workhorse only supplies air cylinders on the front suspension; any rear air cylinders are aftermarket or installed by the body manufacturer."
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Old 07-18-2020, 07:08 AM   #15
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Thanks

Guess I should have looked at the one I downloaded when I purchased my sightseer took the dealers word mistake number 1 thanks for the info I think I am going to try the reinflating.
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Old 07-19-2020, 05:30 AM   #16
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DryCreek response

Thanks for the info, DryCreek, very imformative. I always wondered why my springs were blue. My 2002 Sightseer would definitely fall into the blue-spring time period. I just thought maybe they were aftermarket upgrades.
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Old 07-19-2020, 10:02 AM   #17
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Not sure what you are saying or asking.

Shock absorbers - on any vehicle - have nothing to do with supporting weight. They are there entirely to control and dampen the movement of the suspension only. They prevent tires from bouncing up and down and to help tires maintain road contact.

If your RV is too low in front then the 1st thing you should check are the springs - as they can break or simply sag over time from weight. And make sure that you do not have them overloaded. Have you had you unit weighed - axle by axle? Do that and compare to the manufacturer specs for weights & load ranges.

You can help support springs by adding Sumo Springs as well. I assume they offer something which fits your chassis.
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