Looking at a 2003 Journey 34HD

[Maddmike]

Been looking for a motorhome for my family with two small girls. We wanted something smaller, around 26 feet, but as a young family everything is either too expensive or crap.

My wife and I are in our early forties and saving for retirement while both working and raising two small girls. We both work in tech and can pretty much work from everywhere but we are based out of Raleigh, NC.

Of all the used units that I have come across, the Wennebagos from all years seem to be holding up the best so I think it is the only way to go.

We were not looking for a Diesel pusher but once you start looking at anything around 30 feet, you may as well.

Anyway, all that to say, I found what seems to be a well cared for unit in VA about 1.5 hours from me. My wife and I are checking it out tomorrow. Would love to get se collective wisdom and feedback. I do think it may be about $5k over what I'm willing to pay. Anyone know this rig?
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...2079354529027/

Thanks for any feedback.

[Jim_HiTek]

Winnebago JOURNEY's are holding up the best because they seem to be the higher end product. There's soooo much about my Journey DL that's just topnotch and I love it. I have a '02, and I think that you should ask for more pictures from that seller, and ask for any service records they have.

Then you can check out my RV Repair blog to get a look at the kinds of problems my '02 had. Nothing insurmountable but there's a lot of stuff that will need doing if the owner hasn't done them all ready...which is why you need the service records. And like with any RV, it's best to have a few thousand in a separate account for repairs. Then put $100 per month into it. Avoid Service Contracts as they're just not designed to pay out for problems.

The used RV market is HOT right now so if it's over book or the average you find online or at PPL Motor Homes, I wouldn't be surprised.

Oh, I see the pictures showed up at that link you posted and I got a look at the interior. Looks GREAT. I think you should scoop it up. Find out the going price for that year and model online and try to dicker for that amount...unless it's higher then his asking that is.

Make sure the seller knows how much you could use and would appreciate a break on price what with the young family and all.

[Maddmike]

Thanks for the feedback. We spent about 2.5 hours crawling around and playing with everything with my wife, my four year old, and the baby.

I like it, but it is very dated and we would need to redo the carpets, the fixtures, the window treatments, the sofas, etc. I actually like it and the bones are good. Everything works as it should, although a bit slow at places. Also, the front would need to be refinished as the paint protection film is very oxidized.

Anyway, all that to say that I liked it but my wife would want to do a bunch of work on it. We both work and want to be able to spend our weekend relaxing and not renovating so I think we are going to go lower end and newer. After all, we are camping to be out on nature with our daughters.

Anyway, we went and re-looked at a 14 WB Vista which is in new condition with 17k miles. My wife loved that one as it needs nothing and we could pick it up tomorrow and hit the road. We made an offer on that and the owner is waiting to hear back from another interested party. If their offer isn't better we will get it.

I did make a video of the Journey for my sister which is below. If we don't get the Vista, I may make an offer on the Journey.

https://youtu.be/CAff-nxZHyU

[Maddmike]

Originally Posted by Jim_HiTek

Winnebago JOURNEY's are holding up the best because they seem to be the higher end product. There's soooo much about my Journey DL that's just topnotch and I love it. I have a '02, and I think that you should ask for more pictures from that seller, and ask for any service records they have.

Then you can check out my RV Repair blog to get a look at the kinds of problems my '02 had. Nothing insurmountable but there's a lot of stuff that will need doing if the owner hasn't done them all ready...which is why you need the service records. And like with any RV, it's best to have a few thousand in a separate account for repairs. Then put $100 per month into it. Avoid Service Contracts as they're just not designed to pay out for problems.

The used RV market is HOT right now so if it's over book or the average you find online or at PPL Motor Homes, I wouldn't be surprised.

Oh, I see the pictures showed up at that link you posted and I got a look at the interior. Looks GREAT. I think you should scoop it up. Find out the going price for that year and model online and try to dicker for that amount...unless it's higher then his asking that is.

Make sure the seller knows how much you could use and would appreciate a break on price what with the young family and all.

Your page is so in depth. Lots of good information--almost too much.


I understand the little things like bathroom faucets etc. However, are there any major things that should be looked for that would be deal killers?

[Maddmike]

So, seller agreed to $45, I think I will counter for $43. If he agrees, I'll pick up tomorrow and use the $7k for renovations.

He has a huge folder of all the receipts. It does need an oil change as it has been sitting for two years but all new batteries and tires so at least I won't have that immediate expense.


The owner owns a diesel shop and kept isn't up to date. His wife had a tragic snowmobile accident and is paralyzed. Because of that, they bought a new Newmar with the wheelchair lift and now this is just in the way.

[Jim_HiTek]

Which RV are we talking about now...the Journey or the other one?

To answer your previous questions, Yes,
1) you want to look at the undercarriage. 'Not too much' rust is okay, but if it's caked in rust...like the PO drove during winter months many times where they use salt on the roads...then you'd want to back off. If you can scrape off big chunks with a putty knife, that's too much.
2) Water stains on the ceiling and/or walls. You see those, back off.
3) Poor upkeep evidence on the roof.
4) Rolling or porpoising down the road.
5) Missing serpentine or water pump belt, engine would overheat in just a few miles. Beware of a seller that won't let you drive it.
6) Squealing and/or rumbling from the basement AC. Or roof top ACs.
7) Heavy evidence of usage, excess wear and tear...like if it was rented to a frat group.
8) Sick noises from the engine.
9) Idiot lights on the dash that don't come on when you turn the key to 'Run' (no need to start it). The lights will be shown in the chassis users guide. A missing bulb indicates a possible problem.

I'd imagine you're knowledgeable enough to know what I'm talking about with this list but doesn't hurt to be reminded.

All of these can be fixed, but they're several thousand each. Which should be reflected in your bid and spelled out to the owner so they know you know they're there and expensive to fix.

You can put money down on it to hold it, then get a sample of the oil and the tranni fluid and send it in to Blackstone Labs for analysis for $30 each sample. Well worth it. I use an $8 siphon pump from Harbor Freight with a long hose, 8', and draw out a couple ounces from the oil and tranni fill tubes.

[creativepart]

Check the DOT build dates on those tires. If they are over 5 years old you should have them professionally inspected. Tires on an RV age-out not wear out. Plus sitting for 2-years is the worst thing for tires and the whole RV, actually.

Also, new batteries or not, if they've been sitting two years in a depleted state they may be ruined and not be able to hold a charge adequately.

[Maddmike]

Originally Posted by creativepart

Check the DOT build dates on those tires. If they are over 5 years old you should have them professionally inspected. Tires on an RV age-out not wear out. Plus sitting for 2-years is the worst thing for tires and the whole RV, actually.

Also, new batteries or not, if they've been sitting two years in a depleted state they may be ruined and not be able to hold a charge adequately.

Thanks. Tires are '20 and we're swapped this year in prep for a sale as were the batteries.

[Maddmike]

So, I found a used one refurbished to my liking.


The unit is actually not available for sale right now as the owner is living in it in California. However, I had a long conversation with his about how he refurbished it and the cost as well as the whole ownership experience. He is retired Air Force (I'm ex Air Force) and he love it. He has owned lots of RVs and compared to this, they were all junk. He said putting in real hardwood floors, painting, and finding the right 12V fixtures was a pain but he spent about $4,500 on it.


That being said, I was encouraged to tackle this project, even though I will have to pay for a majority of the work.


Here is the unit I liked. Higher mileage and older and he is firm at $11k more than I paid so I think I can do something similar with my budget. My paint guy quoted me $275 to remove the PPF, buff, and clearcoat the front.


https://www.rvtrader.com/listing/200...-34-5016313047


Wish me luck in this adventure!

[Jim_HiTek]

So you're saying that you did or will buy the first '03 Journey you started this thread showing? I can't tell.

Oh, I forgot to mention above. All Journey's can develop rust in the front window frame. That can cause the window to crack. So get window coverage on your policy. There are youtube videos about it, and many companies are aware of it and have treatments. A DIY'er could handle it too.

[Maddmike]

Originally Posted by Jim_HiTek

So you're saying that you did or will buy the first '03 Journey you started this thread showing? I can't tell.

Oh, I forgot to mention above. All Journey's can develop rust in the front window frame. That can cause the window to crack. So get window coverage on your policy. There are youtube videos about it, and many companies are aware of it and have treatments. A DIY'er could handle it too.

Sorry about the confusion. I'm buying the 03 with about 20k less miles. I posted that one as inspiration for what I want to build. Mine will need cosmetic work to get there

I did check the whole body as best I could for rust of other signs of damage. There is some usual surface rust with the rustiest spot being in the cargo compartment under the driver where the liner is a little stained. No signs of significant rust anywhere else that I can find.

It the video I posted above I do a 11 min walk through showing the roof liner and corners of closets. The only signs of water I found are in the drawer immediately under the fridge where it looks like some liquid spilled in the fridge and dripped in the drawer.

Here are the things I found broken: the hair dryer doesn't work, the owner claims the fridge works. It makes noise and the condenser outside warms up, but the 20 minutes or so I ran it, it did not get cold. Owner says it takes longer but even if it needs to be replaced, I won't cry. There is a crack in the Corian on the back side of the sink, and the driver's side leveler took a while to come down and sounded dry but it did come down and retract.

[Jim_HiTek]

Okay, I get it. The first one you posted is the one you're buying and the 2nd one you posted you're going to use for inspiration for remodeling. I hope you're not one of those people who slap white paint over the Journey's 'real' wood cabinets? That's a crime in my book. Beautiful wood like what came with the RV can be refurbished by a wood craftsman. Also, 'green' bathroom cabinets?? Gag me with a Ginsu. (Hah! Just my opinion...it's your RV, you get to color it).

The water is very likely from something spilled inside the refer or condensate from the refer door if it's not sealing well. Should have difficulty pulling out a dollar bill if the seal is good.

You've already assumed the refer is toast. That's good, so you could be in for a happy dance when it turns out it works. At it's age, it very well could be bad though. Still, as an example, mine is 19 years old and going strong. The oldest absorption refer I found when I checked the history was 75 years old and removed from service - didn't fail, so they are reliable for the most part.

Still, check the coils outside for yellow residue. Smell inside the refer and freezer...smell ammonia? Both are signs that it's toast. If the refer cooling coil assembly is bad it can't be fixed, time for a new cooling coil kit from the Amish. Their's are the best right now. Let us know the model number you have. If you have a 1200 series, you might want to change it out for an Amish unit anyway. To avoid fire due to manufacturing design errors.

Hair dryer doesn't work? Are you sure that it's not just the GFI? There's two of them. One on the plug for the hair dryer and another at the outlet it plugs into.

The Corian crack can be fixed with glue of course. You probably already know that.

The jacks should get a spray of lube or a wipe down with ATF on a shop rag. Check out the springs...if they're flat on the top and bottom (ignoring the hook) they should be replaced with the improved tapered spring. Ebay and Amazon carry them. Carry a 2X4 with you to 'lever' any of the jacks up if they are balky. Starting the engine provides a bit of vibration that causes them to hurry 'up' too.

[Maddmike]

Originally Posted by Jim_HiTek

Okay, I get it. The first one you posted is the one you're buying and the 2nd one you posted you're going to use for inspiration for remodeling. I hope you're not one of those people who slap white paint over the Journey's 'real' wood cabinets? That's a crime in my book. Beautiful wood like what came with the RV can be refurbished by a wood craftsman. Also, 'green' bathroom cabinets?? Gag me with a Ginsu. (Hah! Just my opinion...it's your RV, you get to color it).

The water is very likely from something spilled inside the refer or condensate from the refer door if it's not sealing well. Should have difficulty pulling out a dollar bill if the seal is good.

You've already assumed the refer is toast. That's good, so you could be in for a happy dance when it turns out it works. At it's age, it very well could be bad though. Still, as an example, mine is 19 years old and going strong. The oldest absorption refer I found when I checked the history was 75 years old and removed from service - didn't fail, so they are reliable for the most part.

Still, check the coils outside for yellow residue. Smell inside the refer and freezer...smell ammonia? Both are signs that it's toast. If the refer cooling coil assembly is bad it can't be fixed, time for a new cooling coil kit from the Amish. Their's are the best right now. Let us know the model number you have. If you have a 1200 series, you might want to change it out for an Amish unit anyway. To avoid fire due to manufacturing design errors.

Hair dryer doesn't work? Are you sure that it's not just the GFI? There's two of them. One on the plug for the hair dryer and another at the outlet it plugs into.

The Corian crack can be fixed with glue of course. You probably already know that.

The jacks should get a spray of lube or a wipe down with ATF on a shop rag. Check out the springs...if they're flat on the top and bottom (ignoring the hook) they should be replaced with the improved tapered spring. Ebay and Amazon carry them. Carry a 2X4 with you to 'lever' any of the jacks up if they are balky. Starting the engine provides a bit of vibration that causes them to hurry 'up' too.

Yeah, I probably won't pait the cabinets bit have them refinished. The walls in that one were painted over the wallpaper, which seems like an easy solution. The headboard can either be recovered or replaced with something different like teak.

I really like the floors in that one though and I hate carpets and my wife has allergies. I also have little use for the love seat opposite the sofa. I like the bench he has or a small desk or workspace.


The coils outside on the fridge actually looked good. Owner said that it just takes a while to cool down. I'm just planning for the worst case scenario. I read that Teflon based lube worked well on the stabilizers but ATF sounds like a cheap fix. I'll take a closer look at the springs tomorrow when I go to pick it up. Will do a final shakedown test before handing over my check.

[Jim_HiTek]

Good about the coils. Yeah, 24-48 hours to cool the refer is common. The length depends on outside air temp. And an empty refer takes longer then one with a 10 lb bag of ice in it does.

That small couch can be tossed and a 48" TV inside a cabinet with a TV lifter (Walmart has them at $170 with remote) would be nice to replace it. Take out the big couch and put in two fancy recliner, swivel, rockers. The European kind that turn into a bed. Leather perhaps? Between them a small table for the kids. Books and toys behind, near the wall. I can see it all. Then the old TV removed and that space used for storage. And if you're a carpenter, wouldn't be that hard to have lift up desk with cabinets behind the lift up part as part of the TV cabinet so you'd be working at the desk until something came on you wanted to watch. Push the button on the remote, TV rises and the game comes on.

Once that big couch is gone you can also put an 18" wide dishwasher right there at the end of the kitchen counter. I just found one for my remodel plans at an appliance salvage store. $75 for it. When I checked online, found that it's a pro model for bars or hotels and lists for $2200. SS tub, excellent construction, perfect condition. Rarely used.
Between them a small table for the kids. Books and toys behind near the wall. I can see it all.

Yeah, the carpet could be replaced with those new floating wood floors RV people rave about. I like the quiet carpet brings, but it's a chore keeping it clean in an RV.

Anyway, just a few ideas. You do yours.

[Maddmike]

Picked up the ole girl today and drove her home 100 miles in the 93 degree heat. She ran great, the only problem was the air in the cab is not working. Blowing but not cold.


Is this something a diesel mechanic can work on or do I need to go to an RV place (I tend to dislike those). It has been sitting for two year so there must be a slow freon leak. Everything else ran perfectly and the fridge was cold by the time we got home.


https://photos.app.goo.gl/vZ3LWRmq6HQ3VwFB9

[Jim_HiTek]

Yeah, a diesel mech could likely be able to work on it but you'd save money by finding an out of the way auto shop with room to park the RV next to the doors. Access is easy enough under the hood for gauges. Condenser is under that grill at the very back on the drivers side. Dryer is a large bullet shaped canister near the condenser. There are two fans there on the condenser that should be tested. The condenser should be cleaned.

But the coolant ports are right there under the hood. You can add a can of Freon yourself easily enough. Note that your A/C system takes 44 oz of Freon so it would be best to get some gauges on it and find out how much it's down. If too much is gone, you might need 'Stop Leak'.

What most of us do if the dash A/C is out is to start the generator which can run the basement air while driving. That'll keep the rig cool.

You could call the mobile RV techs near your location and see if you can find one who has A/C experience and have them come out to check it over. Check their reputation using google reviews or at RVServiceReviews.com.

Here's where you connect the A/C gauges or add Freon, under the front hood:



My compressor seized up and broke the serpentine belt so I ended up with $800 worth of work, than another couple hundred trying to get it cooling again, (it had stopped cooling a year before the clutch seized up), and ended up having the freon sucked out and couple months later I replaced the refrigerant with a propane/butane mixture with larger molecules to reduce the possibility of leakage. Also used a can of stop leak. Working okay now.

[BobC]

Congratulations! You're fortunate to have new tires and batteries. Having to replace them is usually the first rude surprise.

You're on the right track in not liking dealerships. Find yourself a good, independent truck shop that services your brand of Diesel and a good independent RV repair guy and you'll be in good shape. There's little on the "house" side of your MH that can't be done DIY by anyone who's used to DIY around the house.

I've found that my refrigerator cools down more quickly on LPG than on shore power. Even then, we run it overnight before loading it up.

In terms of carpeting, if it's OK with your wife, replacing carpet tiles is easy and inexpensive. It will be better for your wife than the current carpet. We put our's down with double-sided carpet tape. If you plan on ultimately replacing all the floors with laminate at some point (I wouldn't recommend wood with children), inexpensive carpet tiles can be a stopgap for your carpeted areas while you direct your money elsewhere. Home Depot has some for under $1/sq ft. For a more permanent installation go for a good, commercial grade carpet tile.

Protecting against roof leaks is your first priority along with ensuring that the edges of your fiberglass roof are properly sealed. Here's a good video on this to complement the info in Jim_HiTek's great blog:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDd3NrdWSQA&t=417s

Winnebago has some great owner resources, including detailed electrical and plumbing diagrams. My suggestion is to download everything you might need so you have access without internet access. If you download to a tablet or laptop that you'll take with you on trips, all the better:

https://www.winnebago.com/owners/owner-resources

In closing, you might want to go to the User CP in the toolbar and create a signature block with all the info on your MH. That way we'll all know what you have even if you forget to mention it in your posts.

[Jim_HiTek]

One thing you should check right away is if the chassis batts have a decent aux charging system built in. My '02 Journey did not.

Check the voltage when you're connected to shore power and when you're not. Simple job to measure the voltage across them in both situations. Should be around 13.xx volts in either case. If not, you need to protect those chassis batts from dry camping or parked discharge by installing a Trik-L-Start. You could also just install a standard float 1.5 amp battery charger that plugs into a powered outlet. If you don't see 13.xx across the chassis batteries when parked, no shore power, but nice sunshine, then the solar panel is too small. Usually they come with a 10 watt on the roof. That's 0.8 amp. Totally worthless. Some people change them to 100 watt or had that installed as an option during those years so check if you have that.

You can avoid doing anything by just disconnecting the grounds from the chassis batts and the jumper from between the 6 volt set(s) when it's stored. That way you can store the RV dry, no shore power needed. I like to store it powered though (15 amp circuit is fine) so the refer and converter (battery charger) are always running. Seems that if you run that type of refer continuously, they have the potential to last for decades (like both of mine so far). If you only run them during your excursions, they only last ~7 years.

[BobC]

Since it's summer, you'll be wanting to use your air conditioner, which is commonly referred to as "basement air". It's originally made by Coleman (6535 series) and, it there are a number of things you should know.

1. It has two compressors #1 and #2. #1 will start first, followed by #2. Both will run on 30A, if you're not running anything else of significant wattage. You may or may not be able to run it at all if you're plugged into a residential outlet at your house. Mine will run compressor #1 on my 20A household service but I have a heavy duty marine grade extension cord. Each compressor also has its own breaker. You shouldn't any such issue when on 50A shore power or on generator power. I don't know about your's, but my generator has two breakers, one for 30A and one for an additional 20A, so, if your's has two, make sure both are on.

2. When in heat pump mode, it's operation is integrated with your LPG furnace and uses it for initial heating, depending on the temperature differential between your set point and the ambient temperature.

3. There are often short time lags between changing thermostat settings and operation, so, when testing things out, be patient and give it time to work.

Here's a link to the service manual that will be helpful. The Owner's manual is also available online, but the service manual has everything you need and more:

http://www.rvcomfort.com/pdf_documen...6323_copy8.pdf

These are great units but they do develop age-related problems so let us know if your's is OK or not. Often it's as simple are replacing the start and run capacitors (easy DIY). There are several current threads on these issues. Use the Google search block near the top of the page and search on "basement air".

[Maddmike]

Great points and resources.


We are going to be out of town starting this Friday and even though we have a hotel and an air BNB, I think my wife secretly wants to take the Journey. I did think of running the generator but thought that it may kill my MPG. How much does it affect it? My three-year-old was happy to sweat it out with me on this adventure.



So, that being said, I dropped it off at a independent diesel shop this morning. I had every intention of changing my own oil but working full time right now, time is money. I also noticed there is some play in the steering wheel, nothing terrible and about the same as in the last Ryder truck I rented. I figured a truck place would be better equipped to give it a good once over mechanically than my local mechanic.



So, I asked them to do the following:
AC diagnosis and repair
Oil changes for both the pusher and generator
Check the steering to see if it can be tightened up
And, they will obviously inspect for anything glaring like a frayed belt etc.


If they get it done by Friday morning, we may just take it down.



I do have a 30 amp RV hookup that I installed in my back yard for my trailer that I sold. I ordered an adapter on Amazon to plug in the 50 amp. I also now need to get my driveway and access door extended. It was fun parking it in the dark last night. I attached glow sticks to the fence to be able to see it.


https://photos.app.goo.gl/SzoEdZDvpXS9ZAgY6