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Old 08-23-2013, 11:26 AM   #1
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Journey airbags drop and garage height?

We need to drop the airbags on any newer Journey to get it in and out of our rv garage.

One: Is it possible to drop the airbags, back in the garage, all without levelers coming down or bags reinflating with engine running?

Two: Is it possible to start the engine, drive out of the garage, without
inflating the airbags?

Our garage, after remodeling the door, measures 12'10" at the entrance
and in the middle of the 42' space.

The salesmen seem unfamiliar or give conflicting information. We love the Journeys and hope we don't have to start looking at other manufacturers.
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Old 08-23-2013, 12:15 PM   #2
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I am guessing that 12'10" is enough. Back in slowly with person on ladder to watch clearance. I backed a Monaco Dynasty into my building (12' 0"to bottom of trusses) with 1/4" clearance. It was enough, never had a problem. Haven't yet decided what to do about current coach.
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Old 08-23-2013, 12:46 PM   #3
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Your coach, the 34B, is our first choice. So, you think we can manually operate
the airbags to go in and out in the dropped position?

We have never had a diesel pusher so we're unclear about manual vs. automatic operation.
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Old 08-23-2013, 02:23 PM   #4
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It may be possible, at least to the point where you put it in gear. But, unless you have modified your coach, the high point (unloaded) is 12'10". So with the normal stuff you put in it, plus liquids, it will be less than that. I would think you could back right in.
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Old 08-23-2013, 05:53 PM   #5
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If you do a search on this site, you will find all the answers to your questions and more. It us under the Freightliner forum and was posted just about a month ago. If you would like you can PM me and I can even share some of what I did. I have the same dimensions on the garage as you and have a 42 Tour with same height. Good luck and search for that thread.
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Old 08-24-2013, 06:21 PM   #6
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Going Jessie,
I received your reply and sent a reply. Hope that helps
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Old 08-25-2013, 02:30 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Going Jessie View Post
We need to drop the airbags on any newer Journey to get it in and out of our rv garage.

One: Is it possible to drop the airbags, back in the garage, all without levelers coming down or bags reinflating with engine running?

Two: Is it possible to start the engine, drive out of the garage, without
inflating the airbags?

Our garage, after remodeling the door, measures 12'10" at the entrance
and in the middle of the 42' space.

The salesmen seem unfamiliar or give conflicting information. We love the Journeys and hope we don't have to start looking at other manufacturers.
Going Jessie,
It never ceases to amaze me that no one "clears things up" when answering. First off, the first thing you need to find out is, what EXACT leveling system are you referring to? The reason, AN IMPORTANT ONE, I say that is, if you have the HWH 625 system, it is a fully automatic and a MANUAL operated system. And being such, YOU have control over when the bags are dumped and, REFILLED! Not the coach/chassis. And, not surprisingly, many salesmen/women are CLUELESS when it comes to actual operations of some of the components of the rigs they're supposed to be selling.

You see, in the HWH 625 SYSTEM, there is a "dump" button on the leveling panel and, a "STORE" button on the panel. The dump button ONLY DUMPS THE AIR, it does not apply the levelers/jacks. You can start up that engine 10 times and it will NOT fill the bags!

If, you have that system, the bags will only fill when the STORE button is pushed. And, if the jacks were down and the STORE button is pushed, the bags will begin to fill and, jacks will retract to the traveling position.

So, to answer part of your question, yes, you can "drop" the bags and drive/back into your garage. But, to answer your height of the rig VS height of the rig, I would NOT pay any attention to the book or, any info plate in or on the vehicle on that one. The main reason I say that is, when accepting new fire trucks for service, one of my jobs was to substantiate the specs. And that was to weight them and, get all the dimensions and compare them to the specs written in the contracts.

As far as height was concerned, they were off by better than 50% of the time. And, in many cases, seriously off.

So, as far as your height thing is concerned, I'd simply verify it in person. While it is just tad bit of a pain, it's easily done. We used a piece of 2"x2"x 10' long aluminum angle. We laid it on the tallest item on the fire truck, (in most cases it was either the code lights, or, spot lights or, anything that was the highest point above the roof line, and, we placed a level on it to make sure it (the angle aluminum) was dead level. Then a tape measure was used at each end, to the ground and when both measurements were the same, that was the ACTUAL HEIGHT! And, don't assume that, just because the angle aluminum is level, that the measurements will be the same. The concrete/pavement can be slanted somewhat.

Now, if you don't have the 625 system, than it would be prudent for you to really check out whatever system is in the coach and, be guided by the operators manual for that particular system. For any of us to ASSUME that your system operates in such a manor that it will permit you to enter or leave your garage, (with the engine running) might be a mistake, always check its operation to verify that it works as it says it's supposed to. I explained the way our 625 system worked because I verified its operation, more than a few times. I can drive that thing all over creation with empty bags, until I press the "Store" button.

I hope I've helped some.
Scott
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Old 08-25-2013, 02:57 PM   #8
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A full and complete answer about a system which the OP does not have. His system does not have a "dump" button, so there is no real manual control.
Using your method, the first thing to find out is how much height he has in his building: He said 12'10". Next thing, what is the height of the coach at the highest point? Advertised as 12' 10". So, will it fit without worrying about airbags? Absolutely, since the height of the coach is a dry weight. The addition of fuel, water, DEF, a driver, plus all the stuff we haul around will drop the coach well below 12'10". Simple, really.
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Old 08-25-2013, 03:18 PM   #9
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Going out on a limb here as I don't have a Journey but on my coach, the ride height control valves are designed to maintain the ride height regardless of load.
Adding more weight in the form of cargo or liquids results in the air system pumping more air in to the bags to bring it back up to normal ride height.
I've not tested it but mine seems to take longer to dump air than to air up again so I suspect I could not KEEP the airbags deflated with the engine running as it would replace the air faster than it is dumped.
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Old 08-25-2013, 03:40 PM   #10
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Mike Cody at Freight liner said dumping air bags and moving MH is risky. you could pinch the air bag and cause a leak. I'd check exactly what chassis you have and call them and get there recommendation. safe travels.. ed
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Old 08-25-2013, 05:32 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mgtr View Post
A full and complete answer about a system which the OP does not have. His system does not have a "dump" button, so there is no real manual control.
Using your method, the first thing to find out is how much height he has in his building: He said 12'10". Next thing, what is the height of the coach at the highest point? Advertised as 12' 10". So, will it fit without worrying about airbags? Absolutely, since the height of the coach is a dry weight. The addition of fuel, water, DEF, a driver, plus all the stuff we haul around will drop the coach well below 12'10". Simple, really.
mgtr,
Well Sir, first off, I don't have any idea what leveling system that the OP "will" have in any Journey that they may procure. I used my system as an example of operations just in case the unit they acquired had that same system. It is a system I'm familiar with and therefor explained it in detail so the OP, and anyone else that has that system, may understand it's operation and capabilities.

Second, they are in search of a Journey, they don't have ANY motorhome yet, let alone any leveling system. Now, as far as their garage entrance height, yes, they did state that it was a given height, not a problem. But, the "advertised" height of a motor home, while it may be close, might not be all that accurate. Knowing how far off many manufacturers are in some specs for their products, I sure as heck would not trust an "advertised" height. If I had anywhere near the potential for damage, I'd take the time to verify the actual height of the rig.

If I proved the advertised spec correct, then that's great, but, if it was off, especially in the fact that it was higher than advertised, I'd sure be glad I checked it. Pretty tough to explain damage, however slight or severe it might be, if some occurred when backing in and, the advertised height was not what it said it was.

I have no idea what leveling systems come on any new rig, Journey or otherwise. Because it is a sister company to our Itasca and, it's possible that maybe it might have the same leveling system as ours, I use ours as an example and was trying to convey the fact that, they could lower the bags manually, drive or back in without fear of the bags re-inflating while the engine was running. If they don't have the same system as ours or, one that at least works the same, then they'll have to go to plan B.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chawkins99 View Post
Going out on a limb here as I don't have a Journey but on my coach, the ride height control valves are designed to maintain the ride height regardless of load.
Adding more weight in the form of cargo or liquids results in the air system pumping more air in to the bags to bring it back up to normal ride height.
I've not tested it but mine seems to take longer to dump air than to air up again so I suspect I could not KEEP the airbags deflated with the engine running as it would replace the air faster than it is dumped.
chawkins99,
You are correct in the operation of the ride height sensors and keeping the correct ride height, no matter what the load is. I know because I installed a 300 lb. "Hydralift" motorcycle lift/carrier on the back of our coach, and then, loaded on that lift, a 900 lb. Honda GL 1800 Goldwing that's very close to 900 lbs. That rig rode at the exact same height with or, without that lift and the bike. And it did it in front as well as the back. A very fine system if you ask me.

But, what we were talking about is, if the leveling system, could dump the bags, to create much needed clearance in the top area of his/her rig while backing into their garage. Now, if the leveling system does not have that capability or option, then, like stated above, go to plan B.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EDALLSAILS View Post
Mike Cody at Freight liner said dumping air bags and moving MH is risky. you could pinch the air bag and cause a leak. I'd check exactly what chassis you have and call them and get there recommendation. safe travels.. ed
EDALLSAILS,
Yes Sir, I agree, it's not a good practice to drive around with the bags deflated, provided you have a system like the HWH 625 System which, would allow that to happen. But, no one said anything about driving around with it deflated. It would only be done, in a straight line, just for moving the coach in or out of its barn stall. Besides, at least on mine, if you tried to drive and turn while the bags were deflated, you'd end up with some immediate fender damage due to the fact that the tires would run into them. There are numerous threads abound that are talking about just this very situation. There is one on this forum at present:

http://www.irv2.com/forums/f26/do-yo...ge-161805.html

Scott
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Old 08-27-2013, 04:07 PM   #12
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Thanks to all for the information concerning my question about airbags and our garage height of 12'10".

Today, the 2013 Journey 34B was brought to our house. First we experimented with the airbags and measured how far the coach dropped. It was a good 4", if we didn't have a precise measurement. The salesman then positioned the rig in front of the garage opening. We had a tall ladder positioned at the opening and used our phones to talk to each other.

After dropping the air (and not touching the levelers at all), he inched into the garage. There was plenty of room above the air conditioners, a good 4 or more inches. There was so much room, in fact, that we next tried backing in without dropping the air at all.

It would have worked BUT the real problem turned out to be the T-shaped tv antenna! It probably would have cleared, but we didn't want to risk it.

I still don't know what levelers we have but it doesn't appear to matter. The air can be dropped and it is easy to back in. The wheel well cut-out on this model is wide enough to be able to completely turn the wheel without running into the fender.

The airbags do slowly re-inflate when one starts driving out, but it is easy to dump them until one is beyond the tv antenna.

Duncan is correct. There is no "dump" or "store" setting on the 34B airbags as far as I remember. I didn't operate the vehicle today. Left that to the salesman since he still owns the vehicle.

So all is well. She looked good sitting in our remodeled garage and we have good clearance front and back. Since the full-length of the garage is 42', we quickly got over our consideration of a 40U because the shoe is a pretty tight fit now.

BTW, the salesman said they drove a couple of blocks in a Journey with the airbags dumped when he toured the factory. That may be filed under the category, "The salesman said." I certainly have no way of verifying at this point. We just needed to drive as far as clearing the door, less than 40'.

Again, thanks to all and thanks for the pms, Funtime.

Now all we have to do is start the negotiation process.
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Old 08-27-2013, 06:02 PM   #13
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Going Jessie.
Thanks for posting the results and glad you could get it in. Sounds like all is well. I am curious about the following: Another poster and you said something like "there is no dump air button on this model". So how did you dump the air before you entered the garage? There has to be button or a method of dumping the air for you to have done that? Just curious or did I not understand something here?. Have fun and good luck. That is a great model you are buying.
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Old 08-27-2013, 07:15 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by fun time View Post
Going Jessie.
Thanks for posting the results and glad you could get it in. Sounds like all is well. I am curious about the following: Another poster and you said something like "there is no dump air button on this model". So how did you dump the air before you entered the garage? There has to be button or a method of dumping the air for you to have done that? Just curious or did I not understand something here?. Have fun and good luck. That is a great model you are buying.
That's EXACTLY what I was going to ask too. A button, somewhere, had to be pushed, labeled something, to dump the air. Just exactly what does the label for that button, lever, whatever is actuated, say? Then we all learn.
Scott

On edit: Going Jessie,
If you click on the link I'm adding here, then, look at the listed height of your intended coach, I think it will state: 12' 10". But, as I stressed in my post, "do get a measurement of your particular coach" for your assurance of it. Well, on that spec page of that brochure, scroll on down to the foot notes. Read number 1.
Scott
http://www.gowinnebago.com/products/...pecifications/
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Old 08-27-2013, 09:33 PM   #15
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If it is a 2013 or 2014 it will have a Lippert Component Inc (LCI) leveler system. Here is the procedure for the air bags:
The Manual Air Bag Dump/Fill functions as follows:
  1. Set park brake.
  2. Scroll up twice to "Manual Air Control".
  3. Press enter.
  4. Now press rear arrow to dump, front arrow to fill.
Does this help?

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Old 08-27-2013, 11:37 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by dengraham View Post
If it is a 2013 or 2014 it will have a Lippert Component Inc (LCI) leveler system. Here is the procedure for the air bags:


The Manual Air Bag Dump/Fill functions as follows:
  1. Set park brake.
  2. Scroll up twice to "Manual Air Control".
  3. Press enter.
  4. Now press rear arrow to dump, front arrow to fill.
Does this help?

dengraham,
Roger that Sir. I've had Power Gear and, our present one is HWH. I've heard of Lippert but, have not seen any in person. Learn something every day. And, based on you instructions here, it appears the DRIVER, has total control of the dumping and refilling of the bags. It's almost identical to our HWH 625 system. Thanks for the heads up.
Scott
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