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Old 03-22-2016, 07:02 AM   #1
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Considering 16 Grand Tour

Have recently added the Grand Tour to our list of possible (3rd DP Coach).
Drove one recently and really liked how it felt, handled etc.
Have SOB now that is moving to a new owner.
The Front Seats are most comfortable I have been in. The floor plans available are good, but DW is not liking the "gaudiness of furniture appointments and wood trim, but of course that is a personal preference.

We know all manufacturers are not perfect but would like to get opinions or experience with the following:

Schwitech slides..... IS this still problematic as noted in the 13 Tour Threads
The day we drove in moderate winds, noise was coming from the Driver Side windshield "A" piller. This may have been situational but is it a normal issue?
I know Dealer service is different from place to place, but how is factory support and service.
Any comments or preferences for the FL Maxum Chassis?
I was considering a coach with side radiator, and this does not have one....understanding that side provides more airflow, any thoughts?
Front suspension was very nice as was overall handling.
Any Dealers references where experiences were mostly positive?

Winne was a last thought to consider, not sure why but once we saw it, drove it, we liked it. Newmar Dutch Star is another finalist.

Appreciate your comments .

Sal
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Old 03-22-2016, 12:28 PM   #2
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Can't speak to your specific model... but I can attest to excellent customer support I received from the factory...

We were about 1-1/2 years out of warranty, but they still fixed our issues when we arrived at Forest City, IA (no charge)... very nice bunch of people who seemed to take pride in their work.. I think that is all you can ask for..

Good luck... My GF absolutely LOVES the Ellipse Ultra... but we're a few years away from that purchase...
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Old 03-22-2016, 12:53 PM   #3
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A bit of topic response. We took delivery of a 2016 Journey in November. The slide issue was resolved during the later 2015 production cycle. I know what you mean about the interior. Looks like a cross between a bordello and my mother's living room. Winnebago support is top notch. Had to call them on a couple of items and they were very helpful. Really do like the pilot and co pilot chairs. The Freightliner chassis drives more like a big pickup truck than a class A. Very stable. The 400 HP Cummins delivered between 7.9 and 8.2 over 2500 miles of driving this winter.
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Old 03-22-2016, 01:07 PM   #4
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Winnebago had a 2017 Grand Tour at the Tampa RV show and it had the side radiator. You may want to wait a few more months if that is your preference. Not sure when you can order the 2017.

Good luck on your search and I hope which ever coach you decide on provides you many trouble free miles.
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Old 03-22-2016, 01:57 PM   #5
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Have inserted some thoughts below ... our 15 Ellipse is on the same chassis ... best wishes and safe travels ...

1. Schwitech slides..... IS this still problematic as noted in the 13 Tour Threads
- We've had no problems with the slides; we regularly clean the tracks and lube the motors, and make sure vehicle is level and engine running to extend/retract.

2. The day we drove in moderate winds, noise was coming from the Driver Side windshield "A" piller. This may have been situational but is it a normal issue?
- A head-on or left angled wind does cause us some noise, not constant or annoying. Check to see if the 'wind diffuser' is attached at the very front lower corner of the driver's side window - if absent there will definitely be a racket.

3. I know Dealer service is different from place to place, but how is factory support and service.
- Have been to the factory twice for work - can't compliment the entire team enough for quality of work and courtesy. Have also called for diagnostics and they are great.

4. Any comments or preferences for the FL Maxum Chassis?
- A large part of our purchase decision was having this chassis for its stability, load capability, extensive dealer network and outstanding 24/7 phone service with the national call center.

5. I was considering a coach with side radiator, and this does not have one....understanding that side provides more airflow, any thoughts?
- I've been in more fireside chats about this topic than I can remember, and opinions are all over the map. This is the only DP we've owned so here's what I can share: in 13K of driving, often in temperatures over 90 degrees and up and down most of the western mountains - with good RPM control we've never seen an overheat. I would like to have better access to clean the radiator 'face' but my limited visual shows it staying pretty clean up to now.

6. Front suspension was very nice as was overall handling.
- The weight distribution of the coach is well thought out and with 295s on the front at 120#s and 275s on the rear at 90#s all-around our 40K weight rides very nice. We do not experience sway, rocking or porpoising. Please get the rig weighed once loaded to set your tire pressures - gives you the best balance of safety and ride comfort.

7. Any Dealers references where experiences were mostly positive?
- We allow the following folks to take care of us - and recommend all of them without reservation.
-- Winnebago factory service center - Forest City, IA
-- Freightliner factory service center - Gaffney, SC
-- Lichtsinn RV - Forest City, IA
-- Dakota RV - Rapid City, SD
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Old 03-22-2016, 04:22 PM   #6
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Review of 2015 Grand Tour 42QL (Rental)

BigDogSolo, I can share with you our week-long rental of a 2015 Grand Tour 42QL, which had every bell and whistle available. We rented from here http://www.sharemycoach.com/Vehicle-...20%201883.aspx

This coach only had Under 3k miles, and looked factory fresh. Three days before our rental, they told us they'd had a problem with the kitchen/living room slide and weren't sure they were going to be able to get it operational in time. I pressed to have our orientation the day prior to leaving (thank God!), where we discovered only one of three A/C units was working, and neither of the outdoor slides would work (This was a black coach and we were headed to the desert in 90F+ temps). To their credit, they got the awnings fixed and drove 4 hours round trip to get a single replacement A/C (still short one).

The Drive - Not only did we drive freeways, but we took some very windy state roads to Anza Borrego...in the dark. We didn't have a toad, but the coach only felt light on power a few times. The dirt tractor - double trailer didn't have a problem keeping up with us (not sure if it was full, but suspect not). Unlike other motorhomes, the headlights were excellent! As was the ride, mirrors and suspension. The latches on the residential refrigerator...not so much. We had three "self dispensing" episodes, and it's a wonder we didn't crack a tile (Use HD Velcro strap ~ we purchased one). On our way back, we left in very heavy winds, and didn't feel them at all - even when being intermittenly broadsided by them (Found and used Comfort Steering dial at the bottom of the steering column by your knees). Skylight over driver area especially nice! Close quarter turning - okay. Couldn't get into angled drive-through space without multi-point turning, despite dumping tag. (Passive tag steering would have been huge help!)

Exterior Storage - Very lacking! This coach had the optional outdoor kitchen (small fridge or freezer, with single induction burner on a sliding cabinet with a hose connection) that took over the rear most bay. The only remaining bay was frustrating, as the full bay sliding platform starts very high up due to chassis, leaving lower "cubbys" that are further bisected by a support rod. It was difficult to get (2) mtn bikes, (1) Coleman camp stove, (3) camp chairs, (1) laundry basket of fire wood and (2) full size traffic cones into bays. Not a coach for long term camping! (Though very good lighting system!)

Living Room - Even though we couldn't deploy the LR/Kit slid out, the LR worked well. The concept of the "L" shaped couch is good, but the "disappearing" section is very short...leaving you to tend to "slip onto the floor" (This may have been due to the fact that the coach refused to level, the jack mechanism finally failing completely in a driver's side/nose down angle) The TV was on the full wall slide, so viewing was great (it also angled out, with the area behind hosting a bar and safe). Thank goodness it wasn't above the windshield or we couldn't have seen it with one slide in! The recliner was very comfy and the work station adjacent to it was perfect. You'll need additional small table(s), as there's no where to put anything. While black, high gloss flooring looks nice, it shows everything! Even removing shoes will not stop regular, several times a day cleaning. Toe kick for central vac makes that easier, though with "sucking at floor level" ~ just sweep it all in! Lighting with Centrex system very good.

Kitchen - Good counterspace, especially with pull out counter extension, but definitely a 1-person kitchen. Whirlpool microwave/convection oven can't be heated above 350F in oven mode, and took a long, long time to pre-heat (even with 50 amp connection) (Also had a fault/shut down that required the fuse at the end of the bed to be flipped/reset ~ twice). Pantry is decent but dish storage badly laid out - you can see it, but you can't get it out in split cabinets above sink. Not a huge fan of the induction stove top....not intuitive to operate, but it worked. Never figured out how to unlock the dishwasher, but didn't need it. French door refrig worked fine, but could never get it to make ice. And the freezer latches to the left refrigerator door...so if it comes open in transit, everything opens.

Half Bath - Actually well laid out and roomy. Toilet with bidet an over-the-top option!

Master - Sleep number-like bed very comfy! Ceiling fan didn't do much at all. The bed came with 1,000 pillows, so cabinet space was all taken (Unless you wanted them in a huge pile on the floor!). Electric shades and Centrex system made for black-out darkness. TV nicely positioned, but they need an electrical outlet at either or both nightstands. And no clock!

Master Bath - Actually well laid out and roomy. Shower good sized. Washer/Dryer - never used, but weird in front of the toilet (again, equipted with bidet!). Clever towel storage using otherwise wasted space.

Systems

AC - The good news is that the AC units share a common plenum, so we could direct what little AC we were producing to the area that needed it. Still couldn't cope with 90+ heat with 2 AC's - even with all shades and exterior awnings out.

AquaHot - The water was perfect from the engine heat after the drive out. But even with 50 amp hook ups, could not get decent hot water after that ~ even firing up the diesel option. Part of it may be Centrex - controls. White turns to blue - which is on? We were outside when we heard the diesel burner kick on (confirmed from exhaust)...but there was no demand, so why then? Why not when we were trying to shower? Then there was a "diesel burner" button that wasn't explained anywhere. We went from 90+ to low 50's....couldn't get the heating system to work at all. And heat pump from AC wasn't up to the task. "We froze our Royal butts off" my wife deadpanned. Heated floors would have been heavenly!

Batteries/Generator - We boondocked for three days. Even starting with fully charged batteries, couldn't go 24 hours without running the genny ~ at that was without any other draw (no cooking, tv, lights - we were out of the coach for a complete day, came back to "low batt" warning). We were told inverters must stay on for Fridge, but they either need more batteries or better energy management. Just seems like something was wrong.

Outside Awnings - Patio Awnings (dual) Very nice, especially with drop down and built in LED lighting. An absolute must for an all-black coach! Manual awnings over windows seems cheap on a coach at this price tag, but very needed!

Grey/Black Tanks - Even though we had full hook ups, we didn't hook up the sewer connections until the last day. We wanted to see how long it would last. Over a 4 day period, including a couple of (almost warm) showers and hand washing dishes, both tanks were only at 33%, and that's with both toilets being used (not positive, but think macserator is on both). Went to use Santicon system...but no additional hose provided.

Exterior Entertainment - Large TV that can be pulled out and angled is built into the side, at a convenient height (release for pull out somewhat hidden at bottom). Includes sound bar for good sound. Never used exterior kitchen, but might have if entertaining (at least fridge, to keep from tracking in). LED lighting strip on awnings very nice for evening use. While this is an all-electric coach, there's a spot on the driver side for strapping down a propane tank that connects to a hose on the curb side for BBQ connection ~ very nice!

Navigation - Came with RV Rand McNally that proved to be very helpful, except that it didn't show real severity of bends in twisty road. Interesting that it also displayed actual speed against speed limit. But the main screen couldn't be completely shut off ~ very strange.

Rear/Side Cameras - Very useful and even worked in low-light/no light.

While this coach was just at a year old with under 3,000 miles, there were a ton of "teething problems" that really needed to be worked out. Missing one of the three slides wasn't perfect (and wouldn't have worked if it we'd had more than just the two of us...). While this coach lacked for nothing, I'm not sure we'd ever purchase it. Certainly not with a black exterior and black interior flooring for sure! Lack of basement space a huge issue, otherwise, it was nice. Another rental with all systems working may change our view to some degree...but only by degrees.
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Old 03-22-2016, 09:17 PM   #7
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Many Thanks for....

taking the time to respond to my post with the details you all kindly provided. Nice to hear that the factory can be relied upon because in my experience, dealers don't seem to be able to keep up.

Steve, And Mark..... thank you for the excellent "play by play" to my questions and Mark for your detailed point by point review. Very helpful on both counts.

I would say there are probably little changes in the 16 from the 15 model, but as I think someone mentioned, they are making changes with a 45RL model that will come in at an additional 40k MSRP with side radiator and a large real master bath (double sinks and full wardrobe). I am thinking at this point that puts it at a price level I probably don't want to entertain.
They are also making some interior changes away from the "brothel look". But as my coach gets a new home next week, Im not sure I will want to wait months for those to show up at any cost.
Thanks again for the excellent help.

regards,
Sal
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Old 03-23-2016, 06:47 AM   #8
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The tour has 3 A/C units not 2 as the rental guy states


From the brochure


Heating & Cooling System








TrueAir® Maximum Comfort A/C 3-13,500 BTU








roof air conditioners w/2 heat pumps and 3


condensation pumps






Aqua-Hot® 450 hydronic dual-zone heating


system w/continuous hot water and engine


pre-heat


Triple-zone thermostat






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Old 03-23-2016, 09:13 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rream View Post
The tour has 3 A/C units not 2 as the rental guy states
You are correct! But in our case, one of them (the center one) was broken, so we only had two that were operational. And of those two, one of them was only able to run at 50%.... I'm sorry if I didn't make that clear.
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Old 03-23-2016, 06:05 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rream View Post
The tour has 3 A/C units not 2 as the rental guy states


From the brochure


Heating & Cooling System








TrueAir® Maximum Comfort A/C 3-13,500 BTU








roof air conditioners w/2 heat pumps and 3


condensation pumps






Aqua-Hot® 450 hydronic dual-zone heating


system w/continuous hot water and engine


pre-heat


Triple-zone thermostat






Actually one of the first things he said was that only 1 of the 3 air conditioners was working. And then he stated they replaced one and so had 2 of the 3 working.
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