Auto Leveling Question

[Scotty B]

I finally got my zero point set up nearly perfectly.
When I use auto level, the high side rear jack (the side that isn't raised to level the coach) often ends up not in touch with the ground - by several inches sometimes. This jack is the first to get grounded in the process, but comes up when the other side is lowered.
What are your thoughts? Is this OK and the way the system should operate?
I think it would allow for additional movement of the couch as one corner is on the suspension so I have manually lowered that corner to be in firm contact with the ground.
Appreciate your thoughts and feedback!

[Morich]

Sounds like a slight bit of trouble with the system.
As I understand it? The system lowers the jacks to ground them. Then it applies pressure to the jacks in sets like two front, two back, two left, etc. So when it finds the rear is low, it should be sending pressure to BOTH rear jacks and they each put the same amount of pressure on the ground to lift. Same for any of the sets of jacks. When one is not going down as it has no force working against it as it lifts off the ground, it has to be missing the same fluid pressure as the other one in that set.
I would guess there is a problem with the solenoids getting the same pressure to match the sets.
Basic idea is that there should never be a situation where a twist is working on the RV frame as in three jacks down and one not holding any weight.

If you have the HWH book in the info pack, it will explain the process much better!

[dkoldman]

I am a little slow following the descriptions of what you are saying because at first I thought you were referring to a raised tire.

I auto level all the time unless I am specifically only wanting to lift the front or the rear, then I go manual but they both go down in pairs.

If you are saying your auto level will level or try to level with one jack not touching the ground, I would think that to be a concern?

I have never had to zero mine out, but I love to watch it work. It will get all 4 jacks on the ground and then start to pump to get it perfectly level. Most of the time I am leveling it really for the support to let slide out. I try to park on level surfaces whenever possible. I will pass on sites that are unlevel. I have seen some with steep inclines.

[Scotty B]

Thx and sorry for the confusion. Appreciate your answers.
System is Lippert. Manual page is attached. Rereading it helped.
It first grounds the front ones at the same time. I can't manually move the front ones independently of each other and don't recall the auto level doing it either.
Then if the rig tilts to the right, it lowers the left rear jack first until grounded, opposit if the rig tilts left. Then it grounds the other side and continues to extend it until level.
That disrupts the front to back level so it cycles through the different steps until happy.
That normally leaves the rear jack initially grounded off the ground.
I see in both point 9's that all jacks should be on the ground so have answered my question that way.
It seems maybe the system is grounding the wrong rear jack first? Or I might be confusing highest and lowest sides.
Hope this is clearer.
And yes, it is a concern, hence my post!

[Morich]

Ok. Different system that works different than what I have used!

[dkoldman]

Does your actual unit say Power Gear? I think Power Gear may be owned by Lippert.

We may have the exact same system as I have Power Gear Electronic Leveling.

If so; also read the section about Selecting a Site. Makes a huge difference. If you see blinking orange lights, it is NOT a good site and you should consider moving or not extended the jacks or slide. Based on where the orange light is you know the low portion of the RV.

A lot of people manually level so they may go right past this as they must know what they are doing. I don't, if it won't auto level I move on to another site or do not use. We don't have to have slide out in our model, it is just a nice to have for more space.

[Ray,IN]

What is the model number of your leveling system? https://support.lci1.com/power-gear-...eveling-system

[Wyatt]

My Lippert power gear system does exactly what you mentioned, in terms of auto leveling attributes.
Often in auto level mode, I’d find one jack in the rear completely off of the ground, so I’d just manually level until it touched—for better stability.

That said, in auto level mode, it frequently kept tweaking the rear jack left to right, and then the front jacks, (as a pair), in order to compensate for the rise in the rear.

I find it so much easier to use the manual mode, along with the LevelMate Pro, to dial it in and keep the entire rig, (and entry steps), lower to the ground—which also—helps with stability.

For example, with the LevelMatePro, I can drive into a site and already see EXACTLY which jack needs what. Sometimes that requires a landing pad under one of the front jacks legs to get it perfectly level, without the need to raise a left or right rear jack.

[creativepart]

Scott, we camped at a place two weeks ago that this exact thing happened to me. My right rear Jack was off the ground 2”. The motorhome was stable inside and this was not noticeable at all.

However, this was a function of the site we were in. The back of the campsite fell away from level at the back and the right side had a faster drop. So, both rear jacks were bottomed out but the right side was left not touching the ground.

I had to go dump during our stay and when I returned to the site I pulled in farther to avoid the drop off and then all four Jack were on the ground.

[Ray,IN]

From reading on various forums, that is a common occurance with gas chassis MH's because of the limited jack length.
Air ride chassis drop approx, 6" when air springs are deflated. This gives more effective/usable length of stroke to the jack pistons.

[wyocamper]

When I first got my coach I tried to use the auto level but it always ended up with the front wheels way off the ground, even if I started from near level. So now I just use manual mode, fronts down till solid contact, then rears, then adjust front-to-back and side-to-side as necessary.

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by wyocamper

When I first got my coach I tried to use the auto level but it always ended up with the front wheels way off the ground, even if I started from near level. So now I just use manual mode, fronts down till solid contact, then rears, then adjust front-to-back and side-to-side as necessary.

I hear this quite a bit. When I 1st bought RV I was preparing to manual level as that seem like the fashion statement. But I auto level all the time, never have a wheel off the ground. Sometimes it will tell me or not level of it is not safe. I just move the coach.

If I were to look at getting another coach and the Auto level didn't work, I would NOT buy it or have WBGO and/or Power Gear fix it. Auto level is suppose to work, I would think.

It is really fast anyway. I have one of those Camco digital levelers with red and green lights that always confirm what Power Gear says.

[Scotty B]

Great conversation!
The situation I mentioned is not related to an uneven site. Even happens at places with concrete pads like ORI or LVM.
Interestingly my factory settings were OK side to side, but it would raise the front .8 degrees high with the front wheels usually off of the ground, so I also started manually leveling.
After 7 years of leveling a travel trailer with the hitch jack and boards for side to side, I was so disappointed my "magic button " didn't work!
The AL now does make the coach level when I finally reset the zero point. The only thing I would do differently is get it level with the slide outs, bring them in, and then do the zero point reset to compensate for the small changes the slides make when extended.
Guess I'll keep using the AL, but just make sure both rear jacks end up grounded manually like I have been doing.
Hope you all had a happy Easter!
Safe travels and God bless!
PS took this pic last night in Southern Oregon. Thought the contrast in WBGO models was pretty neat...

[Scotty B]

Ha! Wrong pic...

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by Scotty B

Ha! Wrong pic...

Really nice coach, the Big Brother to what we have

I was told by Dealer and WBGO to Auto Level first, if for some reason it goes out of level based on Camco Digital leveler that is on the floor, they say you may optionally Auto Level again. I have never had to do that. They also said never ever slide supports on the outside. I am sure it has some impact, but it is not enough top tell me I am out of level.

I tried Manually leveling the first two months based on what everybody was saying. I started Auto Leveling and never looked back.

This is what I have, https://www.amazon.com/Camco-25505-E...256958046&th=1 it always ends in 4 green lights after Power Gear has said was level.

Letting out the slide the 4 green LEDs stay lit.

[danhannah]

Lippert auto level button:

Often leaves a back jack in the air --- check.
Often raises the front end way more than necessary - check.
Often spends 5 minutes fine tuning - check.

I don't use it anymore - I've gotten very adept at looking at the lights and manually levelling in just a few seconds.

Tip: Press "Arrow Up" just once, then hit enter - you're rapidly into manual mode. Put the jacks down on the side, or the end, that is highest - not lit up - just touching, then tune with the jacks that are lit.

[dkoldman]

Originally Posted by danhannah

Lippert auto level button:

Often leaves a back jack in the air --- check.
Often raises the front end way more than necessary - check.
Often spends 5 minutes fine tuning - check.

I don't use it anymore - I've gotten very adept at looking at the lights and manually levelling in just a few seconds.

Tip: Press "Arrow Up" just once, then hit enter - you're rapidly into manual mode. Put the jacks down on the side, or the end, that is highest - not lit up - just touching, then tune with the jacks that are lit.

Can I ask why people call Power Gear Leveling systems Lippert, or is there another Lippert Leveling system that is not Power Gear?

I have never seen any of those things with my Power Gear I assume owned by Lippert? 2 minutes to level every time, not sure how you measure front being raised more than necessary because if it were it would not be level, that sounds like a defective product?

When I 1st bought my RV I use to do what you say, I followed the masses because a lot folks complained of Auto Leveling. I actually went the other way with to Auto Level the press of just one button because it was easier IMO.

I am not following why people have auto level systems that they say do not auto level? If Auto leveling stopped working and out of warranty, maybe I can buy that. But my guess short of the Auto level needing to be re-zeroed or defective some people prefer that control because they simply know how to do it.

Let me ask this, if your Auto Level works would you use it?

[danhannah]

Mine is a 2014 - maybe before the Power Gear name was used. There is no reference to the name Power Gear on any of my documents. Did WBO buy Power Gear and begin to use the name? The buttons and the controllers look like the newer ones marked Power Gear.

My Auto Level is correctly zeroed - and works well maybe 75% of the time, but those times that I have to start over because of the above problems causes me to use manual.

If it worked 100% of the time - and if it always raised the coach the minimal amount to achieve level, yes, answer to your question, I would definitely use it!

I guess the raising too high part is the most annoying.

Cheers

[creativepart]

Winnebago does not own Power Gear.

Drew Industries purchased Power Gear and Kwikee in June, 2014

Drew Industries was wholly owned by Lippert Controls Incorporated, (LCI) and seems to be fully absorbed into LCI now.

Here is a website with all of Lipperts's brands:

https://www.lci1.com/brands/

Lippert owns large numbers of suppliers for the RV and boating industries.

To get a better picture of how prevalent Lippert products are in your RV check out this webpage. LCI supplies a large percentage of the products that make up your RV.

http://techsupport.pdxrvwholesale.co...EM-Catalog.pdf

[dkoldman]

So that explains alot for me. Power Gear makes the leveling systems for both jacks and the slides for my 2019 Sunstar 29ve. I don't think WBGO owns them because they are listed as separate Mfg for the coach? The is big for WBGO because they wish to control 80% of the Mfg? I assume Lippert owns them? If so, maybe Lippert bought them to get out the rathole they must have been in for failing Auto Leveling system which I am 100% must have been happening. Widespread issues were reported.

If you look at my manual and you will see that Power Gear is all over the Leveling system panel. The green LED that flashes all is good has Power Gear.

https://lci-support-doc.s3.amazonaws..._leveling_.pdf

After years of data and ownership, I started getting a little more bold with questions because I have never seen my Unit not work as others were reporting. I was was trying understand why; because it is so easy ( for my unit). From the outside in and I still consider myself on the outside, I have read hundreds on the threads and you would assume that you should always manual level because that is what the experts do. There are plenty of models within Lippert or even Power Gear so the prudent owner should try the auto level procedures. If it does not work and they have warranty, I would get it fix. If it is out of warranty or too costly; I could see manual level as workaround to save money to avoid getting fix. I do acknowledge some units may not be truly fixable; so I wouldn't blindly be naïve to Lippert or Power Gear