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Old 05-15-2008, 08:59 AM   #1
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Join Date: May 2008
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I good friend recently purchased a 07 Tour with the 400 ISL.

He went to get it out of storage and he has no 12-volt working on the coach. I told him to call the dealer (no help) Coach net (no help) I told him to take it in for service; they gave him an appointment in 3 weeks and suggested he call a Mobil mechanic and pay for the call.

He has AC when plugged in, slides do work, generator will not crank, he has no display on his inverter or any coach 12 volt items.

He is not stupid but not the best mechanic and I am not near him. And I own Alfa Gold so I am not familiar with his setup.

I had him read his manuals, reset all the breakers under the bed, and reset the inverter.

Can you provide some insight?

Does his inverter also double as the converter?

Why do his slide work?? Do they bypass the coach systems or are they connected to the chassis batteries?

I also had him push the AUX start to try the gen that was a no go.

His coach does start and the vehicle 12 volt works.

Thanks Paul
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Old 05-15-2008, 08:59 AM   #2
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I good friend recently purchased a 07 Tour with the 400 ISL.

He went to get it out of storage and he has no 12-volt working on the coach. I told him to call the dealer (no help) Coach net (no help) I told him to take it in for service; they gave him an appointment in 3 weeks and suggested he call a Mobil mechanic and pay for the call.

He has AC when plugged in, slides do work, generator will not crank, he has no display on his inverter or any coach 12 volt items.

He is not stupid but not the best mechanic and I am not near him. And I own Alfa Gold so I am not familiar with his setup.

I had him read his manuals, reset all the breakers under the bed, and reset the inverter.

Can you provide some insight?

Does his inverter also double as the converter?

Why do his slide work?? Do they bypass the coach systems or are they connected to the chassis batteries?

I also had him push the AUX start to try the gen that was a no go.

His coach does start and the vehicle 12 volt works.

Thanks Paul
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Old 05-15-2008, 09:15 AM   #3
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When you say he has "no 12 volt working on the coach," what items are exactly not working?


edit: oops, disregard, I didn't read that one paragraph about not having any inverter reading.

So no inverter = no inside lights, no 110, no TV, etc.?
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Old 05-15-2008, 09:27 AM   #4
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When plugged in to a 30 amp outlet(thats what he has) he has 110 volt AC in the coach outlets TVs ect. None of his 12 volt coach systems are working all low voltage. No battery condition display or 12 volt to start the gen.

Thanks
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Old 05-15-2008, 09:38 AM   #5
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I do not have the same coach (mine is a Journey ... one step down from the tour)

On my coach the steps, jacks, and slides are powered by the chassis batteries ... I think his probably are as well ...

There are two other switches on my coach that would come into play in his situation ...
a) the Auxilliary Battery Disconnect switch ... this switch disconnects the house batteries to prevent parasitic drain when the rig is parked ... my switch is a rocker switch on the dash ... it is at exactly the level of my wife's knees (she has turned it OFF on more than one occasion when she closes the windshield drapes) ... when it is OFF you will have no 12V power for lights or anything else in the coach ... (the frig will not work because it requires power even when it is on LP ...)

b) the MOM this switch will couple both the chassis batteries and the house batteries when the Auxiliary Battery Switch is ON

I hope this info is helpful ... even though my coach is slightly different ... Winnebago does not generally change things drastically between coaches
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Old 05-15-2008, 09:48 AM   #6
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Well, until some of the experts here show up, I'll just give you what I know on my coach.

The display on the inverter panel doesn't light up unless the button is pushed that lights the display but that's obvious.

Now, I didn't know this about my coach for the first several months that I had to manually turn on the inverter for all the outlets and TV would work. I thought it would default to the on position for some reason. I know it's stupid but I talked to others that initially didn't know that either. We thought at first that the switch on the dash was what turned the inverter on and off and if that switch was on, the inverter would default to the on setting ...not true.

However, if your friend can't start his genny and there's no reading on the digital voltmeter for either the chassis or house voltage, then I guess there's something else going on than just the inverter not being turned on.


edit: oh good, skiGramp has responded.
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Old 05-15-2008, 09:51 AM   #7
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At this point he is confused on items like the Auxiliary Battery Disconnect switch he is not sure when it is open or closed. Is there a LED when on.. Or on off label on this switch?

I think he tried the MOM switch and had no change in the condition.
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Old 05-15-2008, 10:20 AM   #8
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<span class="ev_code_RED">THAT'S IT!!</span>

It's the Auxiliary Battery Disconect switch.

I just tried mine and if I turn it off, nothing inside the coach works, including neither of the voltage displays. No power to start the genny either.

So, have him look for it on the dash somewhere. Mine on a Journey/Meridian (older model) is on the bank of switches on the right panel of the dash. It's spring loaded and has an on and off label but no LED light. It does, however, make a "squeek" sound when turned on and off.
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Old 05-15-2008, 03:54 PM   #9
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My Auxiliary Battery Disconnect switch is between the intrument panel and the radio / rear view monitor ... and the height of my wife's knee ...

There is no "light" but it "squeeks" when turned on or off ...
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Old 05-15-2008, 04:19 PM   #10
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All the symptoms indicate that the house batteries are disconnected. This is controlled by the Aux Battery Disconnect switch, as the others have mentioned. Have your friend turn on a few overhead lights. If he's able to get the batteries connected, the lights will tell him immediately.

The aux battery switch is spring loaded to the center position and is momentarily toggled to the ON or OFF position which flips the big solenoid that connects or disconnects the batteries.

I would think that he has probably flipped that switch enough that if it was going to work, it would have by now. The switch may have failed or more likely the solenoid. Not sure about this, but I believe there is an automotive spade type fuse mounted right on the solenoid which fuses the control circuit.

On my journey the solenoid is mounted in a box behind the front "hood" along with the breakers - not sure where it is on a Tour, but probably the same.

Good luck and let us know what he finds...
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Old 05-20-2008, 03:53 PM   #11
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I went down to my friends Tour today (he paid for 18 holes 71 to his 73) this is what I did....


I found he left his coach and failed to push the disconnect switch. His house batteries were dead. He then plugged it in to 30 amps his inverter never came to life (no inverter NO charger). Before plugging it in he tries his battery boost it never coupled the house and coach.


I made sure his switches were set correctly then I jumped the generator (I tried the boost switch it failed). The gen started but when I removed the jump it died. I restarted the gen verified AC then I could not get the inverter to come to life.

Very poor design by Winne no inverter charge voltage gen dies. With the gen running on my jump battery I cycled the breaker several times to the inverter it woke up and went into a 115 amp bulk charge cycle.

Everything came to life and normal, I set his inverter settings, turned on several systems AC frig etc.....

I ran his gen for an hour, house batteries came up ( was able to start the gen on the house batteries), I gave him instruction the dam dealer should have done, then advised him to get a portable power source to jump the gen if needed in the future and told him at his leisure to get the boost circuit fixed. I hear the relay kick but it still does not couple the house and chassis circuits.

But that's a minor issue if you know how to deal with it.....

And on a last note my Alfa Gold has several safe guards to prevent this type of a problem. And the dealer and Coach Net should have been able to walk him thru this issue.

Back to my own site

Paul
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Old 05-20-2008, 04:38 PM   #12
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Very poor design by Winne no inverter charge voltage gen dies. With the gen running on my jump battery I cycled the breaker several times to the inverter it woke up and went into a 115 amp bulk charge cycle. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

There could be another explanation for the issue besides poor design. I can turn my inverter off and still have the charger system to the batteries whether on shore power or generator, in fact my inverter turns off automatically when the charger/inverter senses shore power. All the inverter does is supplies 110 volts to the house. The display will say invert-standby override by charger.

This can happen with almost any charging system. If the starting batteries are that low on voltage it could take a while to get enough voltage in the batteries to maintain electricity to run the generator. If there is a magneto in the generator it may have not had enough output to sustain the generator and the 110 voltage to the charger causing the genset to shut down. To much of a load on the generator engine will shut it down.

I think if you would have left the jumper wherever you connected it to to start the generator the system would have started to charged after a while.

I am sure someone will correct me I have misstated anything.

Jim
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Old 05-20-2008, 05:19 PM   #13
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Jim this is why it's a poor design...... when you have 110 volt AC (Gen or plugged in), your inverter senses the battery condition and goes into a charging mode supplying the appropriate charge.... bulk to float. This happens regardless of the inverter being turned on or off by the owner at the hallway display.

Why Winne has a poor design.... is if the inverter fails and your house batteries are dead the Gen set has no voltage circuit to keep it running it relies on the inverter to keep its ignition circuit going (inverter locked up or bad you have no generator).


Another issue with this Tour is the FACT that while running the ISL 400 there was no voltage supplied to charge the house batteries. I would assume this would have something to do with no boost on its boost circuit.

For the time being he can use jumper cables from the lower chassis set of batteries if the need arises again.

Paul
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Old 05-21-2008, 11:07 AM   #14
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It seems to me that the "moral of this story" is

<span class="ev_code_RED">ALWAYS CARRY BATTERY JUMPER CABLES</span>
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