Life on 30 amp Service on a 27N

[rgrimm]

Since this is my first post a little background:

I started RVing with a 39’ TT and then moved to a 36’ 5th wheel, which I sold back in April (2013). We live in NE Florida - originally from Pennsylvania (Lehigh Valley area).

Last November, while in the Elkhart area we stopped at the Motorhome Hall of Fame where we saw a Sunstar 27N that was on display and we were impressed with the unit, its size (length), living space, and storage.

We are looking at getting back into RVing and this time around with a small Class A as we feel it better fits our travel style over that of a towable and the 27N would be #1 on our list to consider – but I have some concerns with only having 30 amp service. Both my TT and 5th wheel were 50 amp services (which in reality is 100 amp service, 50 amp per leg) and we never had to worry what was running. So I have a few questions about life on 30 Amps that perhaps some of you can talk about.

1 - So have any of you 27N owners come from 50 amp RVs?

2 - If I am running the AC/Heat Pump and have the Hot Water heated on electric, what else can I run at the same time?

A coffee pot?
Microwave/Convection Oven?
Can my wife run her Hair Blow Dryer?

3 - Does the 27N have any type of power management system that will automatically shut things off such as the AC/Heat Pump or Hot Water Heater if you turn on the Microwave or a toaster?

We love the 27N, but sure wished Winnebago at least offered the option of 50 amp Service.

4 - Is the single AC/Heat Pump sufficient to keep the 27N cool on a 90/95 degree day?

5 - Does anyone tow a Ford Edge with their 27N?

6 – What kind of MPG are you getting with your 27N?

Thank you in advance for sharing your knowledge relative to my questions.

Russ

[Steve Ownby]

Originally Posted by rgrimm

Since this is my first post a little background: I started RVing with a 39’ TT and then moved to a 36’ 5th wheel, which I sold back in April (2013). We live in NE Florida - originally from Pennsylvania (Lehigh Valley area). Last November, while in the Elkhart area we stopped at the Motorhome Hall of Fame where we saw a Sunstar 27N that was on display and we were impressed with the unit, its size (length), living space, and storage. We are looking at getting back into RVing and this time around with a small Class A as we feel it better fits our travel style over that of a towable and the 27N would be #1 on our list to consider – but I have some concerns with only having 30 amp service. Both my TT and 5th wheel were 50 amp services (which in reality is 100 amp service, 50 amp per leg) and we never had to worry what was running. So I have a few questions about life on 30 Amps that perhaps some of you can talk about. 1 - So have any of you 27N owners come from 50 amp RVs? 2 - If I am running the AC/Heat Pump and have the Hot Water heated on electric, what else can I run at the same time? A coffee pot? Microwave/Convection Oven? Can my wife run her Hair Blow Dryer? 3 - Does the 27N have any type of power management system that will automatically shut things off such as the AC/Heat Pump or Hot Water Heater if you turn on the Microwave or a toaster? We love the 27N, but sure wished Winnebago at least offered the option of 50 amp Service. 4 - Is the single AC/Heat Pump sufficient to keep the 27N cool on a 90/95 degree day? 5 - Does anyone tow a Ford Edge with their 27N? 6 – What kind of MPG are you getting with your 27N? Thank you in advance for sharing your knowledge relative to my questions. Russ

I can answer a few. Our best friends bought a Winnebago Vista 27N which is the same.

4. One A/C is not enough when the temps are in the 92-95 and above range. We were camped with our friends close to Williamsburg, VA in July and our friends were coming over to our place to beat the heat.
5. They tow a Ford Focus & it tows great. No issues.
6. Their MPG towing was in the 6.5- 8 range.

[mrt_1111]

What year/model of Edge?

[rgrimm]

Originally Posted by mrt_1111

What year/model of Edge?

It's a 2013 FWD Edge Limited

[VSPA]

Welcome to the Forum. I went from a 50 amp 2004 Allegro Bay, 8.1 Chevy Vortec with 50 amp to a Winnebago 26P, Ford V-10 with 30 amp and was not at all happy with the available electrical power and one A/C. Like the 27N it only came with 30 amp one A/C which is not near adequate for this end of the country much less anywhere across the southern part of the country. Never had any problems running the A/C and the microwave at the same time. The ride on the shorter F-53 chassis, including our 26P was somewhat like a buckboard and would beat me to death on longer days drives. Towing our '07 Focus on a dolly was a breeze. Could hardly tell it was behind me even on stop and go portions of a trip. After some trial and error with a bad unit, we settled on a 2014 Itasca 35F. Beautiful floor plan, 50 amp service with two A/C units and the larger units on the new F-53 Mor/Ryde chassis ride much better and tows the Focus as well as the smaller unit.

If your ordering one, you might want to see if the power and second A/C can be added at the factory. Had a Class C years ago that I checked into adding the second leg and IIRC, it was going to run about $300 for the labor plus the A/C and other major parts. I traded up to the a fore mentioned Allegro Bay.

[mrt_1111]

A Ford Focus is different from a Ford Edge.

[VSPA]

Originally Posted by mrt_1111

A Ford Focus is different from a Ford Edge.

Ouch! Ya' found me out. Yes, bigger and heavier, but not enough to dramatically change the towing characteristics, especially traveling behind a 8 ft by 12 ft block. I towed my '65 Mustang on a twin axle heavy duty auto hauler on several show trips and other that at lights or stop signs, really could not tell the difference between it and when towing the Focus.

[garykk]

It looks like the only Ac option for yours is a heat pump

http://media.gowinnebago.com/models/...bro_2013_x.pdf

[vsheetz]

Agree one AC is marginal when it gets hot.

30a service with an EMS that manages the load shedding automatically works fine. My PA is this way.

[rgrimm]

Thanks everyone for your responses. I am starting to think that the Class A I want, 30 foot or shorter and 50 AMP service with 2 AC's (or at least the option of installing a Second AC) maybe a difficult find.

I understand that Winnebago is treating the Vista and Sunstar lines as an entry level coach and keeping the cost down is important, but it would be nice to at least of a 50 amp service upgrade Option and that would open the door for a second AC/ Heat Pump Option.

I'll keep looking.

Thanks again everyone.

-Russ

[NeilV]

I have a 30 amp Adventurer 35U and Power Management takes care of things pretty well. You can't run 2 toasters, a hair dryer and a electric coffee pot at the same time but it is workable. I am in South Florida and it works out well enough. Go to Lazy Days in Sefner this summer and see for yourself how the 27N works out in our climate as they are all set up and you can run the appliences etc and stay for as long as you want. Bring a book, etc and stay a while.

If thats too far any local to you Winni/Itasca dealer who has them setup with power will do.

[rgrimm]

Originally Posted by NeilV

I have a 30 amp Adventurer 35U and Power Management takes care of things pretty well. You can't run 2 toasters, a hair dryer and a electric coffee pot at the same time but it is workable. I am in South Florida and it works out well enough. Go to Lazy Days in Sefner this summer and see for yourself how the 27N works out in our climate as they are all set up and you can run the appliences etc and stay for as long as you want. Bring a book, etc and stay a while.

If thats too far any local to you Winni/Itasca dealer who has them setup with power will do.

NeilV - We have been to Lazydays a few times, not a bad trip for us from the Jacksonville FL area. We will be going to the Tampa Super Show in January to look at units to at least see what is out there that may fit for us.

- Russ

[BBQ Judge]

rgrimm, everything in rving (and life) is a compromise. Smaller class As only need 30 amps and one AC. My wife and I are happy with our Winnebago Vista 26 HE and one air on hot days. Maybe your first area of research is to check each manufacturer that you are interested in and see what length or size of rig has 50 amps available without major cost options. You may have to move to 30-33 feet to get 50 amps and two ACs. Does the extra length defeat your purpose of a small class A? How many days do you need the extra AC vs. the days of initial cost, extra length, weight, reduced gas mileage? Good luck with your search.

[SuperGewl]

Move up to the Suncruiser and get a 30'. They have the better insulation and air duct system. They also come with 2 AC's and 50 amps. I had a 5th wheel unit that only had 1 AC but the insulation and Duct work were set up much better which allowed me to keep my 35' 5th wheel down to 70 degrees in July in South Carolina without any problem. It only had 30 amp service so yes I ran the water heater on gas.
Another option is to buy one of the older Winnies with the basement AC. I had one that only had 30 amp service and the insulation and ductwork were the best. The central air kept the unit nice and cool while only running on 30 amp due to the energy management system. I never ran into any situation that stopped me from using everything except when you first plug in and turn everything over to electric, the power management does power shed until it can bring things back online.
You can always find one of these older units on a lot or in the paper.

[rgrimm]

Originally Posted by BBQ Judge

rgrimm, everything in rving (and life) is a compromise. Smaller class As only need 30 amps and one AC. My wife and I are happy with our Winnebago Vista 26 HE and one air on hot days. Maybe your first area of research is to check each manufacturer that you are interested in and see what length or size of rig has 50 amps available without major cost options. You may have to move to 30-33 feet to get 50 amps and two ACs. Does the extra length defeat your purpose of a small class A? How many days do you need the extra AC vs. the days of initial cost, extra length, weight, reduced gas mileage? Good luck with your search.

I realize everything is a compromise (RVs and in Life) and I suppose that is what I am attempting to determine relative to the RV that works best for us. I have been researching other manufactures and you are correct that for most you have to move to the 32+ length before you find 50 amp service and the option of adding a second AC. While I realize there are a lot of people RVing on just 30 amp, unfortunately my two previous units were 50 amp (reality 100 amps) so that is all I know. There was no need to be concerned what was turned on at any giving time.

Since you are traveling in a 26 HE on 30 amp perhaps your can share how power management works in a few scenarios -

Lets assume I am camping in the summer (90 degrees out) and need AC and I have the hot water heater is on electric (I know I can run it on LP too), and the TV is on.

What happens if I run the Microwave?
-- Will it run, or with the AC running I wouldn't even be able to run the microwave unless I shut the AC Off?
-- Will something automatically shut off (AC, TV, or Hot Water Heater)?
-- or do I have to manual shut some things down?

I suppose this is my problem since I have not traveled on 30 amps. I just do not really have a good understanding for just what can be run at the same time and understanding if there is some/any automatic Power Management built in to the Vista and Sunstar lines to help prevent overdraws that would trip the campground breaker on the pedestal.

My type of travel is travel during the summer to see the Country and then return to my home in Florida in the winter. Sort of a reverse 'snowbirder'. So my primary travel time is in the heat of the summer and it seems in the past few years it is hard to find many places that are not 90 + degrees. So I see the need to run the AC a lot and if it is already struggling to keep up with keeping the coach reasonable, I hate to think I have to kill the AC to run the Microwave and have a pot of Coffee on at the same time.

I really would love to have a 27N work for us. Neil's suggestion may be what I need to do (in summer since it's only 77 here in NE FL right now ), visit a dealer like Lazydays and spend some time in a 27N that is connected to shore power.

I look forward to you sharing some of your real 30 amp world living experiences in your 26 HE. Thank you!

- Russ

[Rockwood27]

If you go to the Itasca website you will find the Sunstar is equipped with a PowerLine energy management system. It sheds major loads as needed.

Itasca Motorhomes - 2014 Sunstar - Powerline

I have it in my 35A with 30 amp service and twin compressor basement AC. There were only a few times that I wish I had 50 amp service. If I really needed it there wouldn't much work converting over to 50 amps in my MH (transfer switch is 30/50 amps and circuit panel can be easily switched) as it was an option for my coach. I'm not sure if the newer Sunstars can be converted to 50 A, as it is not an option.

Fran

[ghutch]

I might suggest the addition of the Progressive Industries 30 amp surge protector with monitor. Single AC 30 amp RVs are a viable product. With the digital monitor, we are able to glance at the display prior to using a hair drier, coffee pot or electric water heater, etc. I find it no problem to manage the electric loads. I personally would not like to handle the 50 amp power cord at each hook up. If I used an RV in Arizona the majority of the time, I guess I would buy a 2 AC coach, but in my case, I don't.

[NeilV]

Originally Posted by rgrimm

NeilV - We have been to Lazydays a few times, not a bad trip for us from the Jacksonville FL area. We will be going to the Tampa Super Show in January to look at units to at least see what is out there that may fit for us.

- Russ

While your in-town then you may find it worth your while to stop in again at Lazey Days and see if they have one that has been sitting in the sun all closed up with the AC turned off so you can turn it on and see how well it cools down a hot coach. That will give you some idea if the one AC will be able to deal with the dog days of summer. If it can't cool down a hot coach that has been sitting out in the sun in 15 to 30 minutes then it may not have enough reserve capacity to keep things cool on a hot day.

[BBQ Judge]

Only being a class A owner for one season, I am not the most experienced person to answer some of your questions. Like you, I am still in the learning process. Hopefully others will teach us both on some of the finer points. Already owning my rig, I'm committed to 30 amps and some limitations; you still have the option to go bigger if you feel the need. I think your quest comes under the heading of "the fun of researching a new rig."

My 26 HE's hot water heater does not run on electric, LP only, so this eliminates one power drain.

On my rig, there is no auto power shut off for appliances, manual shut off only. I do have a surge protector but I rely on this for the 30 amps at the land line connection.

I keep a printed list of appliances and their amps during usage (I am electronically challenged as far as I-pads, hand held computers, etc.) and we do a quick mental addition when the air is running. The microwave only runs for 2-3 minutes for most usages so its no real problem to shut the air off for a short duration. The TV and AC don't seem to be a problem.

With such a small coach, to date, the dash air keeps us comfortable while driving. As such, when arriving at a CG, the rig is not that hot so the one roof AC only takes a few minutes to cool the back end of the coach. As soon as I'm level, I plug in and when the surge protector gives the okay, the air comes on.

Hopefully this helps.

[rgrimm]

Originally Posted by BBQ Judge

Only being a class A owner for one season, I am not the most experienced person ............

Hopefully this helps.

BBQ Judge, Thanks for your reply.

-Russ