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Old 10-08-2014, 01:02 PM   #1
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Disappointment @ Forest City

Hello again...

I wanted to start a new thread on this and let everyone else know what I encountered..

I started another thread and couldn't be happier with my experience.. but I did take something away that disturbed me.. to the point of wondering.. "what are they thinking" ??

I don't want to name names for fear of getting anyone in trouble.. but.. when we concluded our service appointment, our Tech sat down and spoke with us about all that was done and asked if we had any questions.. He was very knowledgeable and courteous...

My last question, based on our problems was.. Do you guys ever go over to production and grab a manager by the collar and show them what you see on a repeated basis? I asked if there was any type of communication between the service department and production ? His answer was simple... NO ?!?!

He mentioned he did it once and was "talked to" about it days later.. he said, its his job to make us happy and he works as hard as possible to be our advocate.. He works with us to make sure we are happy owners.. Needless to say.. he made us very happy and we couldn't thank him enough..

I was shocked.. How could Winnebago NOT want a direct pipeline from service to production?? Just think of all the little "quality control" issues we see on our rigs that could be fixed..

I guess my problem is.. I want to say something... although I know it will likely fall on deaf ears.. (it just blows my mind that something as simple as sweeping out the construction debris before a slide goes in.. think of how many have had nails, staples and/or screws that screwed up a slide..) but knowing my Tech already got "in trouble" for it once, I wouldn't want to do anything to jeopardize his job... I appreciated his honesty and straight forwardness...

Oh well.. just wanted to vent.. sorry !!
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Old 10-08-2014, 02:21 PM   #2
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I would advise Winnebago to have some sort of feedback from service to production. Flag the big issues that are being very repetitive.
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Old 10-08-2014, 04:08 PM   #3
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There is communication between the service department and production. It's done through the coding of the repairs and parts used on the work order. Each repair process has it's own specific code. Each part has a number in the inventory, repair and production systems.

Weekly and monthly reports are run to identify where the problem areas are. These reports are used to improve component design, and assembly and service procedures. In many cases second generation components are a direct result of the communication between the design team and the direct interaction between the service department and the customers.

I believe it's the responsibility of the management team to look at the overall picture (including the service orders) and determine how to best address product and component problems. If they need first hand experience they can use the technicians as a resource. I don't believe involving the service technicians in a potentially politically charged situation is the best course of action.
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Old 10-08-2014, 05:55 PM   #4
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I believe that communication should be an ongoing thing between the Whole company, period.

Stop the stupid mistakes, and the lack of inspecting coaches before they go out to the dealers to be sure all is in working order and proper.

Then it would not be the end customers troubles to get things fixed and proper as they should have already been done in the first place.

My selling dealer has long ago closed and Forest City is a long, long, drive away.
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Old 10-08-2014, 07:37 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hikerdogs View Post
There is communication between the service department and production. It's done through the coding of the repairs and parts used on the work order. Each repair process has it's own specific code. Each part has a number in the inventory, repair and production systems.

Weekly and monthly reports are run to identify where the problem areas are. These reports are used to improve component design, and assembly and service procedures. In many cases second generation components are a direct result of the communication between the design team and the direct interaction between the service department and the customers.

I believe it's the responsibility of the management team to look at the overall picture (including the service orders) and determine how to best address product and component problems. If they need first hand experience they can use the technicians as a resource. I don't believe involving the service technicians in a potentially politically charged situation is the best course of action.
I was unaware of that. That is the way to do it.
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Old 10-11-2014, 04:47 PM   #6
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I feel that we, as owners, have the responsibility to pass on to Forest City failures in QC that we repair. I have enough experience with dealers from coast to coast to know that MOST of the service techs don't have a clue. I have had more damage done by the failure of multiple shops to address leaks correctly.

At this time I am dealing with a leak in my passengers side front slide roof. I have written to Winnebago over the years about the design of the slide roof. This is the second Winne coach I have this problem with. Both have the same FLAT roof design with a down turned lip behind the inside trim. And there is where the leak is. Two different coached, 6 years apart, no change in design.

All in all we love our coach. I am quick to keep Winne informed of design issues I find in hopes that THEIR future will be improved. The longer Winnebago survives the better our chances are of getting it fixed correctly when it breaks. For us poorer folks living on the road this seems like a good thing to me.
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Old 10-18-2014, 09:14 PM   #7
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I don't know how much they really listen. Think about it. Fuel fills (on diesels) that can't be used except at the lowest pump setting or you WILL have a fuel spill. This has been a problem for several years, and it's a safety hazard. Backup cameras from the factory don't have IR capability. This caught me off guard as this is our first unit that wasn't a Fleetwood, and we had no idea cameras were even made that DIDN'T have that capability. Lack of IR makes backing up in the dark more hazardous...again, a safety issue. Dash heat that really doesn't get more than luke warm in the winter because (according to Freightliner) the engine isn't working hard enough to get warm.

In talking to others, these problems have existed year over year. And since these are design problems, and not repair issues, it means that production is NOT PAYING ATTENTION.
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Old 10-19-2014, 09:09 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cliffm View Post
I don't know how much they really listen. Think about it. Fuel fills (on diesels) that can't be used except at the lowest pump setting or you WILL have a fuel spill. This has been a problem for several years, and it's a safety hazard. Backup cameras from the factory don't have IR capability. This caught me off guard as this is our first unit that wasn't a Fleetwood, and we had no idea cameras were even made that DIDN'T have that capability. Lack of IR makes backing up in the dark more hazardous...again, a safety issue. Dash heat that really doesn't get more than luke warm in the winter because (according to Freightliner) the engine isn't working hard enough to get warm.

In talking to others, these problems have existed year over year. And since these are design problems, and not repair issues, it means that production is NOT PAYING ATTENTION.
For my coach, and I can only speak through my experiences, I was relieved when I did the first fill-up. I thought it went very well. The problem I now have is that I can spill too easily at the end because I get rapid neck filling at that point. My '05 was a bear to put fuel into.

We have not been in subfreezing weather so the heater issue you are speaking of is not my problem (yet). I think the controls are primitive and poorly located. As far as the heater design in general is concerned, I think Winnebago has more to do with what is installed than we are believing. Freightliner designs the chassis and installs the components the body builders designers and FCCC designers agree will work for what is wanted.

I avoid moving the coach in the dark. I just discovered the camera issue Friday night. My son drove the coach in the dark and rain. Had little to no idea the car was still behind us. Because I don't do night driving I am not seeing this as an issue. But, Winnebago, why are you not listening?

I think when these things are designed the teams that build the specs for each model must get to a point of frustration. After a knock down, blow down session the strongest personality gets the vote. And so we have the good and the bad choices of materials and equipment in our coaches.

My gripes of QC and just poor selection of production products in this RV are many. The cabinets are beautiful and deep but poorly mounted, the galley and shower faucets are just plain junk and should never have been used in a coach of this class. I just upgraded my galley faucet to a much better one and of reasonable cost. I just don't know how to upgrade the shower. That outside style faucet is terrible. I have had two Winne products with the same slide roof issue. They are prone to leak rain water from behind the inside trim. Terrible to find and fix.

DW is waiting for me to join her with morning coffee. I guess I have agreed enough for today.

Happy trails,

Rick Y

PS: still love the coach in spite...
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Old 10-19-2014, 10:12 AM   #9
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I too agree that nothing beats human interaction when it comes to Quality Control.

If the same guy, wearing a suit comes to you with complaints he has gleaned from computer generated reports, you will eventually have everyone dreading to see this guy.

If however, someone from production could sit in on the final chat with the owners and their advocate, then some interesting light could be shed on their "real life" issues with their Coach.

I believe Winnebago makes the best product, and their partners have been outstanding in helping me with any issue I have encountered.

Repeated mistakes are from repeated practices. To expect different results while doing the same thing over and over, is just insane.
It's high time Winnebago itself took this lesson, and learned from it.
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Old 10-19-2014, 10:31 AM   #10
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You are preaching to the Choir buddy!! We own a Thor, same QC issues, same lack of concern. I guess Misery loves company huh???
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Old 10-20-2014, 07:29 AM   #11
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The industry got clobbered during the rescission. I think the mentality of the coach builders now is take no prisoners. Issues we find significant but need some $ to implement are left to die a slow death. What these fine decision makers are failing to understand is that our complaints corrected at the factory will save BIG bucks for all concerned in the long run and improve the manufacturers reputation. Good QC becomes a great advertizing campain. Wake up coach builders! Your brand loyal consumers are trying to help you SURVIVE with dignity.

Rick Y
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Old 10-20-2014, 07:51 AM   #12
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Building a coach with the least amount of wages paid out is the goal. Could be number of people, or the amount of wages per person but enough careing eyes are not a part of the building process. Something as simple as sweeping out construction debre should be done and checked that at was done at the manufactor. As long as they are selling them as fast as they roll off the line don't expect much change. They don't have to build the best coach, just one that sells! IMO
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