Winnebago kwikee hydrolic Jacks will not go down bad pump motor?

[MrRobot]

I have a 2004 Winnebago Sightseer. On my last trip the kwikee jacks would not go down. I found out that the pump motor solenoid was bad. I replaced it. Know the pump motor run but when you attempt to put the jack down the jack do not move. I have check everything. The only issue I can fine is a voltage drop when attempting to lower the jacks. Kwikee now lippert says that there should be a constant 12v to operate the hydraulic solenoids but I'm only getting around 10v. It has been suggested to me that the electric motor may be going bad and causing the power drop. I have a good 13v coming from the motor and alternator to the solenoid on the side of my pump motor but as soon at I hit the button on the control panel it drop to around 10v. Any suggestions? Am I on the right track with a bad motor?

[Ray,IN]

I suggest downloading the Kwikee leveling system service manual and begin with the troubleshooting tree.
If the motor runs but does not slow down when oil pressure builds, I would suspect the solenoids.

[MrRobot]

Thanks for the link. I have done much of what is suggested to no avail. Have you ever come across a wiring diagram?

[Morich]

I might suggest a bit less complex idea to see if it might fit.
First is the suggestion that the motor needs a steady 12 volt supply and you know that it is not happening.
So if you know it is not getting a good 12 volt supply, why consider the motor is the fault?

Have you looked at the cables that supply the motor as they can be a frequent problem on most any electrical items on RV?
They may be clean enough to let us measure 12volts but not clean enough to supply that 12 volts at high enough current to let the motor run.

Point to keep in mind is that a bad motor will draw high current but since you do not mention blowing fuses/tripping breakers, I would have to assume the motor is not the fault.

Just a suggestion but before looking for hard stuff, I like to first look for easy things like dirty cables.

[MrRobot]

Thanks for all the good info gentlemen. I have checked my cables on the neg side but not the positive. I will have to go back and do that. I'm just a little perplex as to how every thing can appear to be working until I hit the jack down button. My only symptom of a problem is the lost of voltage. At this point I'm open to any suggestions.

Do either of you know if the house battery have any input as far as providing power to the jacks? I think I read somewhere in my research into the problem that in some coaches they do.

[Morich]

Okay, This may be a big clue that we have missed!
some have other thoughts but many owners manuals state that it is a good idea to have the engine running when we are trying to use the power hungry items like jacks and slides.
One of the easy ways to help any large motor run best is to give it full power.
When we have the engine running Winnebago that I know about will all have some system to tie the coach and chassis battery systems together. This is one way that they give us to do "some" recharge on the coach batteries as we drive to the next site.
Since the normal engine alternator is often really much bigger than any load we put on it, why not let it add a bit of power back to any rundown battery?

One of the quicker ways to avoid giving questionable power to jacks or slides is to simply have the engine running.

For the question of which battery is used? I think that will vary but I can't actually look as the jacks are considered an added part to the RV and not well addressed in the drawings.
But when wondering, one way to decide which battery is used is to watch which battery has the big voltage drop when the ignition is off. Where you were looking at the voltage that dropped from 12 to 10 will be the one the jacks were using.

But that is where we can avoid the question by starting the engine first. With the engine running we get the chassis battery, the coach battery, as well as the engine alternator ALL helping as they are all tied together at that time.

Looking at drawings here:
https://www.winnebago.com/Files/File...ire_145752.pdf

I see I failed to mention starting the engine before trying to start the generator but that is also a good idea as the main engine is normally much quicker starting than the generator.

But this is the setup on the '04 sightseers. There is a solenoid often called mode solenoid which has control leads from the aux or boost switch near the driver as well as a lead from an ignition point called igntion hot by some builders. Later models that use solid state call it a battery isolation monitor (BIM)
When power flows down lead LR and through the solenoid coil to ground on
lead FM, it operates the solenoid to close the contacts between the coach I marked as green and the chassis which I marked as red.
Blue being the control lead battery and ground.

Don't let this sloppy drawing that looks like the FM lead goes to the big post where we get the chassis battery, though! It actuall brings ground down but the wire is also connected to the mounting screw for the solenoid and THAT is also ground on most RV.
Just not a really plain item the way they drew it??

Click this snip to get a better view or go direct to get the full picture?


Neat system that does some really nice things but it also tends to be a pain as the contacts in the solenoid tend to burn and fail more often than we like!
Good thing to be aware of for future times if the coach batteries stop charging while we drive??

[charlie]

Had similar problems last year. ended up having the jacks rebuilt by Custom Cylinders in Winchester, KY for less than the cost of a single replacement. Replaced the entire pump/manifold which comes as one unit from Lippert. I had the local Ziegler Cat do the removal & installation, as they are experts in hydraulics. Did a complete flush of the lines, reset the auto level & now they all work perfectly.

This was after 2 big name RV shops had said it could not be repaired. I researched everything I could find & spent most of the season just learning
all I could about them. Always remember that anything can be repaired if you can find the right information and the right people to work with, and are willing to spend the time researching & finding those people. In most cases
they are hiding in plain sight. You just didn't realize they were there.

We are looking forward to a great season in our 2007 Sightseer.

Good luck on your project.

Charlie