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Old 06-24-2007, 06:16 AM   #21
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SCVJeff:
I wonder how robust Dynamat (or equiv.) would be as a carpet pad replacement?

Somewhere in my office, is a sample box of sound & heat insulation, both rigid and blanket pads. I'll see if I can find it and look at what might be useful. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have decided not to put Super TUFF-R foamboard under the exposed outer floor seating areas in the driver/passenger compartment.It's too labor intensive piecing all together between the small floor support rails.

Instead,I'm focusing on a tempoary-removable heat barrier/mat approach, cut to fit, for on top of the basic floor carpet in front and around each seat position...then put floor carpet mats and added rubber mat on top. Dynamat has one surface that is adhesive and I think I want both surfaces reflective to keep heat out in summer...and heat in during winter.
I found this stuff at Lowes and I'll continue to look at Home Depot for other alternatives to the inside barrier approach.
http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&pro...291-13357&lpage=none

I noticed no one has posted an answer to my Question A above. Clues: What is A/C function in MAX? Where is the floor A/C return inlet for operation in MAX Cool?
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Old 06-24-2007, 06:23 AM   #22
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The one function of AC MAX is to take the air from inside the cabin instead of from outside, when in 'Normal AC'. Cools faster.
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Old 06-24-2007, 07:31 AM   #23
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Pusherman:
The one function of AC MAX is to take the air from inside the cabin instead of from outside, when in 'Normal AC'. Cools faster. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You are correct so far...so keep thinking.
In the A/C cooling and under insulated cabin flooring scenario I provided, what is the approximate-potential air temp at the cabin return air inlet? Clue: See my data entry #7.

How could you possibly know the temp at the
inlet for the air in the "Normal" position?

Using this info...could you make a better decision on whether to use "MAX or "Normal"?
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Old 06-24-2007, 12:22 PM   #24
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Jon and Vicki,

This is a great idea and I plan to implement on my Horizon. Thanks for posting with the photos.

Question for anyone: What is the best method to get a smooth cut on the foam board?
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Old 06-24-2007, 02:08 PM   #25
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LK23:
Jon and Vicki,

This is a great idea and I plan to implement on my Horizon. Thanks for posting with the photos.

Question for anyone: What is the best method to get a smooth cut on the foam board? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

For the long cuts, I used a faster cut approach with a hand held electric saber saw on high speed with medium tooth blade. Be sure to felt tip mark your desired cut line so you can see it as you move the saw. For smaller cuts..I used a sharp pocket knife.
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Old 06-24-2007, 05:59 PM   #26
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I used a straight edge carving knife on the foam board. Very straight and very little pilling.

If I had it to do over again I'd use the Super Tuff-R (finally found some to look at). It's denser and seems like it would be a lot easier to cut as well as having a higher R-value.

One of the key things is to get exact measurements and to cut on the outside of the line so you get a snug fit at the edges.
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Old 06-25-2007, 01:05 PM   #27
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Pubtym:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by SCVJeff:
I wonder how robust Dynamat (or equiv.) would be as a carpet pad replacement?

Somewhere in my office, is a sample box of sound & heat insulation, both rigid and blanket pads. I'll see if I can find it and look at what might be useful. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have decided not to put Super TUFF-R foamboard under the exposed outer floor seating areas in the driver/passenger compartment.It's too labor intensive piecing all together between the small floor support rails.

Instead,I'm focusing on a tempoary-removable heat barrier/mat approach, cut to fit, for on top of the basic floor carpet in front and around each seat position...then put floor carpet mats and added rubber mat on top. Dynamat has one surface that is adhesive and I think I want both surfaces reflective to keep heat out in summer...and heat in during winter.
I found this stuff at Lowes and I'll continue to look at Home Depot for other alternatives to the inside barrier approach.
http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&pro...291-13357&lpage=none

I decided to go with cut to fit mats of Reflectix (Home Depot) on the floor under and around the driver and passenger seats...especially forward of the passenger seat in the foot compartment area. That's where the A/C return air duct is while operating in MAX cool. By keeping the floor surface area in front of that return duct cooler from radiated heat...(MAX)recirculated air will be cooler.

Performance Specs: "Reflectix® Insulation consists of two outer layers of aluminum foil reflect 97% of radiant heat. Each layer of foil is bonded to a tough layer of polyethylene for strength. Two inner layers of insulating bubbles resist conductive heat flow while a center layer of polyethylene gives Reflectix® high reliability and strength."

My first phase of working the radiant heat problems in the driver and passenger floor areas was to spray paint both the black coated outer floor/wheel well upper areas with a higly reflective aluminum colored high temperature (500F) rated engine compartment paint. One spray can did both undersides. This reflective surface will be the first layer of radiant heat protection.

Took the rig for a test drive in hot temps. At the end of the drive the reflective painted surface was noticeably cooler to the touch than black surfaced points in the same area.

More to follow as I use/fit the Reflectix.
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Old 06-25-2007, 04:28 PM   #28
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anyone thought of doing insulated floor mats?
I am assuming that putting insulated matting under the rv carpet would be too difficult.

I insulated the doghouse and thought about using the same material on the underneath side of the pass/driver floor. But as someone said...it will take alot of cutting and fitting...I do not enough patience right now.
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Old 06-25-2007, 04:48 PM   #29
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LandHo:
anyone thought of doing insulated floor mats?
I am assuming that putting insulated matting under the rv carpet would be too difficult.

I insulated the doghouse and thought about using the same material on the underneath side of the pass/driver floor. But as someone said...it will take alot of cutting and fitting...I do not enough patience right now. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Exactly what my intent is with Reflectix mentioned in previous post. I'll cut Reflectix to fit floor areas around seating areas...lay pieces down directly on top of MH istalled carpet...cover again with individual MH carpet mat...then cover with individual standard rubber mat. To keep Reflectix stuff from moving around on carpet..I'll use either Velcro hook tape or double stick tape at various points on the Reflectix. Again, if my understanding of the Reflectix is correct...it should keep most radiated summer road heat out from floor area near seats..yet keep inside generated cabin heat in during cold winter travel. Seems to be win-win stuff at very reasonable price.

http://www.reflectixinc.com/script/p...duct.asp?ID=79

See my comment/suggestion not to use Dynamat insulation.
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Old 06-26-2007, 03:01 AM   #30
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Just my 2 cents:
Putting the Reflectix( or any other foil faced insulation ) in direct contact with a solid surface, without an air gap, negates the reflectivity of the foil. The radiant heat that is reflected by the foil needs to pass thru an air space before hitting the foil surface in order to be reflectd. You will still be getting some insulating value from the air in the bubble space between the foil surfaces but it is not much. You wouls be better off getting some carpet padding for your application as it is less expensive, will hold the carpet in place better, and is cheaper.
Good luck with your project.
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Old 06-26-2007, 03:05 AM   #31
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Just as an asside - I sell Reflectix in my course of business so I do not have any problems with the product. Just that its usage is very misunderstood and the Mfg. does little to clear things up.
I have sold Industrial Insulation products for 32 years and am glad to offer any answers that I can.
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Old 06-26-2007, 03:54 AM   #32
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Pete,

This thread was started by Vic's idea to insulate under the coach. I would appreciate your comments on insulating under the living area and also under the driver's area.
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Old 06-26-2007, 04:19 AM   #33
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PeteB:
Just my 2 cents:
Putting the Reflectix( or any other foil faced insulation ) in direct contact with a solid surface, without an air gap, negates the reflectivity of the foil. The radiant heat that is reflected by the foil needs to pass thru an air space before hitting the foil surface in order to be reflectd. You will still be getting some insulating value from the air in the bubble space between the foil surfaces but it is not much. You wouls be better off getting some carpet padding for your application as it is less expensive, will hold the carpet in place better, and is cheaper.
Good luck with your project.
Pete </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thanks Pete,

My intent is not to put Reflectix next to a hard surface...intent is to use it as first overlay on top of initial OEM MH carpet. That carpet has the initial airspace you mentioned.
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Old 06-26-2007, 04:33 AM   #34
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Im going to use the Dynamat Hood liner under the chassis, under the drivers and passengers seats...that way it will keep the heat (and sound) from entering the motorhome in the first place. I will rough cut the small pieces for the small areas between the supports, and then put one full sheet over this area when all the small areas are filled....

I believe the key is to not let the heat enter the house at all....
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Old 06-26-2007, 04:43 AM   #35
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by FrontRangeRVer:
Im going to use the Dynamat Hood liner under the chassis, under the drivers and passengers seats...that way it will keep the heat (and sound) from entering the motorhome in the first place. I will rough cut the small pieces for the small areas between the supports, and then put one full sheet over this area when all the small areas are filled....

I believe the key is to not let the heat enter the house at all.... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Suggest you check the R value of Dynamat versus Super TUFF-R before deciding to cover straight surface areas under coach living area. Extreme cost of low R value Dynamat versus low cost and High R value Super TUFF is worth considering.
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Old 06-26-2007, 05:25 AM   #36
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Insulating in this area is difficult as the choice of interior or exterior are both problematic. Indoor would be preferred as the insulation would not be subject to the elements. I do not believe that Reflectix is the product for the reasons that I mentioned before as any contact with the carpet would allow conduction and negate the effectivness of the foil leaving just the small air space between the foil surfaces to do all the work. Carpet padding would be more effective especially a high quality foam pad.
Exterior insulation, in my opinion, would be limited to spray foam insulation as it has the abuse resistance necessary for water spray off the tires and such but there is the problem of trapping moisture against the steel and causing rust and corrosion. I would therefore advise against trying to solve the problem from the outside anywhere the foam would be splashed by water.
Cutting and placing reflectix pieces around the footwell area where there is air on the hot side of the sheet would be effective. You could spray paint the visible side flat black to help hide it as the reflective side is only necessary on the hot side. Carpet padding is still my choice for underfoot and areas where there is no air space.
Hope this helps.
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Old 06-26-2007, 06:46 AM   #37
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PeteB:
Insulating in this area is difficult as the choice of interior or exterior are both problematic. Indoor would be preferred as the insulation would not be subject to the elements. I do not believe that Reflectix is the product for the reasons that I mentioned before as any contact with the carpet would allow conduction and negate the effectivness of the foil leaving just the small air space between the foil surfaces to do all the work. Carpet padding would be more effective especially a high quality foam pad.
Exterior insulation, in my opinion, would be limited to spray foam insulation as it has the abuse resistance necessary for water spray off the tires and such but there is the problem of trapping moisture against the steel and causing rust and corrosion. I would therefore advise against trying to solve the problem from the outside anywhere the foam would be splashed by water.
Cutting and placing reflectix pieces around the footwell area where there is air on the hot side of the sheet would be effective. You could spray paint the visible side flat black to help hide it as the reflective side is only necessary on the hot side. Carpet padding is still my choice for underfoot and areas where there is no air space.
Hope this helps. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Good point about the exterior problem of exposure to elements/water tire spray/snow throw etc. I saw that the same way...and the hard to seal Dynamat edges there from the foam edge water spray retention. I do have a call in to a local foam spray contractor to see he would consider small job on his site for both wheel wells (about 24 sq feet). I can not locate a rental small job do-it your self foam spray on unit.

Good point about the high quality foam carpet pad versus Reflectix. A lot of throw away stuff around carpet dealers.. I'll look at this possibility.

Thanks
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Old 06-26-2007, 09:34 AM   #38
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Just an idea for you. Most spray foam Contractors operate out af a box truck as their equipment is fairly large. Maybe if you can find out where they have their next job, you can meet them there with your Motorhome and have them spray it at the jobsite. I am sure that they would not be interested in anything less than 1000 square feet as the time required to clean the equipment for such a small job would be too much.
Plan "B" would be to do it yourself. We sell a 2 component spray foam material that would work in your situation but the results would not be as smooth a finish as done by truck mounted equipment but it would be acceptable. If this is what you decide, let me know where you live and I will find out from the MFG. who might have the product in your area. A kit to spray 12 square feet - 1" thick of R 6 foam runs about $30.00. Also, after spraying, the foam is fully cured and hard in about 2 minutes and can be painted.
Hope this helps
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Old 06-26-2007, 10:32 AM   #39
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PeteB:
let me know where you live and I will find out from the MFG. who might have the product in your area. A kit to spray 12 square feet - 1" thick of R 6 foam runs about $30.00. Also, after spraying, the foam is fully cured and hard in about 2 minutes and can be painted.
Hope this helps
Pete
Hope this helps </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

BINGO! This would be a big help to me! I live close to Colorado Springs, CO....let me know where I can find this kit!

THANKS!
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Old 06-26-2007, 10:43 AM   #40
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The closest to Colorado Springs I could find is a Company by the name of EJ Bartells in Denver. Phone # is 303-373-0651 and what you are looking for is a "VersiFoam System 1" kit. It will produce 1 cubic foot of foam. The kits are also available in 15 and 50 cubic foot models (System 15 and System 50) but are quite expensive. Pay attention to the instructions and it should work well for you.

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