Newb needs help setting up a Toad

Maddmike · 10-25-2021, 12:01 PM

I have googled and there are so many different options and price points, it is hard to tell what is needed and what is nice to have.

I have a 2003 Journey Cat diesel pusher. Today I'm picking up a 2011 Subaru Impreza to act as a spare vehicle for our au pair / toad. Yes, it is a manual as I know enough that I wouldn't try to flat tow an automatic Subaru.

I am paying less than $5k for my toad and I really don't want to spend to much on setting it up. I know I will probably have to pony up the $450 for the vehicle specific adapter once I decide on a system. However, this is a light car (3000lbs) being pulled by a heavy vehicle so I don't want to over-engineer the setup and I would like to buy used.

Blue Ox and Roadmaster seem to be the two most common tow bars. Breaking systems get confusing and expensive.

Can someone help point me in the right direction as to what I should be looking for without creating a setup to pull full-sized pickups? My local Facebook Marketplace seems to have a lot of used options BUT spending money on the wrong setup is just money wasted.

I appreciate any help.

tim myers · 10-25-2021, 01:34 PM

There is no really inexpensive way to do this. You are going to need to install a base plate on the Subaru, and purchase a matching tow bar. Check out e-trailer for pricing. You need to have some sort of lighting system hook up that will let the taillights on the Toad operate the same as the taillights on your Journey. Again e-trailer sells kits for this. Last but most important, put a braking system on your toad. Since you have a Journey an Air Force One system would be the best way to go for you. Please don't scrimp on this, your Subaru may state it is only 3000#, but I bet it weighs more because the Toad becomes a storage vehicle for what you can't cram into your motor home. Stopping distances increase a lot with an added 3000# on the back of your Journey.

As an example, I found that my CRV brakes were not engaging as they should so I checked into it and I had the sensitivity setting too high on my Stay-N-Play system. When I adjusted that sensitivity down the added braking was amazing. Honda lists my 2013 CRV at 3400#, but my recent CAT Scale weight showed is at almost 3700#

Maddmike · 10-25-2021, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tim myers

There is no really inexpensive way to do this. You are going to need to install a base plate on the Subaru, and purchase a matching tow bar. Check out e-trailer for pricing. You need to have some sort of lighting system hook up that will let the taillights on the Toad operate the same as the taillights on your Journey. Again e-trailer sells kits for this. Last but most important, put a braking system on your toad. Since you have a Journey an Air Force One system would be the best way to go for you. Please don't scrimp on this, your Subaru may state it is only 3000#, but I bet it weighs more because the Toad becomes a storage vehicle for what you can't cram into your motor home. Stopping distances increase a lot with an added 3000# on the back of your Journey.

As an example, I found that my CRV brakes were not engaging as they should so I checked into it and I had the sensitivity setting too high on my Stay-N-Play system. When I adjusted that sensitivity down the added braking was amazing. Honda lists my 2013 CRV at 3400#, but my recent CAT Scale weight showed is at almost 3700#

Thanks for the feedback. Yes, the baseplate I will probably have to buy new but I'll probably pick up a used tow bar. Any models I should look for/stay away from?

Good feedback on the Air Force system. I'll look into it.

Alphadog · 10-25-2021, 02:21 PM

Most complete tow systems professionally installed will run at $3500 to $4000.

Morich · 10-25-2021, 02:40 PM

Some will depdn on how much convenience you are willing to pay for and how much you wantthe overall package to degrade the looks of the towed car.
When we buy, we now want the most convenient that shows the leastas a way to reduce the stress when hooking/unhooking as we do not stay in one place long and we also want to keep in mind the resale value goes down when most folks find something "weird" on the car they are shopping. I've given up on ever finding somebody close by who wants exactly the two car I'm selling so we don't even consider the tow package as an asset on resale. We bite the bullet and go with what works for us at the time as money is easier to find then time at our ages!

We find the Blue Ox is the most convenient , can be stored safely on the rear of the RV when at a site and easy to hitch when ready to leave.
RVI 3 brake is the one we have used on three different cars as one that is easy to connect/disconnect and meets all state laws across the US which varies from state to state. We never like the idea that if we decide to go East we might not be set right for some state wanted to pass through. Enough trauma trying to decide which highway without having to check laws in each state!
On tow bars, I do not recommend any which do not have the arms which can extend/retract to fit the distance to the car. Almost impossible to get the car set exactly right when hitching if you can't adjust the arms to fit and then let them lock to full length as you move out.

**creativepart** · 10-25-2021, 02:49 PM

For my first toad I bought a new Blue Ox baseplate and found a guy on Craigslist that installed baseplates for less money. He worked at an RV dealership installing baseplates and decided to strike out on his own with his own business. Yeah, a pretty unique find and one you're not likely to run into.

I bought a Blue Ox Alpha tow bar on Craigslist for $300 and it came with a baseplate for a car I didn't own and the seller didn't want to separate the two items. So, I bought the whole package for $300 and then sold the baseplate on Craigslist for $150. So, I got a real deal.

When I got a new Toad (I sold the old one quickly to another RVer) I bought a new Blue Ox baseplate for about $480 and decided to retire the used Alpha towbar and bought a new one for $760 or so (same brand and model).

This time my installer guy had moved out of state and I took the new car to a local RV Parts and Service shop I use. The install was about $500.

Back with that first toad I found a guy on eBay selling brand new Brake Buddy Classic Digital auxiliary braking systems for $600 - they usually sell for $1000 - and it's still with us today.

So, lets see in my current toad I have $2340 in parts and installation in my current toad - and that includes the braking system from my first toad. My good fortune on my previous toad setup allowed me to get by for about $1500 total. Deals exist if you are willing to look for them.

**creativepart** · 10-25-2021, 02:53 PM

Here's a used Brake Buddy on eBay - don't know what it will go for but you could watch for it:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/115063317252

Maddmike · 10-25-2021, 07:54 PM

So, what are the advantages with going air brake? The systems seem a but cheaper but need to be professionally installed. Base plate I can easily install as well as most wiring but tapping into an air brake system is something I would leave to the professionals.

It seems that people on her prefer the Blue Ox to the Roadmaster. That is the easier choice. The brake choice is all over the place.

Maddmike · 10-26-2021, 07:18 AM

I purchased the Blue Ox base plate last night. Today I'm going to go look at this setup.

Thoughts?

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...0776061995319/

Morich · 10-26-2021, 07:56 AM

A point ot check on the tow bar is that you are getting ALL the small parts as that price seems quite high if some of the parts that are not shown are not included.
Some things that should be there:
A pair of pins to go in the car end of the arms to hold them to the base plate "tabs" as well as small retaining clips to keep the pins in the holes. This is where being familiar with each of the items can be valuable as the pins and tabs may come with the baseplates or not and the problem being that each item is avery special item with a very special price attached!

I have been selling off all the small parts for towing which had collected over theyears and the tabs which fit into the front of the car into the base plates sold on E-bay for more than $40 each!
So if one is able to find a "bargain" tow bar in the $500 range but it is lacking the small parts to use it, it can wind up costing as much as a new one!

Some parts which may be overlooked:
tabs to go in the baseplates
pins to connect the bar to those tabs
small pins to hold those in the tow bar holes to keep the pins from backing out.
Tether cord for electrical supply from RV to car, often a 7 pin to 6 pin
many states require a breakaway
The breakaway switch on the car
The small cable to activate the switch when the car breaks away.
Diodes in the tail/brake light circuits of the car if you do want to use them rather than using added lights on the outside of the car.
Possibly some way to keep the tow car battery charged while dowing if the specific car you use has to have the battery supply disconnected while towing, newer electronic transmissions are morecomplex than older standard transmissions ued to be.

I have to say it can be very confusing and difficult to get a bargain but each time we prepped a car we got the price down a bit!

We finally came down to wanting a system as light and small as possible to carry from car to RVand store as well as easy surefire setup and braking. We preferred the RVI 3 brake for small and having the tablet setting alongside the driver to signal when braking was being done and how much as it gave me more confidence that the brakes were not hanging up stuck on and dragging the tires!
The RVI is form of small compressor which plugs into the dash 12 volt socket in the car to powerboth the "brains" and the compressor with an added wire to the front for the breakaway switch there.

A site from RVI that has lots of really good videos to get a good idea of what their product does. It is expensive but then I did not get into the RV world on the cheap!
I wanted to get what worked best and then save money if possible!

https://rvibrake.com/?gclid=CjwKCAjw...RoCV1AQAvD_BwE

Mtn Charlie · 10-26-2021, 09:10 AM

A NEW tow dolly with electric or inertial brakes is about $1500, with no setup, brake systems or mod to the toad. They will tow any front wheel drive or manual tranny toad, with no set-up changes. I use auxiliary magnetic lights, if towing at night, but they aren't required in most states.

**creativepart** · 10-26-2021, 09:22 AM

What model towbar is that? That is a key point that's not mentioned in that sparse ad.

I don't see a breakaway in those photos. The mounting rams and pins should be included with the baseplate.

Lights will be required. There are three ways to go on those.
1. Wired into the existing rear lamps with diode to prevent 12v feeding back into the system.
2. Holes drilled into the backs of the tail light housing and additional separate led bulbs installed in the holes.
3. Additional lights with magnetic bases that are placed on the back end or roof of the toad.

I've done #1 and #2 of the above options and the wired into the existing lamps is the most technically difficult but also the most practical.

No doubt that price is negotiable but I'd be more comfortable at about $800 for everything.

When buying from CL or FB I like to determine the full retail price and then half it for what I'm willing to pay. Not the seller's guesstimate of what it costs retail.

Maddmike · 10-26-2021, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by creativepart

What model towbar is that? That is a key point that's not mentioned in that sparse ad.

I don't see a breakaway in those photos. The mounting rams and pins should be included with the baseplate.

Lights will be required. There are three ways to go on those.
1. Wired into the existing rear lamps with diode to prevent 12v feeding back into the system.
2. Holes drilled into the backs of the tail light housing and additional separate led bulbs installed in the holes.
3. Additional lights with magnetic bases that are placed on the back end or roof of the toad.

I've done #1 and #2 of the above options and the wired into the existing lamps is the most technically difficult but also the most practical.

No doubt that price is negotiable but I'd be more comfortable at about $800 for everything.

When buying from CL or FB I like to determine the full retail price and then half it for what I'm willing to pay. Not the seller's guesstimate of what it costs retail.

The model of towbar is BX7380 Alpha 2 which goes for about $700. The brake is about $1300. The said she is bringing all the parts so I'll do my best to piece it together. I was going to offer her $800 if it seemed complete. Add the $400 bracket and even if I need to spend another $200-$300 on missing items, I would still be setup for about $1,500 which seems reasonable to me.

Morich · 10-26-2021, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by creativepart

What model towbar is that? That is a key point that's not mentioned in that sparse ad.

I don't see a breakaway in those photos. The mounting rams and pins should be included with the baseplate.

Lights will be required. There are three ways to go on those.
1. Wired into the existing rear lamps with diode to prevent 12v feeding back into the system.
2. Holes drilled into the backs of the tail light housing and additional separate led bulbs installed in the holes.
3. Additional lights with magnetic bases that are placed on the back end or roof of the toad.

I've done #1 and #2 of the above options and the wired into the existing lamps is the most technically difficult but also the most practical.

No doubt that price is negotiable but I'd be more comfortable at about $800 for everything.

When buying from CL or FB I like to determine the full retail price and then half it for what I'm willing to pay. Not the seller's guesstimate of what it costs retail.

Createive makes several good points to be aware of when shopping and installing .

On the lights, we did not want the outside lights as they tend to get in trouble at times and can damage the car finsih as well as being a pain to set out each time that we did not want.
Adding extra LED bulbs turned out to be more difficultexpensive than going with idodes as the newer style lights do not have covers to remove but the light itself has to be pulled and reinstalled on our cars, so jst digging under the panels in the trunk to get to the diodes and wiring was less than adding LED! Installers that know these things were what we felt worth paying to get!

A call to check exactly which model Blue OX may be worth the time to preshop the price as there are a number of different Blue Ox. I tried to get the model number of this one but blowing up to size to read came with blurrred and left me guessing. This is where to get that info on the tow bar when looking but not something I could read.

Different models are often different rating but we found there are 10,000 and 6500 pound rating and all our cars were far less then 6500. A factor to keep in mind is the heavier rating is also heavier to carry and plug into the reciever hitch, so how much extra is good can depend on what you fell like you want to carry!

I might also add to my list of things to need with a comment on the safety cables as they also come in different grades. I'm a bit of bug on towing safety as I do not want to wonder if it is all okay back there!
That means the bigger, heavier cable style which has snap hooks to hook at each end and have a retaining snap to keep them snapped on, rather than the simple open hook style. I have driven trailers in heavy weeds and found the weeds made the open hooks slip off. Just something small that I did not want to wonder about when we traveled.

This is the package which I just sold on E-bay:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/174977940970

Be aware that E-bay has a shipping agreement that makes shipping much more cost effective than other online places and shipping on a tow bar is a major bite at around 40 pounds for bar cables and all.

A point on pricing is to look at current as well as try to determine what the seller might have paid as the price we paid 5-6 years back was totally different than new today!

That's where knowing which model lets you go online and get current prices. it doesn't really matter that we could have bought it for half the price five years ago----if we did not!

**creativepart** · 10-26-2021, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maddmike

The model of towbar is BX7380 Alpha 2 which goes for about $700. The brake is about $1300. The said she is bringing all the parts so I'll do my best to piece it together. I was going to offer her $800 if it seemed complete. Add the $400 bracket and even if I need to spend another $200-$300 on missing items, I would still be setup for about $1,500 which seems reasonable to me.

The Alpha is perfect for your Subaru - both of my towbars have been Blue Ox Alpha and I tow a heavier car than your Subaru.

When I bought my new towbar in 2017 I decided to buy a Roadmaster as so many folks recommend them. So, I bought a Falcon II. On our first trip I had so much trouble releasing the arms that right from the start I had difficulty removing our toad unless the surface I was parked on was level and totally flat.

Roadmaster told me, I needed to buy the $200 more expensive model to get one that would release easily on uneven surfaces or when the toad wasn't perfectly aligned with the RV.

I had purchased the towbar through eTrailer and they took it back no hassle and replaced it with the Blue Ox Alpha. No more problems.

BobC · 10-26-2021, 12:45 PM

I'm a fan of the Ready Brake products. It's a simple, mechanical braking system that requires no power or air, is effective and is less expensive than the other options. They also have a system that integrates the braking system with the tow bar:

https://www.readybrake.com/

I have the stand-alone braking system that I use with a Blue Ox tow bar.

I bought my tow bar used but it was essentially new. The Ready Brake and baseplate were new and I installed them myself. The tech at RVI was very helpful in advising me on installing the braking system on my vehicle. You might want to call them to see if they've installed their braking systems on your Impreza.

Mashmaster · 10-26-2021, 01:28 PM

I did this last year with my teenage son for our 2009 Honda fit.

We bought a used Blue Ox tow bar, used stay-N-Play brake system, diodes for the brake lights, the reinstall kit for the brake system at etrailer, and a new blue ox base plate.

It was a lot of work but the installation videos from etrailer basically walked us through each step. It was kind fun but be prepared to take your time. You'll find out how to basically disassemble and reassemble your car. The stay-n-play system is really good but probably harder to install that some of the other brake systems.

Maddmike · 10-26-2021, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobC

I'm a fan of the Ready Brake products. It's a simple, mechanical braking system that requires no power or air, is effective and is less expensive than the other options. They also have a system that integrates the braking system with the tow bar:

https://www.readybrake.com/

I have the stand-alone braking system that I use with a Blue Ox tow bar.

I bought my tow bar used but it was essentially new. The Ready Brake and baseplate were new and I installed them myself. The tech at RVI was very helpful in advising me on installing the braking system on my vehicle. You might want to call them to see if they've installed their braking systems on your Impreza.

I like that solution and that it works with all the major base plates. I'm not sure how the brake works. I will contact them and see.

Maddmike · 10-26-2021, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morich

Createive makes several good points to be aware of when shopping and installing .

On the lights, we did not want the outside lights as they tend to get in trouble at times and can damage the car finsih as well as being a pain to set out each time that we did not want.
Adding extra LED bulbs turned out to be more difficultexpensive than going with idodes as the newer style lights do not have covers to remove but the light itself has to be pulled and reinstalled on our cars, so jst digging under the panels in the trunk to get to the diodes and wiring was less than adding LED! Installers that know these things were what we felt worth paying to get!

A call to check exactly which model Blue OX may be worth the time to preshop the price as there are a number of different Blue Ox. I tried to get the model number of this one but blowing up to size to read came with blurrred and left me guessing. This is where to get that info on the tow bar when looking but not something I could read.

Different models are often different rating but we found there are 10,000 and 6500 pound rating and all our cars were far less then 6500. A factor to keep in mind is the heavier rating is also heavier to carry and plug into the reciever hitch, so how much extra is good can depend on what you fell like you want to carry!

I might also add to my list of things to need with a comment on the safety cables as they also come in different grades. I'm a bit of bug on towing safety as I do not want to wonder if it is all okay back there!
That means the bigger, heavier cable style which has snap hooks to hook at each end and have a retaining snap to keep them snapped on, rather than the simple open hook style. I have driven trailers in heavy weeds and found the weeds made the open hooks slip off. Just something small that I did not want to wonder about when we traveled.

This is the package which I just sold on E-bay:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/174977940970

Be aware that E-bay has a shipping agreement that makes shipping much more cost effective than other online places and shipping on a tow bar is a major bite at around 40 pounds for bar cables and all.

A point on pricing is to look at current as well as try to determine what the seller might have paid as the price we paid 5-6 years back was totally different than new today!

That's where knowing which model lets you go online and get current prices. it doesn't really matter that we could have bought it for half the price five years ago----if we did not!

I felt that it was missing too much stuff and the couple selling it did not know what they were talking about so I walked.

BobC · 10-26-2021, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maddmike

I like that solution and that it works with all the major base plates. I'm not sure how the brake works. I will contact them and see.

There are a lot of explanatory videos online. This one seems pretty good:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9RBBO_gcqU