Pre-puchase damage

tps0424 · 10-22-2007, 05:04 AM

I finally got my Spirit up to Hill's RV for repair this past weekend. Hills and I were able to go look at the affected area together along with some other things on that side of the coach.

1. The flaw in the fiberglass seems to be a repair.
2. Other fiberglass on that side appears to have problems such as bubbling.
3. The lower part of the right side of the coach appears to have been re-painted.
4. The paint on the storage doors doesn't match the other light green paint on the coach.
4. The cab is missing the graphics on the right fender and passenger door.
5. The paint is chipping off of the passenger door.
6. The water heater, also located curbside, has been giving us a lot of trouble

All of these things indicate that the coach sustained damage at some point before I purchased it as a brand new unit in December of last year. Hills was able to search the Winnebago database and determine that the unit was delivered to the dealer damage-free.

I don't expect the dealer to take responsibility. It appears it was damaged in their possession and then they repaired it and sold it to me without disclosing the damage.

Is there anything I can do, or am I stuck?

tps0424 · 10-22-2007, 05:04 AM

I finally got my Spirit up to Hill's RV for repair this past weekend. Hills and I were able to go look at the affected area together along with some other things on that side of the coach.

1. The flaw in the fiberglass seems to be a repair.
2. Other fiberglass on that side appears to have problems such as bubbling.
3. The lower part of the right side of the coach appears to have been re-painted.
4. The paint on the storage doors doesn't match the other light green paint on the coach.
4. The cab is missing the graphics on the right fender and passenger door.
5. The paint is chipping off of the passenger door.
6. The water heater, also located curbside, has been giving us a lot of trouble

All of these things indicate that the coach sustained damage at some point before I purchased it as a brand new unit in December of last year. Hills was able to search the Winnebago database and determine that the unit was delivered to the dealer damage-free.

I don't expect the dealer to take responsibility. It appears it was damaged in their possession and then they repaired it and sold it to me without disclosing the damage.

Is there anything I can do, or am I stuck?

Savannah · 10-22-2007, 05:49 AM

Contact Winnebago with your list and pictures to back it all up.

We were looking at rigs at a dealer in NM and came across a newly delivered Adventurer 37B with the rear cap badly damaged on the passenger side. Commented on it when we got back in the showroom since we were on the lot without a sales person to bug us. The delivery papers showed no damage but it was parked right where the delivery guy had parked it so now the dealership wondered had they just not noticed the damage (trust me it was very noticeable), had it been hit on the lot (no other rigs around were damaged) or had they just signed off on the delivery? I believe the final opinion was they had just signed off on the delivery.

The rear was repaired and they put the motorhome back on the lot with no disclosure that I saw. Usually that wouldn't be a problem since it rarely rains in NM but at this time it had rained and been raining so that means the rear got wet, very wet

.

Trek-Cyclist · 10-22-2007, 06:32 AM

When I was in New England I saw many Winnebagos and others with body damage from parking lot parking and delivery. They repair them and sell as NOTHING happend! There isn't any type of recording of incidents or accidents... Sometimes if the MH was in the lot for any length of time and customers could have seen it damaged they'll swap the unit with another dealer.. I was aware of one MH that had nose and windshield damage not once, but twice! A Vectra with the Passenger side basement storage door smashed in by a plow, repaired and sold as new!Just a few examples... Find out who their INS CO is and ask them if your MH was in for repair, if that can be done???
When you buy it they won't tell you because they don't have too! It was never registered or police report filed, Buyer Beware...

Richard 34A · 10-22-2007, 09:06 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by tps0424:

All of these things indicate that the coach sustained damage at some point before I purchased it as a brand new unit in December of last year. Hills was able to search the Winnebago database and determine that the unit was delivered to the dealer damage-free.

I don't expect the dealer to take responsibility. It appears it was damaged in their possession and then they repaired it and sold it to me without disclosing the damage.

Is there anything I can do, or am I stuck? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I would check with your local DMV office; in California, if a vehicle is damaged and repaired and the selling dealer knows about it, they must disclose it. There is a minimum dollar amount threshold and I don't remember what it is, but it isn't very high, so almost any repair more costly than a door ding repair must be disclosed to the buyer.

If the damage was repaired BEFORE the dealer got it and they have no knowledge, they have no liability, (but the manufacturer does) but again, if the damage was repaired prior to them getting the vehicle and it WAS disclosed to the dealer, they have to inform you of the repair.

Good luck in your efforts and don't let DMV tell you that RV's don't fall under the Lemon Law; this isn't that kind of issue.

No way I'd let a dealer get away with that... I had a problem with water in my rear differential and had to fight the dealer to get them to pay. I had to do some research, but once I turned over this photo to them, they paid for the $3,500 repair! (My MH is one of 138 units or so sitting in the picture.)

tps0424 · 10-22-2007, 03:03 PM

Thanks for the help. I contacted Winnebago OR and they are looking into it. I also spoke to my cousin who is a lawyer and he told me to check Disclosure of Facts - Mass. Gen. Law Chapter 93A, 940 Code of Mass. Regs. 3.05. This says the dealer is obligated under state law to disclose any fact, the disclosure of which may have influenced the buyer not to enter into the transaction to start with.
This certainly qualifies.

John_Canfield · 10-22-2007, 03:19 PM

Unfortunately I have gotten to the point to where I don't trust any business unless I have had a great business relationship with them (or it) for several years. I always assume a vehicle/RV dealership consists of a bunch of lying and thieving crooks until they pass my "test of time."

It is horrible that I have cultivated this attitude but I think it is reflective of our society.

Best of luck with your problem.

Pusherman · 10-22-2007, 03:45 PM

Your cousin has sound advice. I would also contact your Attorney General for your state and provide a complaint. There must be disclosure rules regarding a new vehicle being damaged and then sold 'as new'.

tps0424 · 10-22-2007, 03:59 PM

Would you contact the AG right away or wait until Winnebago finishes their investigation and see what they say?

Izzyblueye · 10-23-2007, 04:21 AM

I would suggest giving Winnebago a chance to investigate. Very probably you are going to hear they have no damage history on the coach. At least let them finish their investigation. If they do not respond in a short period of time, then I would proceed with the law. Let them know what your intentions are, so every one is on the same page. IMHO.

tps0424 · 10-23-2007, 11:23 AM

Thanks Homer. That's what my gut says to do. The dealer Winnebago sent me to (not the selling dealer) looked on their 'system' and did not find any damage history but, by looking at it, he knew right away that it had been repaired and not very well either! I wonder if part of their 'investigation' will include calling him?

peter griffin · 10-23-2007, 01:46 PM

I would speak with your rep and the dealer. See if you can get your items repaired (plus travel)and maybe give you some type of add on or extended warranty for your trouble. A lot of states lemon laws do not apply to RV. Also, most contracts have arbitration or mediation clauses. Most importantly, the dealer is going to claim you inspected prior to purchasing.

Sometimes while transporting the unit from the manufacture to the dealer the driver gets in an accident. Sometimes the driving company does not tell the dealer or manufacture and gets it repaired on their own...sometimes all without an accident or insurance report.

One last piece of advice, be patient and do not be rude or yell at the your Winnebago Rep. Just be persistent and document everything. Good luck..

tps0424 · 10-26-2007, 10:06 AM

I just got a call from Winnebago's rep. who has been very helpful since the start. He told me that they found out the motorhome was damaged by the selling dealer and that they had tried to fix it themselves although not very well.
In a gesture of goodwill, Winnebago is covering the cost of the repairing the repairs for us.

I just thought I'd let you know.

Izzyblueye · 10-26-2007, 10:26 AM

tps0424: This is great! You used the right approach. Hopefully you will all come out of this in great shape. I would be a bit weary of the dealer involved however. Thanks for letting us know the outcome.

Trek-Cyclist · 10-26-2007, 10:30 AM

So what you are saying is the Dealer lied to you and it took the Builder to get them to fess up..Who was that HILLS RV?
Is Hills RV still going to sell Winnebagos products anymore after they found out about their dishonest dealer?

tps0424 · 10-26-2007, 10:57 AM

That's what I'm saying. I bought it from a dealer who damaged it, repaired it and sold it as new without disclosing the damage to me. Apparently, the damage was substantial as the rv was repaired from the front bumper all the way back to the rear wheelwell.
Hill's was NOT the selling dealer. Winnebago sent me to Hill's when they thought they had a manufacturing defect issue to repair under warrantee. They told me Hill's was one of the best for this type of repair.
Hill's could tell right away that it was not a defect but a previous bad repair job.
The selling dealer came clean with the builder after the builder investigated.

To be clear... Hill's did NOT sell me this RV nor did they damage it. They are the one who noticed it was damage and not a defect. Hill's has been great to deal with.

Frankie · 10-26-2007, 11:20 AM

That says alot for winnie and a little for ,Was it Flagg?

peter griffin · 10-26-2007, 01:56 PM

is your rep mike m.?

He was a good rep to us.

Trek-Cyclist · 10-26-2007, 03:06 PM

Well I'm glad it wasn't Hills RV they support the Granite Staters Rally's in NH
Nice Winnebago is standing behind it, but there should be some type of action for the dealer that did sell it to you...
Good luck with your repair... Get it done right!

Kazoo Tom · 10-26-2007, 03:28 PM

tps0424 - glad to hear that Winnie is stepping up and taking care of your problems. I guess it is up to Winnie to take whatever action or sanctions against the original selling dealer that it see's fit. Hopefully the original selling dealer will have learned his lesson and not let this type of situation happen again.