Stuck Wheel Simulator Bolts

affreeman · 01-10-2019, 03:08 PM

I've tried a number of times to get the wheel simulators off the rear wheels of my 2011 Sunstar, with no success. I've bent the handle on the piece of crap removal tool trying to loosen the two nuts. They don't budge.

Does anyone know the size socket required to remove these so I can get a proper tool to do the job?

**ThomB** · 01-10-2019, 04:54 PM

1-1/8 will fit the top of the nut but it’s tapered so I didn’t try with the one I have. I ended up taking a crescent wrench with the factory tool head to get them off.

affreeman · 01-11-2019, 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThomB

1-1/8 will fit the top of the nut but it’s tapered so I didn’t try with the one I have. I ended up taking a crescent wrench with the factory tool head to get them off.

I'll give that a try, though on the rear wheels the nuts are recessed way in so getting access with the crescent wrench may be difficult.

dwaugh10 · 01-12-2019, 04:55 PM

Only 2 of them come off, the others are fixed. The ones that come off have dimples on the side. I also had to use a socket to get them off (don’t remember the size). After getting them off, I smeared a little white grease on the bottom of them before reinstalling. That helped a lot for future removal.

David
2017 SunStar30T

RV Tinker · 01-16-2019, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by affreeman

I've tried a number of times to get the wheel simulators off the rear wheels of my 2011 Sunstar, with no success. I've bent the handle on the piece of crap removal tool trying to loosen the two nuts. They don't budge.

Does anyone know the size socket required to remove these so I can get a proper tool to do the job?

On my 2004 Minnie, which probably has the same ones, I have found the removal tool is worthless (except for when putting back on). As Dwaugh10 points out only two are removable and you can't always see the dimples. For mine I use a 1 1/8 socket with 1/2 inch rachet drive and 8 " extender. Tap on the fake nuts, they will ring hollow. The nuts that are removable give a solid thud. Use the removal tool that came with the wheel simulators for putting the nuts back on. It's use will prevent you from overtightening the fake nut. They are only on with just over a thread and can easily be stripped.

jbrattain · 01-17-2019, 04:53 AM

Those nuts are called jam nuts. A metal nut is inside the fake nut body. They are supposed to be hand tightened, but tire stores are notorious for using an impact tool when they put the nuts back on. I've had them do that even after telling them to be sure not to do it. Anyway, that makes them impossible to remove with the hand tool provided by Winnebago. Now, when I go to get tire work done, I just go ahead and remove the wheel simulators before I leave for the tire store and put them back on and tighten them with the hand tool when I return.

As mentioned before, get a 1 1/8 socket, I found that I needed a deep socket because my regular socket bottomed out before going all the way down on the nut body. You can use an extension and a pull handle or an impact wrench. Or, you can just go to a tire store and get them broken loose, then tighten them with the hand tool yourself.

billyb · 01-17-2019, 07:23 AM

I think you have 22.5 wheels and the fake nuts are 1 9/16

affreeman · 01-17-2019, 08:47 AM

I ended up getting a 1 1/8" socket for a 1" drive so I could use my torque multiplier to get the nuts off.

When I put the wheel simulators back on I'll put a bit of grease on the nuts and use the little Winnebago tool.

affreeman · 01-17-2019, 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billyb

I think you have 22.5 wheels and the fake nuts are 1 9/16

I've got 19.5 wheels and the fake nuts are 1 1/8".

Jim_HiTek · 01-19-2019, 12:09 PM

Interesting that the jamb nuts should be tightened to no more than 40 ft-lbs. Just barely over hand tightened. But the lug nuts torque on big Class A's, 19.5 and 22.5 tires, is in the range of 450 ft-lbs.

It once took the Winnebago factory techs 2 days to give up their quest at my request to come up with the correct jamb nut torque on my rig...they gave up and had to contact the hubcap manufacturer.

akeagle · 01-19-2019, 08:09 PM

Are those wheel simulators primarily used on Class A motorhomes? After reading comments on them last year I wondered if my Class C had them. Upon checking ours very carefully I determined the chrome wheel covers were just that - wheel covers, not simulators, friction-fit and not bolted on. With some effort and a good crooked prybar I got them off without damaging them.

Or do some heavier Class C's have the simulators too?

I did notice later that according to a copy of the chassis "MSRP sticker" that was in our purchase paperwork indicated that Ford supplied those wheel covers as part of the cutaway package.

skyking · 01-20-2019, 07:03 AM

On our '07 Adventurer, with 22.5" aluminum wheels, some of the simulated chrome lug nuts we stuck. They were apparently over tightened with the same heavy duty impact wrench that tightened the real lug nuts. The front ones could be loosened with a large adjustable crescent wrench and a small sledge hammer!

As the OP mentioned, you can't get to the rear, recessed ones that way.
I bought and used this ebay item that can remove or tighten all the large lug nuts on the motorhome. It is capable of over 2000 Ft-Lbs. Yes, over 2000 Ft Lbs!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Torque-Mult...Ktn:rk:23:pf:0

Only $39.14 for a tool that seems like it should sell for $300, but that's China for ya. In addition, you will need a 3/4" to 1/2" reducer in order to use your 1/2 tools with it For example, your torque wrench. Be sure it's 3/4" male to 1/2" female adapter. See link below.

The 41mm socket (it's big) will fit the simulated lug nuts. The 39mm socket fits the real lug nuts and can easily remove or replace them to the required 450 Ft-Lbs. I verified with the tire shop torque wrench (5 feet long!), that my 15 Ft-Lbs put 450 Ft-Lbs on the lugs.
A while ago, had a blowout, and the repair truck did not have the proper socket to remove the over tightened simulated nut. Big problem, when stuck on the road.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-2-Female-...GP-:rk:38:pf:0

Be careful not to over tighten the 450 Ft-Lb lug nuts.

I'm sure this will help some of you out there.
Happy travels, Richard

RV Tinker · 01-20-2019, 10:32 AM

My class C minnie came with the bolt on wheel simulators (16" wheels). Also learned hard way that tow trucks don't always carry tools needed. So I carry correct size sockets and other special tools for RV needed for tires and towing.

jbrattain · 01-21-2019, 04:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim_HiTek

Interesting that the jamb nuts should be tightened to no more than 40 ft-lbs. Just barely over hand tightened. But the lug nuts torque on big Class A's, 19.5 and 22.5 tires, is in the range of 450 ft-lbs.

It once took the Winnebago factory techs 2 days to give up their quest at my request to come up with the correct jamb nut torque on my rig...they gave up and had to contact the hubcap manufacturer.

The jam nuts don't need a lot of torque, just enough to keep the wheel simulator on. The main wheel nuts keep the wheel on. I've never had a problem with the wheel simulator nuts loosening when hand-tightened.

Jim_HiTek · 01-21-2019, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbrattain

The jam nuts don't need a lot of torque, just enough to keep the wheel simulator on. The main wheel nuts keep the wheel on. I've never had a problem with the wheel simulator nuts loosening when hand-tightened.

They do need just enough torque I found out when one of mine a tire shop had under tightened walked off the lug and dropped on the ground somewhere on the freeway. Not good for a following vehicle. Dangerous. Then began a month long quest to find someone who carried 'jamb nuts' in my style and another someone who knew what the torque is suppose to be. Turned out my style is no longer made, so I chose to buy 4 of the newer, taller style, which has the added benefit of standing out to any tire tech. I just tell them the tall caps cover the jamb nuts.

But I'd lost a jamb nut somewhere and now that I had new substitutes and was at the Winnebago factory service anyway for other reasons, I asked the techs to install the new ones. No one I'd asked so far during my journey from the west coast to Iowa knew the torque. So I thought, surely a Winnebago factory tech would know? Several days after my rig was in the shop with them they still didn't know though they put all my new jamb nuts on while asking for me not to call them Shirley.

Days later, after I left their shop, and after having asked them numerous times what the torque was, the shop foreman from Winnebago contacted me with a PDF of the specs provided by the simulator manufacturer. And that had the 40 ft-lb torque spec. With warnings about over tightening. The Winnie tech was 'pretty sure' he'd torqued them to around 40 ft-lbs. (Had them checked at a tire shop later).

So a warning to RV buyers. Under tightened jamb nuts can just walk off the lug and end up on the freeway. Even factory techs 'guess' about the jamb nut torque and could have over or under tightened yours. And of course tire shops don't know either. Best find out what it's suppose to be for your simulators, and check them periodically. And when you have tire work done, make sure you let the tech know they're only to be tightened to 40 ft-lbs (for Wheel Master brand).

jbrattain · 01-21-2019, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim_HiTek

They do need just enough torque I found out when one of mine a tire shop had under tightened walked off the lug and dropped on the ground somewhere on the freeway. Not good for a following vehicle. Dangerous. Then began a month long quest to find someone who carried 'jamb nuts' in my style and another someone who knew what the torque is suppose to be. Turned out my style is no longer made, so I chose to buy 4 of the newer, taller style, which has the added benefit of standing out to any tire tech. I just tell them the tall caps cover the jamb nuts.

But I'd lost a jamb nut somewhere and now that I had new substitutes and was at the Winnebago factory service anyway for other reasons, I asked the techs to install the new ones. No one I'd asked so far during my journey from the west coast to Iowa knew the torque. So I thought, surely a Winnebago factory tech would know? Several days after my rig was in the shop with them they still didn't know though they put all my new jamb nuts on while asking for me not to call them Shirley.

Days later, after I left their shop, and after having asked them numerous times what the torque was, the shop foreman from Winnebago contacted me with a PDF of the specs provided by the simulator manufacturer. And that had the 40 ft-lb torque spec. With warnings about over tightening. The Winnie tech was 'pretty sure' he'd torqued them to around 40 ft-lbs. (Had them checked at a tire shop later).

So a warning to RV buyers. Under tightened jamb nuts can just walk off the lug and end up on the freeway. Even factory techs 'guess' about the jamb nut torque and could have over or under tightened yours. And of course tire shops don't know either. Best find out what it's suppose to be for your simulators, and check them periodically. And when you have tire work done, make sure you let the tech know they're only to be tightened to 40 ft-lbs (for Wheel Master brand).

I totally agree. I check mine now and then just to make they are still tight enough to stay on. I guess a little loc-tite might help. At lease if they loosened they might not come completely off.

Also, I found that most 4 X 4 and custom truck shops stock the jamb nuts or can get them because they sell wheel simulators to their truck customers.