surge protector - Page 3

jperry29 · 08-26-2010, 02:01 AM

Rusty,

I have been using a portable surge gaurd since 2001. It has "trapped" many problems for me as I have used it at campgrounds from the Rockies to the Carolinas, down to Florida and all over Texas and Georgia using COE, State Parks, Federal Parks, City Parks, and private CGs. Not once has there been any indication that someone may have wanted to walk off with my SG. I have never even had anybody be curious about it and ask me what it is, or if they knew what it was, how it performed.

I suppose a cable lock is like buying insurance, it will improve your peace of mind. But if someone really wants it, they will figure out how to do it pretty easily. The hard-mount in the coach is the best answer for security.

RBK394 · 08-26-2010, 07:52 PM

jperry29,

You are right about hardly anyone being curious about SPs. I am a case in point. In my 5 years of rv'ing, I never noticed any until my AC problem. Before my next outing, I will have a SP/regulator for sure.

bachler · 08-27-2010, 06:36 AM

This is so interesting. Now we are getting ready to take a trip to Alaska; ( Altho in 50+ years of motorhoming, We have never had any problem ) Up in Alaska many of the camp grounds are Generator supplied With Electricity;. We have witnessed AC voltage Near 100 volts Altho we did not run the air; The fridge was happy. Any way, Some are confused with the surge protector, Thinking that it would make electricity and get the voltage back up to 120 OR so volts. Am I wrong. Can I get a surge protector and it will make electricity for me. Remember in 50 years I've never needed it. Life is so good some times;;

SCVJeff · 08-27-2010, 07:55 AM

Several boost transformers have GE MOV's in them. So yes, for pure surge protection there are.

AFChap · 08-27-2010, 09:10 AM

There are devices (auto formers) the can "correct" sagging voltage to some degree under the right conditions. There are simple "surge protectors" that simply protect from a surge. There are more complicated surge guard systems that protect from over voltage, under voltage, and several other potentially damaging electrical conditions.

The older / smaller / simpler the RV (and it's electronics), the less likely it is to really need a surge guard. My son's pop-up that uses power only to run a few lights has no need for a surge guard. If the power sags, the lights dim ...no big deal. If the power surges it might burn out a light bulb ...still no big deal. But in my motorhome with lots of advanced electronics and appliances controlled by computer circuit boards, sagging or surging power, or reversed polarity, etc, can very easily burn out a circuit board or even more likely damage it which would result in failure several months later ...and I would have no idea why it failed before it should, or where I got the damage.

When someone in an RV park has a surge guard that is tripping due to over or under voltage, it is not true when the park manager says, "No one else is having a problem!" Others probably ARE having the problem and incuring electronics damage in their RVs ...the REAL problem is that they don't know it is happening. Ignorance of what is happening is not always bliss ...and if it is, it could be pretty expensive bliss!!

micd · 08-27-2010, 09:41 AM

We installed the following:
RVUpgradeStore - Progressive Industries Energy Management System 120Volt

They have a 50 amp version. We elected to have it professionally installed as sometimes a device will have an idiosyncrasy that only someone who has installed one before knows about. This product does and for some reason our factory trained installer didn't know about it.

The display is unreadable unless you are looking at it head on due to the LEDs being very recessed in the box. Originally the installer was going to install it at foot level as that was the easiest and I said I had no idea how we would see it down there. Then he installed it just under the kitchen counter which would have been ok if it was readable at an angle which it isn't. We had to take it out, run the wire into a drawer and now we just pull the drawer open to see the remote display. But I have 3 big holes to cover in the paneling on the face of the cabinet under the sink.

Michelle

SCVJeff · 08-27-2010, 10:46 PM

"If you want it done right........................................."

micd · 08-28-2010, 08:28 AM

I hear you. The display problem is exactly the type of thing I would expect someone who sells them and installs them would know about. We may have put it in the cabinet under the counter to but would have known our mistake the minute we turned it on and saw how recessed the LEDs were. However I did come up with a good solution for covering the holes. I found some metal bears on the internet.

1994 Brave 29RQ RV: Cute metal bears

Cheers!
Michelle

Dr4Film · 08-28-2010, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bachler

This is so interesting. Now we are getting ready to take a trip to Alaska; ( Altho in 50+ years of motorhoming, We have never had any problem ) Up in Alaska many of the camp grounds are Generator supplied With Electricity;. We have witnessed AC voltage Near 100 volts Altho we did not run the air; The fridge was happy. Any way, Some are confused with the surge protector, Thinking that it would make electricity and get the voltage back up to 120 OR so volts. Am I wrong. Can I get a surge protector and it will make electricity for me. Remember in 50 years I've never needed it. Life is so good some times;;

There are a few different EMS systems which are available to install into a coach. What I am about to describe is for a typical 50 amp coach. Some of these systems are also available for 30 amp coaches except for one. Each one performs a specific function or functions to protect the very expensive devices and electronic equipment you may have.

First, there is an Electrical Management System “EMS” that will check the power coming from the pedestal making sure the voltage on L-1 & L2 are within specs, between 103 - 132 Volts AC. It will also make sure you have a proper Ground and Neutral connection versus having them crossed or open. If any of these conditions are out of spec, it will not pass power to the coach. These units generally come with some level of “Surge Protection” using MOV’s to clamp the unwanted power. There is a great article at the link listed below that everyone should read and re-read to thoroughly understand some aspects of EMS systems and Surge Protection. There are two popular suppliers of this type of EMS unit, TRC Surge Guard & Progressive Industries. I personally feel the Progressive Ind. unit is by far the better device for the money because the internal components are user replaceable when they fail versus having to purchase a complete new unit.

Next, there is an EMS unit made by Intellitec which may come in some 50 amp coaches. This system will manage the power when you are NOT hooked to 50 amp shore power. If you are hooked to 30 amp or less, it will automatically “shed” or shut down different devices in your coach at a predetermined order such that you do NOT over tax the number of amps being supplied to the coach. They are generally devices that you can do without for a period of time. Such as running 2 A/C's at once is not an option on 30 amp service. Other devices that may be shed is the electric hot water assist, the washer/dryer combo, etc. Generally, the device order is listed on the EMS Intellitec display panel.

Finally, the third type of EMS is called an “Autoformer or Power Booster”. This unit will condition the incoming power such that you will seldom experience a low voltage condition. It will automatically boost the power to the proper spec’s. There are a few different vendors for this type of unit and my preference is called the PowerMaster made by Todd Coffelt. His unit is a power booster versus an autoformer, such as ones supplied by Hughes or Franks. The PowerMaster will boost power at two different levels, either 2.5% or 12%, depending on how low the voltage is coming into the pedestal. The PowerMaster also comes with a high level of Surge Control versus the autoformers which have none.

I personally have the PowerMaster VC-50 installed directly after the shore power cord, followed by a TRC Surge Guard 50 in my coach. The reason I don’t have a Progressive Ind. unit is that I already had the TRC Surge Guard purchased a couple of years ago and I am too cheap to replace it with the better unit. When the Surge Guard unit fails and is rendered useless, I will purchase the Progressive Industries unit.

Here is the link I mentioned earlier regarding an article written about Surges & Surge Protection. I would suggest that everyone should read it and then re-read it again so you completely understand the complexity of electrical power and its affect on household devices.

Surges and Surge Protection by phred

Dr4Film ----- Richard.

iisjr · 10-16-2010, 10:22 AM

I have 50amp and want to purchase a surge guard. When using 30amp services will the 50amp surge guard work as well (with the 50 to 30 adapter) or does it require that you have one of each?

AFChap · 10-16-2010, 10:28 AM

Quote:

When using 30amp services will the 50amp surge guard work as well (with the 50 to 30 adapter) or does it require that you have one of each?

Yes, your 50a surge guard will work just fine when on 30a service.

DAN L · 10-16-2010, 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iisjr

I have 50amp and want to purchase a surge guard. When using 30amp services will the 50amp surge guard work as well (with the 50 to 30 adapter) or does it require that you have one of each?

my progressive surge protector ssp-50 works fine with 30 amp service when i use my adapter. i have been using it for over 2 years with no problems.

SSP-50

gripper · 10-16-2010, 04:02 PM

I've got a 50a surge protector, that I bought at Camping World, over a year ago. It has served me well, by refusing to give me power, when I plugged into a "reverse polarity" system, a few monts ago. However, I had to disconnect it at my last campsite, in the middle of the night.

The reason.....my AC units kept shutting down. At first, they would start back up after the timed delay went back on. However, after several times of shutting down, they wouldn't come back. I looked at my EMS board an noted that it was blank....no 50a power. I went to my surge guard, and there were no lights on. So, I thought that the pedestal was dead or a problem existed there. Someone in a post above said to change sites, if the power pedestal was bad. Well, it just so happened that the site adjacent to me was empty. So, with a 25' extention, I plugged into that pedestal. Wala! My power came back on, so I went back to bed.

About 30 minutes later, the power went off again! So, my only choice was to sleep W/O AC or try to find the problem. I decided to disconnect my surge protector and just take it out of the equation. Wala! I had power again and it never went off again. So......anyone looking for a slightly used $300 surge protector? ha, ha.

Just kidding. However, now I have the problem of trying to get the surge protector repaired or continue without one. Based on what some others have said, maybe I just don't need one.

goldwingerx2 · 10-16-2010, 08:50 PM

I chose to go portable using SurgeGuard as the electrical compartment is tight. I also have it set so I am protected on gen or shorepower. You can't trust the gen always. Don't ask me how I know, well I guess you could and I will tell you that is why we now have a different MH.

iisjr · 10-17-2010, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goldwingerx2

I chose to go portable using SurgeGuard as the electrical compartment is tight. I also have it set so I am protected on gen or shorepower. You can't trust the gen always. Don't ask me how I know, well I guess you could and I will tell you that is why we now have a different MH.

How did you connect it to the gen? Don't recall seeing a seperate plug for that.

SCVJeff · 10-17-2010, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gripper

Just kidding. However, now I have the problem of trying to get the surge protector repaired or continue without one. Based on what some others have said, maybe I just don't need one.

What convinces you that it's broken as opposed to a sagging feed? Sounds like it's doing what it's supposed to.

gripper · 10-17-2010, 04:07 PM

Because, when I disconnected it, my power came back and I never had any more problems afterward. It wasn't like the camp was full of RVs. Quite the contrary.

SCVJeff · 10-17-2010, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gripper

Because, when I disconnected it, my power came back and I never had any more problems afterward. It wasn't like the camp was full of RVs. Quite the contrary.

Could be plenty of external causes that cause a sagging main that don't necessarily originate from the CG itself, and only a volt meter could verify. The fact that things worked for a length of time after the A/C was turned on and then shut off (and that way I read this things were fine until that point) would still lead me to believe it tripped for a cause.

gripper · 10-18-2010, 06:50 AM

[QUOTE=SCVJeff;719843]Could be plenty of external causes that cause a sagging main that don't necessarily originate from the CG itself, and only a volt meter could verify.

Well, I am home now and the electrical issues are way beyond my expertise. But, I'll still see if someone can "check out" my surge protector. Thanks for your comments.

Gripper