Chang'g Oil & Filter in my Onan 7.5 Diesel Generator=PROBLEMS bolts missing

This topic was copied to Winnebago, who I haven't heard back from as of yet.

Sunday was kind of a blazsay day, so I decided to change oil and the oil filter in the generator. I figured since it had 43 hours on it, now would be a good time to do the recommended 50 hour schedule maintenence since we'll will be in Texas in a few days.

Well, our coach must be a ----- child, because who ever installed the generator in our coach at the factory, mounted it incorrectly and snapped off 2 of the 4 washerhead bolts that secure it to it's cradle.

The first thing I did was get the owners manual to see where everything was located and to see how many quarts of oil I'd need. Under the coach, I easily found the oil drain plug and drained the oil. Then I looked for the 2 latches that have to be squeezed together and pulled down to open the access door, so I could remove the oil filter. Well, that wasn't going to happen, the generator was mounted on what I think is the wrong generator cradle frame. The generator cradle in our coach, was covering about 1/3 of the access door. As I'm looking around wonndering how I'm going to get to the oil filter? I notice that there are 4 bolt hole slots in the cradle that are used to secure the generator. Of the 4, only 2 have bolts in them, the other 2 were missing, as I thought. Upon further inspection, I found the other 2 bolts had been broken off, one was hidden behind the cradle frame and the other partially protruding out the hole.

If you've been following my topics, you know how I have experience more then my share of factory generated problems with our coach, this one being no exception. Over the past 2 years we have been back to the factory for service at least 4 times and on each occasion I complained about a thumping raddle noise under the front end, and each time they would repair something, but never stopping the original problem. Well, the culpert showed itself and has caused me to wonder if they ever checked the the generator, because if they did, the generator would have had to be removed and repaired, and then they would have found that the bolt holes don't line up with the cradle.

To complete my original task, changing oil and filter, which should have taken me maybe 20 minutes, took me 2 1/2 hours. I had to remove the only 2 bolts holding the generator and move it enough to open the access door, so I could change the filter. With that part of the job done, I had to tackle the broken bolts, that needed to be drilled out. Then another error shows itself, I learned long ago, that aluminum and steel don't work together. The bolts were steel and the generator base plate was aluminum. This application should have called for stainless steel bolts or else anti-seez on the bolt threads. The broken bolts were corroded big time and weren't about to come out easy. Once I got them out, I tried to align the generator with the cradle, only 3 holes would line up. At least thats one more then I had before, but it's not right, we'll see how Winnebago handles this.

Tomcat F15

This topic was copied to Winnebago, who I haven't heard back from as of yet.

Sunday was kind of a blazsay day, so I decided to change oil and the oil filter in the generator. I figured since it had 43 hours on it, now would be a good time to do the recommended 50 hour schedule maintenence since we'll will be in Texas in a few days.

Well, our coach must be a ----- child, because who ever installed the generator in our coach at the factory, mounted it incorrectly and snapped off 2 of the 4 washerhead bolts that secure it to it's cradle.

The first thing I did was get the owners manual to see where everything was located and to see how many quarts of oil I'd need. Under the coach, I easily found the oil drain plug and drained the oil. Then I looked for the 2 latches that have to be squeezed together and pulled down to open the access door, so I could remove the oil filter. Well, that wasn't going to happen, the generator was mounted on what I think is the wrong generator cradle frame. The generator cradle in our coach, was covering about 1/3 of the access door. As I'm looking around wonndering how I'm going to get to the oil filter? I notice that there are 4 bolt hole slots in the cradle that are used to secure the generator. Of the 4, only 2 have bolts in them, the other 2 were missing, as I thought. Upon further inspection, I found the other 2 bolts had been broken off, one was hidden behind the cradle frame and the other partially protruding out the hole.

If you've been following my topics, you know how I have experience more then my share of factory generated problems with our coach, this one being no exception. Over the past 2 years we have been back to the factory for service at least 4 times and on each occasion I complained about a thumping raddle noise under the front end, and each time they would repair something, but never stopping the original problem. Well, the culpert showed itself and has caused me to wonder if they ever checked the the generator, because if they did, the generator would have had to be removed and repaired, and then they would have found that the bolt holes don't line up with the cradle.

To complete my original task, changing oil and filter, which should have taken me maybe 20 minutes, took me 2 1/2 hours. I had to remove the only 2 bolts holding the generator and move it enough to open the access door, so I could change the filter. With that part of the job done, I had to tackle the broken bolts, that needed to be drilled out. Then another error shows itself, I learned long ago, that aluminum and steel don't work together. The bolts were steel and the generator base plate was aluminum. This application should have called for stainless steel bolts or else anti-seez on the bolt threads. The broken bolts were corroded big time and weren't about to come out easy. Once I got them out, I tried to align the generator with the cradle, only 3 holes would line up. At least thats one more then I had before, but it's not right, we'll see how Winnebago handles this.

Tomcat F15

[ESTANG]

I know the feeling Tomcat, when I crawled under mine to do the same service 1 bolt was broken off flush, but at least I could get to my oil filter. (you see my coach was built midweek and not during a training session!!!!!) Good Luck.

ESTANG, were you able to remove it and replace the bolt? Did the hole even line up so you could?

The strange thing about the generator cradle assembly, is it's sceurely monuted to the frame with at least (16) 1/2" bolts. The generator is mounted to the cradle with (4) smaller bolts, when their all their and not broken off.

Tomcat F15

[CaptBill]

When I bought my Horizon (previously owned), it was 16 months old, and the generator had 90 hours on it. I had the dealer where I bought it "change all the fluids and filters". We bought it in Iowa, at Frazer RV.

When I got home, I began my routine of checking into how things look, in and under the coach, and found that little generator access door. So I tried to open it, and found that the generator wasn't lined up quite correctly, so there was no way that door could swing down.

I knew the oil & filter hadn't been changed, so this had to be taken care of right away. I removed the 2 bolts that hold the hinge side of the door to the bottom of the generator, and found that if I filed about a sixteenth off the frame, the door would clear, and open.

That didn't take lonk, and it works fine now, but you would think that they would pay more attention to these details. I guess that's supposed to be the dealer's job! At least the mounting bolts were all present and accounted for.

Tomcat, what year is your Journey? I've run across several other people who have had this same issue, but they were all 2002 journeys or Horizons. I wonder if they "got it" yet?

[Ready2Travel]

When I did the initial 50 hour filter and oil change in my Onan 7500 I also thought it would be a 30 minute task. Wrong, it took me over 2 hours.

The problem I had was in removing the factory installed filter. Must have been put on by a gorilla that used no lubricant on the gasket.

When trying to turn it off with my oil filter band like tool it was on so tight that instead of turning off the filter just collapsed. To remove it I had to punch a hole in it with a long punch and turn it off.

The next change will be a lot easier I hope.

[BucknJeff]

Tomcat,

Like Capt Bill says, the trick is to loosen (or maybe remove) the torx screws that hold the oil filter access door to the "hinge hooks" on the end opposite of the latch releases. The door and it's "Hinge Hooks" are actually removeable without disassembly when they are not impeeded by the generator mount supplied by the OEM.

On our 2001 Horizon, we had the exact same situation that Capt. Bill describes, but we didn't have sufficient space to re-fit the door and make it work. SO.... the procedure was to loosen those torx screws, and manuver the cover around and remove it, being careful to get the hinge-hook assembly as well. To re-assemble, insert the hinge hook into the opening, slide the cover between the OEM support and the generator and screw the torx screws back on. Not an easy process, but with practice, I got good at it.

As much as I love WI, and as well as they do with many, even most things, this is another glaring example of blatant stupidity. What were they thinking? My guess is, they wern't!

As we say around our house... OY!

[RKL2]

Had same problem as Buck and Jeff...solved it the same way....RKL

[Zimectrin]

Our 39QD 'had' the same access door problem as Capt.Bill on the generator. Problem solved in same manner.

Now I need to re-inspect the mounting bolts.

One can't help but wonder... Are the problems unique to your coach or your ability to observe poor workmanship. My fear is that it is the latter and the rest of us had better be more involved. Now smoke in the basement does not take a lot of observation, checking the assembly of a complex machine does, so we consumers trust the manufacture to do it right. I hope that trust is not misplaced.

Even in a Motorhome 'who's looking out for you...?'

(do not want to change the direction of this thread, but thanks for letting me have a say)

[jeb]

I also have a cross member in the way to accessing the genset filter door on our UA. I just removed one or two bolts from the crossmember and swung it out of the way. Dumb design, though.

[ESTANG]

Tomcat, I was able to drill through the center of the bolt and remove with an ez out. Hope this doesn't become part of my normal oil/filter change!

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Tomcat F15:
ESTANG, were you able to remove it and replace the bolt? Did the hole even line up so you could?

The strange thing about the generator cradle assembly, is it's sceurely monuted to the frame with at least (16) 1/2" bolts. The generator is mounted to the cradle with (4) smaller bolts, when their all their and not broken off.

Tomcat F15 <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'll go to my profile and add the following:

2003 Winnebago Journey DL39QD mfg'd 10-02
2003 Ford EB Explorer in tow

My list of retors will be longer then any reply I have written to date, so I'll save it for a day when things are slow.

Hey Winnebago, you need to pay attention to these topics and the replies from your
customers. All the in house engineering you say you do, don't reflect the what we experience in the field/real world.


Tomcat F15

[DriVer]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Tomcat F15:
Hey Winnebago, you need to pay attention to these topics and the replies from your
customers. All the in house engineering you say you do, don't reflect the what we experience in the field/real world. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>No need to worry about that, they're watching and reading.

So far so good on this post we're seeing a lot of problem identifications and resolutions. I see this as valid feedback and useful information.

Let's just keep focusing on the technical aspects of this case and everyone will benefit.

DriVer,

I realize that I have to walk a tight line here, just remember, feelings run high when we experience problems that they won't admit too. The cost of buying and owning a coach is high enough, without having to pay to have it rebuilt at our cost.

Compared to some other forums that I have visited, I think we do a pretty nice job of explaining our situations, and we do it quite respecfully.
Although, sometimes the TRUTH will hurt.

Tomcat F15

[BucknJeff]

Another $.02 on the topic,

While we personally welcome WI's involvement in this forum, I would hate to think that it would hinder valid, articulate, factual statement(s), and the resulting experiences, resolutions or warnings.

On the positive side, we have a unique path into WI management and they have a unique path to the experiences of people using WI products. In an ideal situation, they would use that information to better serve WI customers, which would better serve WI and the stockholders. It's truly a win-win if we all play fair. That's a big IF...

Unfortunately, I am also concerned that experiences and problems identified or shared here could result in punitive actions from WI. I know I have curtailed or down played my frustration with some of the less than stellar experiences I have had with WI as I am still working to resolve more than a few issues some 14 months later. The people I have been working with at WI have been very good to me, and make a good effort. Sadly, many of the issues we have experienced are apparently new to them, and they seem ill prepared to identify the causes or effect a proper, lasting solution. I would hate to think that our progress in getting our coach in order would be handled differently as a result of my sharing our fact-based experiences here. It does lend me pause.

Lastly, I think it is important for ALL parties in this puzzle to remember that a valuable part of this forum is a place to vent your frustrations with your bad experiences. Often this grumbling leads to productive dialog and at the very least, WI needs to hear what kind of grief they are causing! They might do well to realize, this is a rare opportunity!

I know I do.

[DriVer]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BucknJeff:
Another $.02 on the topic <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>A most excellent posting. It is rare indeed to read such a clearly stated position and well written piece that offers a detail understanding of the problem and an open pathway to pursue a mutually beneficial solution.

I also appreciate that you have clearly stated your views about what concerns both customer and manufacturer regarding "our" coaches and I'm sure that your position in this matter will not go unnoticed.

[Zimectrin]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Sadly, many of the issues we have experienced are apparently new to them, and they seem ill prepared to identify the causes or effect a proper, lasting solution. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I would be interested in learning of items others have found to need attention that are new to WI.

I belive that a problem may have been averted by TomCats experience w/ his muffler as the screws on my coach were ready to pierce the muffler. This was not the only post from IRV2 that has sent me looking/fixing and the exchange on this fourm has been very valuable. I encourage every WI owner and salesman to visit this forum on a regular basis.

Sometimes in my frustrations I think WI is "build it this way and let's see how it works." Now I choose to discount that thought, but it is a feeling. I am pleased with my WI product, but there ARE issues that should have been addressed at the factory.

My regret is that I do not have more lifetimes to experience, first hand, other brands of coaches in this great lifestyle...

[Izzyblueye]

BucknJeff: Very well said indeed. This forum was a free and open exchange of ideas and opinions before our coprorate guest came to dinner. I hope it remains this way long into the future. They have every thing to gain and nothing to lose from it's content, what ever it may be. Civility has been a hallmark of Irv2. I don't think we need to worry about insulting the guest.

This topic has come full center and has the spot light where it belongs, and this is just the start. We don't have to use name calling and foul language to get our points across. Expressing ourselves with the facts and details pertinent to the situation is all thats needed to get our views pointed out. Although, I'm thicked skined, and don't mine a little jousting , just be prepared for what may come in return.

Tomcat F15
"The pen is mightier then the sword, but watch out for the tongue, it can be worse."

[DriVer]

Gentlemen, AND I used that term loosely, Thank you for your civility and your concerns about making iRV2 an effective resource both for the members and the forum sponsor.

Happy New Year!