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Old 12-31-2004, 03:41 AM   #21
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All these fixes and helpfull info is great for Winnie Industries to learn from but if you are far out of warranty and you discover problems as in this post which should have been done correctly when the unit was new Winnebago does not want to do SQUAT for you as a customer at the dealer they tell you you have to pay out of pocket or learn to fix it yourself. Maybe if everyone reading this forum would send letters to the company they would wake up. Having to pay for things that go wrong that Winnebago should have done should have done right the first time makes for POOR CUSTOMER LOYALTY.
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Old 12-31-2004, 11:28 AM   #22
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Buck N Jeff I share your views completely. We have had a very frustrating time since purchasing our MH. It has been far from a pleasant experience. In fact, I now find myself thinking about trading and we have only had it for seven months. Needless to say, the models I've been viewing on the internet have not all been from WI.

We would like to step up at least one more time. There is an Horizon/Vectra model that would be very suitable. Given all the problems we have experienced we really are gun-shy about considering another WI product. The problems started at the factory with assembly work that was far from good and it would appear that there was minimal quality control to identify and correct the problems.

Our dealer did little more than remove stickers and vacuum and wash the unit (some call it PDI). Why? Well, very high volumes and not enough staff. This dealer also handles Holiday Rambler and Triple E A and C class units and several other lines for TT and 5ers. It probably has the most diverse service department in Canada with respect to skills and disciplines covered - but that means nothing when they are selling so many units that they can't spend the time on them. A warranty appointment takes 6 weeks. We have our Journey in Florida now (leave to go back down on Saturday) and we will return home in late April (I'm going to get the first year chassis, engine and transmission service done at Freightliner in Gaffney on the way home). In March, I'll have to make an appointment with the dealer for six weeks out since I don't want to wait until I get home to make the appointment and then have to take it in after the warranty has expired (1 year is really much too short - which makes one think about Newmar).

If the problems are resolved by the dealer and the coach stays relatively trouble free from here on, then we will have WI at the top of our list to consider when we move up (but our inspection this time will be a LOT different) . If WI performs and the dealer doesn't, then we have to consider changing dealers. We did not know, when we purchased the Journey, that we had an Itasca dealer the same distance from our home but in the other direction. The only potential problem is that the Itasca dealer is relatively small. That will mean attentive service - but perhaps a lack of the resoureces that our current dealer has available (which we can't seem to get on a timely basis anyway).

When I get to back to Florida in a few days I'm going to have to get underneath and check our generator. I assume I will find the same problem??

I sure hope Driver is correct with respect to WI reviewing these forums. I think its staff might learn about serious quality problems - which I believe they are currently brushing off as insignificant. If I could turn the calendar back now I would not make the same decision I did when I purchased last May. What decision would I make? Frankly, I just don't know. We thought the Journey represented fair value for our dollar (and we certainly didn't get a sweetheart deal with respect to price) but with all the headaches we've had, that is turning out not to be the case. My wife is not well disposed to WI now and she also wants to see a major improvement before she will cast her vote in favour of anohter WI product.

In fairness to WI staff, when I have called they have been very helpful (Question: Why should an owner have to call the factory? What IS the role of the dealer?). Bryan Funke did a great job in getting the Allison warranty issue resolved. However, when I stub my toe on the bowed floor tile in the bath area (that has already had tiles repaired once and completely replaced once) the air is a little blue.

I do hope WI will look at the seatbelt recall issue. The dealer insists that I have to bring the coach in (which as noted, we have to do anyway) so they can check the numbers and order the belts. Of course that means another trip and another $50+ for fuel alone.

I've been thinking about this problem for the past few months and I've slowly come to the conclusion that Winnie (and most other manufacturers, for that matter) would be wise to establish regional service centers that would be an option for buyers when or if their dealer simply can't or won't do the job necessary. I have no desire to drive over 1000 miles to the factory and sit around for a week or two, so this might be an acceptable alternative. Would anyone even look at a car that required the purchaser to get service at the factory? No. This idea might be prohibitive with respect to cost. A better alternative would be generic service centers (no selling of MHs whatsoever) that are staffed to handle CAT, Cummins, DD, Ford and Chev, various chassis, Onan, Norcold, Dometic, etc as well as other "house" components and they could warranty authorized for several manufacturers. These centers could be jointly owned by several MH manufacturers. No doubt they would laugh at this idea, but frankly they (WI and other manufacturers) have to do something because a thorough read of all the forums here and elsewhere indicates a very very high chance of finding yourself with a severe headache as a result of the purchase of a motorhome. I don't think that situation can continue indefinitely and it may take a big blow off and reduction in the market volume to get the message across. It took Detroit a long time to learn the lesson and now it appears they are unable to stem the tide. Toyota has displaced Ford in the worldwide No. 2 position and recent news articles indicate they are likely to pass Chrysler for No. 3 in the US in a few years. A period topic here and on other boards has addressed the question of the need for Japanese quality to get North American manufacturers back on the right path. I have a feeling that the dollar volune just isn't high enough to capture their interest.

When we bought our Journey this past May it appeared to meet our needs very well. What we did not anticipate was buying an RV lot and spending the winter in one place in Florida. Thus, there are some options we would dearly love to have - such as electric locks on the coach door and the basement doors. Two slides with the washer/dryer in the bath area was a great idea at the time of purchase. Now, we find ourselves with a great laundromat on site (Maytag washers and Maytag gas dryers) at a reasonable price. Given the coach will be parked for 5+ months we now think 3 slides and no washer/dryer (well, she thinks she still has to have one but given it wouldn't be used much it can be in the bedroom) would be preferable for our use. The question now is do we trade this spring and if so for what?

Don

(Comments made on Thursday but left to "simmer and mellow" for a day.)
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Old 12-31-2004, 04:13 PM   #23
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GG1:
All these fixes and helpfull info is great for Winnie Industries to learn from but if you are far out of warranty and you discover problems as in this post which should have been done correctly when the unit was new Winnebago does not want to do SQUAT for you as a customer at the dealer they tell you you have to pay out of pocket or learn to fix it yourself. Maybe if everyone reading this forum would send letters to the company they would wake up. Having to pay for things that go wrong that Winnebago should have done right the first time makes for ZERO CUSTOMER LOYALTY. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
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Old 01-01-2005, 01:24 AM   #24
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Like many others "I love my Winnie", and here comes the big BUT. It isn't any fun returning to the dealer time and time again to get warranty work done. Luckily, my dealer is only 10 minutes away and we have a good repoire. Still because of this or that I have had it back 8 times to my dealer,to the Cat/Freightliner dealer three times and the warranty isn't up till Febuary. Like others I have found the Winnie Customer Service Staff most helpful. One of the problems I have had is that before I can get it to the dealer for diagnosis, get the part ordered,return for the fix, something else has happened and the process starts all over again.
We all view our problems as life and death situations(and rightfully so after the dollars we spent) when often times its only the cigarette lighter that doesn't work. Each of us owns the only MOHO that was ever built and expect instant gratification. I hate it when we have to deal with what is rather than what it should be.
I think the dealer/manufacturer has a problem chart. If you can't use your unit for whatever reason it gets some priority and progresses downward from there.
I have found if you help the dealer/manufacturer(attitude,scheduling, understanding,etc) help you, then the fix is less painful. Sorry that I used "I" so much yet this is what i've found to be the case in southeast Virginia. Happy New Year. Go Virginia Tech and
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Old 01-01-2005, 03:41 PM   #25
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"Like others I have found the Winnie Customer Service Staff most helpful. One of the problems I have had is that before I can get it to the dealer for diagnosis, get the part ordered,return for the fix, something else has happened and the process starts all over again."

Ichn2go --- amen. The cycle that hurts.

I have to say I've been happy with CAT and Freightliner (as no doubt I've explained here before). I had a short that was blowing fuses and caused a problem with the air intake heater. I took it to a CAT only dealer - a mistake. They did a good job but the short was on the "Freightliner side" so I had to take it to them. I called one evening and the night guy booked us for the next morning at 10 AM. When we got there they were full. We should not have been booked but the guy was trying to be helpful. They said they had no room. I explained that we were going away shortly and the CAT dealer couldn't finish the work until the short was fixed (when I called Freightliner they suggested that the FTL dealer might have to run another line from the fuse panel up front to the engine). They decided to give it a try and moved out a big tractor from one of the bays. They fixed it very quickly (the teck found a wiring harness where two wires had been skinned and were shorting)and I was pleased. I thanked them very strongly for being so kind. The Service Manager then said "many of the motorhome owners who come in rant and rave and shout and demand we do this or that and do it NOW. You came in and were very polite and hoped we could help you. You helped us by having the problem completely diagnosed and that let us fix it quickly. We were happy to help."

This FTL dealer is also a CAT dealer and I should have gone there in the first place. The CAT dealer and its tech were also great - but if the problem crosses the FTL/Cat line it is much better to be in a place that covers both.

When I got the FTL and CAT recall notices I called this FTL/CAT dealer. They made sure they had the parts and software, scheduled me in within a few days and did the recall work in less than the "standard time" set by CAT. I had them do the 5000 mile Allison filter change and the six month chassis lube as well and was very pleased with their work. The Tech doing the lube found that "W" had shipped my coach without putting the lub in the steering box. The little cap that is on it when it is shipped by FTL to "W" was still on and had not been removed. That could have been disasterous.

I just wish I was as pleased and confident about my "W" dealer. The FTL/CAT guys would NEVER say "we can take you in 6 weeks."

Anyway, we are in a Holiday Inn Express in Knoxville now on the way to FLA. Very nice to have high speed internet available in every room.

Don
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Old 01-01-2005, 06:29 PM   #26
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Most of you have something we really didn't have, and that was a Dealer to fall back on. We purchased our coach through a Canadian Dealer, that striked out three times just trying to deliver it to us and they still didn't do the job right. Then almost 3 months later, they sent an invoice for $1,500 for the ficticous amount they say they didn't get when the money transfered. My credit card account clearly showed they got all their money and they sent us all our papers(CFO-for title, US Inspection certificate and everything we needed) .
The only people we've had to depend on, has been the factory, and they've supported us as needed.

From what we've been reading from you folks, we really haven't missed anything, except another headache.

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Old 01-04-2005, 04:19 PM   #27
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Tomcat - I've sent you a PM.

Don
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Old 01-05-2005, 06:03 PM   #28
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Got under our Journey today. ALL 4 bolts are missing. Looks like they may have been removed intentionally. Has anyone learned any more about this from WI?
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Old 01-06-2005, 04:59 AM   #29
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Don,

Sorry I haven't responded sooner. The wi-fi here in Pioneer Resort is not the best, I have a line of sight to the antana and signal is poor. I'm in my truck sitting next to the building reading my e-mails and surfing IRV2, as if I didn't have better things to do. Not really, IRV2 is always on my mind.

It doesn't surprise me that all your bolts are missing, I've received a number of e-mails from other folks with the same problems.

You know, it's probably going to take some one getting killed before they open their mind set to the fact that there are some major concerns out there that need to be addressed.

Your reply is appreciated, now the rest of you folks need to past these unpleasant experiences on to your friends that own simular coaches. You could save them a lot of problems and maybe
their life.

Example: Say your driving down a bumpy road and the power cord from the generator gets pinched and shorts out, while the generator is running, for one reason or another. You and your whole family are behind the generator, as it's up front, and a fire starts in the generator compartment. If your not fast enought to get everybody out the only door, which is up front, you better know where the emergency windows are and how to use them.

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Old 01-12-2005, 05:04 AM   #30
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dleslie 125 repied in another area about checking the generator bolts in the Newmar product and that they were all there. My response to that, is that these are two different companies with different manufacturing philosphies. One with quantity as the their bench mark and the other with quality as their bench mark. One with a 12 month warranty and the other with a 36 month warranty.

To me, thats a significant difference of distinction.

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Old 01-12-2005, 06:37 AM   #31
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Does any one remember how Fleetwood started down the slippery slope??
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Old 01-12-2005, 07:21 AM   #32
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All Winnebagos do not have this problem. My unit was positioned correctly, the oil was easy to change, the generator is beautiful. It runs and runs.

I only have 7000 miles on the coach, but have 185 hours on the generator. Kubota is a great engine on the Onan 7.5.

Walt
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Old 01-12-2005, 02:43 PM   #33
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Kiwi,
No one said this problem effected all units. If you read the first part of the topic, I detailed my generator as having the problem. And it doesn't matter how many miles you have on your coach, missing or broken bolts are mindless of miles.

Homer, I don't have any experience with Fleetwood. Although, I do remember reading that when they started putting out quantity ov er quality, is when they trun the tied.

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Old 01-31-2005, 05:20 PM   #34
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Checked my mounting bolts today...

Three were up to spec. One was four turns loose.

Loosed the tight bolts, moved the carriage 1/8" with a pry-bar, and tourqued everthing.

Now I can open the trap door on the GenSet as desinged and drive down the road knowing the bolts are tight.

THANK YOU IRV2!! Again.
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Old 01-31-2005, 05:49 PM   #35
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Last sunday was a cleaning day here, the nice weather here for the day in Port Aransas got the other RVers in the same mood and they were cleaning their coaches too.

When I wrote this topic I was back home in southern Michigan, getting ready for our trip here to southern Texas. I didn't take the time to take pictures of the cradle my generator sets on. On sunday, I finely took those picutures and it aggrivated all over again. It's not that my coach has the wrong generator cradle, which is what it looked like in dim lighting. As it truns out, my cradle was not assembled correctly. The driver's side bracket is more then 2" off from matching the front bolt hole. This puts the whole bracket of the cradle on an angle, which blocks the access door. The next oil and filter change will require all bolts being removed and the generator pried out of position.

This is Winnebago quality at it's best. Thanks

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Old 02-03-2005, 05:37 PM   #36
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You guys really got me worried so I checked out the generator bolts and the roof seal.
Glad to report all is well with my '04 Vectra 40AD.
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