Battery Charging Issues

RCranium · 08-01-2016, 01:57 PM

Hello my friends with all the answers!

I have a 2005 Itasca Sonova 30B on a 2004 Ford F-53 chassis/V-10. I bought it six years ago used and put a new chassis battery and two new six volt batteries in it right away. Being familiar with motorhomes I kept it plugged in to shore power a couple days a month to maintain the battery levels. After one year my chassis battery was dead beyond return. I just assumed the chassis battery was not wired to be charged while plugged in to shore power like my previous motorhome. No problem, bought a battery minder to charge the chassis battery while I maintained the coach batteries (have to give the battery MINDER two thumbs up!).

Two years ago while on a three week trip I noticed my coach batteries were not charging while plugged into shore power or driving. Finished the trip charging the batteries with a battery charger I carry. Played around with the batteries after the trip and all seemed ok. The rest of my trips have been dry camping and I use portable solar panels to keep my batteries up (never been a generator fan while camping).

Since the coach batteries were six years old and the chassis battery was five years old I figured it was time to replace them since I do a lot of dry camping. Replaced the batteries with the same size and put new connections on the chassis battery since they were getting old.

Now when I'm plugged into shore power my chassis battery is showing 13.6V and my coach batteries are not charging, only 12.6V. Turned on the refrigerator on propane and the coach batteries are slowly dropping, to the point you can watch it on the volt meter. I start the motor up and the coach batteries charge right away to 13.6v and chassis battery slowly discharges! After plugged in to shore power for 24 hours the coach batteries never go over 12.6v (everything is off in the coach), chassis batteries go right up to 13.6v

I've been doing my homework here on past post. So far it looks like my converter is working (13.6v). I can feel the battery disconnect switch working on the solenoid. Checked the batteries with the auxiliary starter switched on and no changed in the battery voltage (coach 12.6v and chassis 13.6v).

After three days of scratching my head and looking at past post (nothing seems to match my situation) I'm looking for any suggestions from the mighty minds out there! I thank any and all replies!!!

PS; Sorry for the lengthy post, just wanted to give as much info/history as possible....

twinboat · 08-01-2016, 02:08 PM

Did you cross the chassis and couch positive cables, when you swapped out the batteries ?

RCranium · 08-01-2016, 02:13 PM

No I was very careful on making sure all connections were correct. To even make it "Richard Proof" I took a picture with my cell phone before I disconnected any thing.
Thanks for the thought, I'm open to ALL ideas!
Richard

twinboat · 08-01-2016, 02:22 PM

Maybe post some of the pictures.

Mudfrog · 08-01-2016, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twinboat

Did you cross the chassis and couch positive cables, when you swapped out the batteries ?

From the description of the problem, i'm not sure what else it could be. If both positive cables are long enough to reach either battery, then i'd say to swap em. I know the OP is sure he got it right but, it can happen!

RCranium · 08-01-2016, 03:36 PM

Well the price of crow just went up in price!!!

Went out to take new pictures and looked at my original pictures and just couldn't believe it, cables were backwards! My theory in life is if you can't laugh at yourself, you can't laugh at any one else. Right now I'm still shaking my head and laughing at myself! Only "excuse" (not a reason) I can tell myself it was 100 degrees outside and I was in a rush and sweating my butt off.

Thank you gentlemen, it all makes sense now!

Richard

RCranium · 08-01-2016, 06:12 PM

I've got the battery cables correct now! BUT the coach battery is not charging while the engine is running, only when plugged into shore power. The chassis battery is charging when the engine is running, but not off shore power.

Does anyone know if the 2005 Itasca 30B/F-53 Ford is wired to charge the chassis battery while plugged in to shore power?

What could be the problem why my coach battery is not charging while the engine is running?

I activated the auxiliary starting switch with the engine off to compare the two batteries. There is almost one volt difference between the two. I thought I read somewhere here they should read the same when the switch is activated.

Come on guys, make me laugh at myself again for something dumb I've done again!

Thanks! Richard

Jim_HiTek · 08-01-2016, 06:25 PM

You have a BCC (Battery Control Center), correct? If so, you have to wait a bit for the starting battery to be charged up by the alternator...and if it was really low, that can take several minutes. Anyway, wait a few minutes, THEN measure the voltage across the house batts.

Also, your charging system that you put in to charge the chassis batts when you're plugged into shore power could have gone bad, or a battery may be bad preventing it from working, or it may be connected wrong.

skigramp · 08-01-2016, 06:27 PM

Use an old farmer's trick ... take out your jumper cables and hook the two battery banks together overnight ... you only need to connect the terminals that are not connected to ground

twinboat · 08-01-2016, 07:24 PM

If you hit the boost, ( auxilliary battery switch ) and hear it clunk as it activates, you should see the same voltages on each side of it. If it's not, the solenoid is probably bad.

Tap or with a hammer and see if it connects, If it does, you need to replace it.

They seem to fail often.

Another test is to hold the aux switch with the engine running to see if the coach batteries charge. That will by-pass the delay in the Battery Control Center and close the solenoid.

As far as the coach charging the chassis, some do and some don't.

Once you get it working from the chassis to the coach, you can do the same check, with it plugged in and engine off.

Others familiar with your model may let you know if it's bi-directional.

PS: Glad you found the problem.

Rockwood27 · 08-01-2016, 08:18 PM

More than likely, your chassis battery does not charge off of the converter. My 06 Itasca doesn't. If the coach batteries aren't charging from the alternator, I would suspect the Trombetta relay is bad. You can search this site for Trombetta and get many posts. NAPA auto parts and others sell an equivalent relay.

RCranium · 08-01-2016, 10:19 PM

I idled the engine for about 1 1/2 hours tonight and these are my results;

Chassis Battery was taking over 14v when I started.
Coach Battery was showing 12.7v

90 minutes later;
Chassis Battery 13.87 at idle, 12.99 engine off.
Coach Battery 12.86 at idle, 12.82 engine off.

So I think Jim was correct I needed to run the engine longer than I had expected.

Skigramp, the farmers trick sounds like an option using a jump cable. Have you used that as a temporary fix or a long term way to charge the coach battery when hooked-up to shore power? I've been using a Battery Minder to charge the chassis battery now.

Twinboat, I'll be doing some more checking tomorrow. And no, glad you found the problem!

Rockwood27, I'm guessing I might have a problem with my relay. I have read those post, just hoping I didn't need to go there. Almost impossible to get to it. I'm sure I'll be doing a lot of sweet talking while doing it if I need to change it!

Thanks to ALL!

Jim_HiTek · 08-02-2016, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RCranium

I idled the engine for about 1 1/2 hours tonight and these are my results;

Chassis Battery was taking over 14v when I started.
Coach Battery was showing 12.7v

90 minutes later;
Chassis Battery 13.87 at idle, 12.99 engine off.
Coach Battery 12.86 at idle, 12.82 engine off.

So I think Jim was correct I needed to run the engine longer than I had expected.

Skigramp, the farmers trick sounds like an option using a jump cable. Have you used that as a temporary fix or a long term way to charge the coach battery when hooked-up to shore power? I've been using a Battery Minder to charge the chassis battery now.

Twinboat, I'll be doing some more checking tomorrow. And no, glad you found the problem!

Rockwood27, I'm guessing I might have a problem with my relay. I have read those post, just hoping I didn't need to go there. Almost impossible to get to it. I'm sure I'll be doing a lot of sweet talking while doing it if I need to change it!

Thanks to ALL!

Once the chassis battery gets over a certain voltage (the voltage would be listed in your BCC users guide), generally around 12.3 or so, the BCC operates a solenoid which parallels the house and chassis batteries and the alternator is then charging both sets. If there is a difference in voltages across those sets, and in your case that's 1 volt, that points to poor or corroded connections, or a bad solenoid.

Often this symptom indicates the solenoid and you can test that by monitoring the voltage across the house batteries and with a dowel and/or rubber mallet, tap the solenoid. If the voltage jumps up, it's the solenoid. If not, and you've already checked and cleaned the terminals and connections, that points to a bad set of batteries. They need to be serviced and load checked most likely. Do they have enough water?

You can use the 'Farmers Trick' as long as you wish. Won't hurt anything. Gives you more time to learn the system.

The Battery Minder will work if it's connections are clean and tight, and if the batteries are in good condition. If the batteries need service or they're going bad, it's always fighting to maintain charge but only supplies 8 amps and sometimes that's not enough.

Jim_HiTek · 08-02-2016, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RCranium

I idled the engine for about 1 1/2 hours tonight and these are my results;

Chassis Battery was taking over 14v when I started.
Coach Battery was showing 12.7v

90 minutes later;
Chassis Battery 13.87 at idle, 12.99 engine off.
Coach Battery 12.86 at idle, 12.82 engine off.

So I think Jim was correct I needed to run the engine longer than I had expected.

Skigramp, the farmers trick sounds like an option using a jump cable. Have you used that as a temporary fix or a long term way to charge the coach battery when hooked-up to shore power? I've been using a Battery Minder to charge the chassis battery now.

Twinboat, I'll be doing some more checking tomorrow. And no, glad you found the problem!

Rockwood27, I'm guessing I might have a problem with my relay. I have read those post, just hoping I didn't need to go there. Almost impossible to get to it. I'm sure I'll be doing a lot of sweet talking while doing it if I need to change it!

Thanks to ALL!

Once the chassis battery gets over a certain voltage (the voltage would be listed in your BCC users guide), generally around 12.3 or so, the BCC operates a solenoid which parallels the house and chassis batteries and the alternator is then charging both sets. If there is a difference in voltages across those sets, and in your case that's 1 volt, that points to poor or corroded connections, or a bad solenoid.

Often this symptom indicates the solenoid and you can test that by monitoring the voltage across the house batteries and with a dowel to extend your reach, and/or rubber mallet, tap the solenoid. If the voltage jumps up, it's the solenoid. If not, and you've already checked and cleaned the terminals and connections, that points to a bad set of batteries. They need to be serviced and load checked most likely. Do they have enough water?

You can use the 'Farmers Trick' as long as you wish. Won't hurt anything. Gives you more time to learn the system.

The Battery Minder will work if it's connections are clean and tight, and if the batteries are in good condition. If the batteries need service or they're going bad, it's always fighting to maintain charge but only supplies 8 amps and sometimes that's not enough.

mtnmike · 08-03-2016, 06:02 PM

Not certain about your coach, but our 06 Adventurer does NOT charge the start battery when plugged in to shore power. Winnebago changed that later on, not sure when, but I have seen many Winnie coaches start batteries go dead during our parked winter stay in AZ from the normal parasitic drain of the chassis functions.

A couple of us installed Trik-L-Start chargers and problem solved. Easy to install and relatively inexpensive.