Basement AC problem

AFChap · 06-22-2012, 10:26 PM

Developed a problem todays with the basement ac. Came back after a few hours away to find inside hot and AC off. Found "ac circuit 1“ breaker tripped. Reset it and turned AC off and back on. When it tried to start, the breaker again immediately tripped. My digital line meter briefly indicated "ground fault" as the breaker tripped. I disconnect from shore power and started the enerator to try again. When the AC tried to start it killed the generator. Neither compressor nor outside blower starts. In side blower will run if switched to "on". I opened the ac unit up and found some heat damage and oil on what the Svc manual identifies as the "fan capacitor". Also noted some points on the circuit board that appear to be browned from heat, though no other damage apparent.

I got a list of local certified service locations, but most/all likely closed for the weekend at this point. Any suggestions on where to get parts/capacitors in Ft Worth area?

RonnieTucker · 06-23-2012, 08:29 AM

I had a capacitor burn out on my UA and had it repaired at McClains in Denton. They might carry parts in stock. I think that the parts Dept. would be open Saturday.

RonnieTucker

KIX · 06-23-2012, 09:53 AM

The browned out spots on the board are likely caused by loose connections. Most of those connections are a female spade. Remove each one and crimp it closed then reinstall it. There are lots of them. Also, tighten the AC connections at the bottom of the electronics panel.
You don't need an actual Coleman-Mack capacitor........you can use a generic one. 12.5 mFd, 370V is the rating. I am sorry but have no idea where you could find one. Maybe a residential AC repair guy would have one on his truck????

cardiffman · 06-23-2012, 02:22 PM

I'm about to replace the condenser motor, bearing and capacitor on my '06 RVP basement unit. If it helps, I ordered them (they have not arrived yet) from RV Products, a Division of AIRCEL (google them). The capacitor number is 1499-5631, the condenser motor is 1468-A-3029 and the bearing is 6536-3011. This may be useless information, but good luck!

AFChap · 06-24-2012, 02:58 PM

From what I recall, the browned areas on the board were soldered connections ...I'll take another look for spade connections.

We have a hardwired TRC SurgeGuard ...installed in 2004 after low voltage damage to the AC system. The SurgeGuard has cut power a couple of times in the past week. When watching the digital line meter I have not seen voltage less than 109 ---normally is 111 or higher. We had plans for the weekend so I opened and turned on all the ceiling vents and opened the bedroom window a bit to vent the hot air, then got DW and the g-kids in the toad and left. We had a fun weekend at Lake Bridgeport in spite of the heat ...102 was the forecast for today! Meanwhile I found an RVP certified mobile guy a few miles north of us who said he could help on Monday ...said he normally can get the parts locally if he doesn't have what is needed on hand.

AFChap · 06-25-2012, 04:15 PM

UPDATE ... took all the capacitors to an AC tech today. He checked them and said all test w/i specs but I did get a replacement for the one that is leaking oil. But it still doesn't work ...acts like frozen compressor. Local certified dealers are booked for weeks. I found a certified mobile guy who can make it tomorrow. If it looks like parts may take long I may just button it all up and drive the 150 miles home where I can deal with it on my own concrete pad. Looks like there are a few certified service place within a 50 mile radius there, OR I'll pull it out myself and have my house AC guy work the compressor.

KIX · 06-25-2012, 07:36 PM

Paul, I would suggest that you swap the wiring to the compressors so that #2 will become #1. Do this to see if it starts and runs. You probably already know that #1 has to start first before #2 will start. You can swap them at the relay(s) Upper right corner of the panel. If after swapped #2 (wired as #1) starts and runs then your problem is likely the compressor. If it still doesn't start/run the relay may be y9our problem. You could swap the relays to prove that diagnosis.

AFChap · 06-26-2012, 03:04 PM

Well, the "certified" mobile guy finally showed about 11am today ...started asking what all I had done so far "up on the roof" ...bad sign. After looking at the electronics, he admitted this is the first basement unit he has seen. How do these places get listed on the RVP service listing online when they have never worked on a basement unit?

The RVP site code indicates "UF" denotes a basement unit certified service center, but several I called told me right up front they don't work on basement units ...at least they are honest over the phone. Others say they do, but obviously don't have a clue when I talk with them further, or when the tech actually sees the unit. This guy said he would do some research and get back to me but I have little confidence in his ability to help. Before he arrived today, I swapped compressor #1 and #2 wiring at the relays hoping #2 would start and run as #1, but no joy. I told him if he can't fix it in place, I'll pass. We need to be at home base 150 miles East on Thursday pm so will just plan on a hot drive. I found a place about 45 miles from home that sounds like a good possibility over the phone ...hopefully they are what they claim to be.

KIX · 06-26-2012, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AFChap

Before he arrived today, I swapped compressor #1 and #2 wiring at the relays hoping #2 would start and run as #1, but no joy.

The only other thing I can think of is to swap the relays themselves. If you have actually done that in the process of swapping the compressor wiring I would say the problem is the PC board. Seems like I looked for one before and RVP is the only source but I can't remember the price.

The relays are available via Newark Electronics

DAN L · 06-27-2012, 12:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AFChap

Well, the "certified" mobile guy finally showed about 11am today ...started asking what all I had done so far "up on the roof" ...bad sign. After looking at the electronics, he admitted this is the first basement unit he has seen. How do these places get listed on the RVP service listing online when they have never worked on a basement unit?

The RVP site code indicates "UF" denotes a basement unit certified service center, but several I called told me right up front they don't work on basement units ...at least they are honest over the phone. Others say they do, but obviously don't have a clue when I talk with them further, or when the tech actually sees the unit. This guy said he would do some research and get back to me but I have little confidence in his ability to help. Before he arrived today, I swapped compressor #1 and #2 wiring at the relays hoping #2 would start and run as #1, but no joy. I told him if he can't fix it in place, I'll pass. We need to be at home base 150 miles East on Thursday pm so will just plan on a hot drive. I found a place about 45 miles from home that sounds like a good possibility over the phone ...hopefully they are what they claim to be.

did you try to run the #1 compressor with the #2 electrical components by itself, with the #1 cb off?
i answered a similar post on this forum yesterday with more info including part numbers for the relay and hard start capacitor.

Springer45 · 06-27-2012, 11:20 AM

As the new guy i have a couple of questions. When the basement A/C is running what is the "normal" amperage draw with one or both compressors running wither on the gen set or shor power? Also what triggers when one compresoor runs rather than two? Why two compressors with only one condensor and one evaporator?

I am sure these answers exist somewhere else, I just can seem to find them.

Thanks in advance for the info

AFChap · 06-27-2012, 11:29 AM

The first compressor pulls apx 17a. Both together pull apx 24a. The second is called for when the first cannot keep up with the need, normally when ambient temp is over 3 degrees from the thermostat setting (true on both cooling and heat settings) ...no idea on your other questions...

Springer45 · 06-27-2012, 11:58 AM

Thanks. Used it this weekend and was seeing 17/18 Amp draw on the gen set. Thought I had seen higher draw on an earlier trip when attached to shore power but I know ambient was well over 3 Deg. higher than requested.

Sky_Boss · 06-27-2012, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AFChap

The first compressor pulls apx 17a. Both together pull apx 24a. The second is called for when the first cannot keep up with the need, normally when ambient temp is over 3 degrees from the thermostat setting (true on both cooling and heat settings) ...no idea on your other questions...

Those numbers are pretty darn close to what I see too.

DAN L · 06-27-2012, 05:22 PM

the condenser and evaporator are split upper and lower. #1 is upper. #1 has a thermistor for freeze protection, #2 does not.
my amp draw is about the same as others have posted.

a k · 06-27-2012, 05:29 PM

You probably have a locked up compressor and when it trys to start it pulls locked rotor amps. That's what trips the breaker and stalls the Generator.

Springer45 · 06-28-2012, 10:00 AM

Thanks for the info. Thanks particularly DAN l. I guess I will need to spend a little time this weekend finding out if compressor 2 is coming on or not. Don't think my draw should be lower than what you guys see.

Yoda2405 · 06-28-2012, 08:37 PM

Springer45

The system has stacked evaporator and condenser coils. Basically there are 2 systems housed in the one cabinet. If you open the unit you can see the stacked coils.

Good Luck,

Mr.Cleane · 06-28-2012, 09:12 PM

We just purchased our Vectra and all seem fine at first then last Sunday I noticed the inside air warming and checked the air coming out of the vents and it seemed not so cool. Started the motor and ran the dash air and it was cold air.
So I changed filters, cleaned the inside coils (vac'd and rinsed with water) and inspected every thing that I could see but no luck. 100 degree outside and it got up to 86 degrees inside....even using the dash air some.

So the next morning I got up early and turned that sucker down to 60 and it cooled down to 64 before the heat of the day took over. Outside temp got up to 107 that day and the inside never got above 75. It was a temporary fix but worked for the time we were there.

We are going to take it back to the dealer now to have it thoroughly check and charged.

Ive heard of Winn owners installing a top unit to help keep up....seems succesful. I just can't imagine Winn putting out a product that was inadequate. Did they think no one would notice?...lol Surely they tested it and found it to be sufficient. Some people seems to have no problems....others have issues like mine with not keep up on severe hot days.

Springer45 · 06-29-2012, 09:13 AM

Yoda,

Thanks. Could not get my head around how you could run two compressors and one evap/condenser. Stacked makes sense. Two units in one package.