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Old 09-27-2016, 10:24 AM   #1
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Winnebago roof loss

I note on an earlier thread this year that some of you suspected your GRP roof may have some delamination.

As a word of warning to those who might decide to wait and see how things develop, I attach a photo of my 2001 Winnebago Brave that has recently lost most of its GRP roof in strong winds.

I had been up on the roof a few months ago to clean it and was not aware of any delamination existing. And when the wind got under the GRP it tore off two roof vents, the refrigerator roof vent, the bathroom skylight and the TV antenna.

I have after market vent covers fitted and have yet to learn if the windage on them may have precipitated the lifting of the GRP. I am waiting for an estimate to forward to my insurers.
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Old 09-27-2016, 11:31 AM   #2
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That really sucks!!

I just had to reseal my fiberglass roof as it had separated at the endcaps. Manufacturing defect. I would not be happy if the whole thing tore off like that!

But at least you get a new roof.
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Old 09-28-2016, 08:01 AM   #3
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Bummer! Roof loss as you pictured on a Winnebago fiberglass roof is normally due to poor or improper maintenance of the roof cove side seam where the fiberglass tucks into the gutter. If wind gets under the fiberglass, your picture is a fairly typical result, sometimes in a 3-4 ft area, and sometimes much of the roof. That seam is to be checked and repaired as necessary at least once a year. Other roof caulk also needs regular repair. Vent covers would not be a cause as it starts at the roof edges and then peels the sheet off.
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Old 09-28-2016, 10:55 AM   #4
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Once a year you have to inspect the roof-to-sidewall seam and push in to see if the sealant is still holding. Winnie says to inspect twice a year. You would think a good seal would hold for 3-5 yrs but it doesn't. The stress going long-wise when the coach twists going in/out driveways at an angle must be great. And then the thermal hot/cold expansion must be a big factor.
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Old 09-28-2016, 12:16 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Duner View Post
Once a year you have to inspect the roof-to-sidewall seam and push in to see if the sealant is still holding. Winnie says to inspect twice a year. You would think a good seal would hold for 3-5 yrs but it doesn't. The stress going long-wise when the coach twists going in/out driveways at an angle must be great. And then the thermal hot/cold expansion must be a big factor.
Oh great traveler, how is you two?
Hey Bill, hope all is well and you're out there having a great time, AS USUAL! Hope Helen is well. How's the Townies doing? Anyway, back to the topic. Well, I can't remember if you commented on it or not but, waaaaaaaaaay back, almost a year ago, I posted a thread about re-sealing the first 3'-5' of roof-to-gutter seal, on both sides, from the front cap, with PURE SILICONE!

Well, I got "reamed" to say the least, from a bunch on here saying it was the worst product I could use. And they went on to say what products they all use and that Winne has a call-out sheet for that specific application. Well, yes, they do but, based on a semi-recent video posted by Litchten RV (for those of you that don't know, Litchten RV is right down the street from the Winne factory) on roof maintenance, I used the EXACT CORRECT PRODUCT for my particular RV.

And the reason is, we (and you) have FULL BODY PAINT! Apparently if one has full body paint that curves up and over the edge and onto the flat roof, Silicone is the product to use for multiple reasons. But, they say also that, if you have a regular fiberglass sided/gel coat finish, to use another product, not Silicone.

So, the point is, and this applies to the OP too, yes, roof maintenance is really of prime importance on these coaches. I was told, back in that thread that, my Silicone seams would separate in short order. WRONG! I have kept a close eye on them and, in almost a year (3 weeks short, as of this post), they are holding steady and firm. There is absolutely ZERO signs of separation or, peeling or, delamination or, whatever anyone wants to label it, AT ALL! Take care Bill.
Scott
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Old 09-28-2016, 12:32 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meltec View Post
I note on an earlier thread this year that some of you suspected your GRP roof may have some delamination.

As a word of warning to those who might decide to wait and see how things develop, I attach a photo of my 2001 Winnebago Brave that has recently lost most of its GRP roof in strong winds.

I had been up on the roof a few months ago to clean it and was not aware of any delamination existing. And when the wind got under the GRP it tore off two roof vents, the refrigerator roof vent, the bathroom skylight and the TV antenna.

I have after market vent covers fitted and have yet to learn if the windage on them may have precipitated the lifting of the GRP. I am waiting for an estimate to forward to my insurers.
meltec,

Since your coach is an '01, I'd maybe take a different approach on this issue. This is just something to consider. The cost of re-fiberglassing that roof is most likely going to run quite a few bucks. Not sure just how much but, a bunch. So, here's my thought. I did a real nice, top notch BOO-BOO on the back of our coach, a while ago, while backing int it's cave. I damaged it pretty good. Well, off to the local RV body shop I went.

The shop I selected to do the work, also specialized in applying Rhino Liner to the roofs of coaches. I had heard about this process but, had never seen any up close and personal. So, while we were finishing up a tour of the paint shop where the work would be done, I noticed about 4-5 completed, re-roof coaches. I asked if I could climb the ladder on one to check out the product..

He was more than happy to let me. So, I ventured up that ladder and all I can say is "Wow"!!!!!!!!!! Those roofs looked and felt so incredibly nice and seriously STOUT! You could have a dance party up there and not phase a thing. When it's all said and done, those roofs were/are ONE LONG PIECE with no seams anywhere. The roof vents, A/C, plumbing vents etc. are all removed, the area is prepped thoroughly, the coach is taped off and, the roofing coating/material is applied. It's about 3/16-1/4" thick.

Anyway, sure wish I'd have been able to take some pics, without a doubt, they were all impressive. And, to top it off, there were about 6-8 coaches in line to have this done and there were about 5 that already had it. And, many of those coaches were upper end coaches and already had fiberglass roofs. But, the benefits of that Rhino Lining seriously outweigh any roof out there.

As for the cost, it was seriously cheaper than any rubber roof replacement, and, I didn't ask about a fiberglass roof replacement cost but, as stated, many had a F/G roof but, had the R/L installed anyway. So, this is just something to possibly think about.
Scott
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Old 09-29-2016, 09:31 AM   #7
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I'm confused - I was not aware the fiberglass was laminated to roofing material, so how would it delam? Isn't it just a sheet of fiberglass tucked in at the sides like a bedsheet?

I just resealed some of mine, but I used the proflex rather than silicone. Right or wrong, I've just never used any silicone on an RV.
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Old 09-30-2016, 04:00 AM   #8
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Atom Ant,

Mine (2014) is VERY thin fiberglass mounted - gled - to Luan cheap plywood...
I was so surprised when I saw the (cheap) construction, while looking under the shower dome from inside...
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Old 09-30-2016, 08:51 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atom Ant View Post
I'm confused - I was not aware the fiberglass was laminated to roofing material, so how would it delam? Isn't it just a sheet of fiberglass tucked in at the sides like a bedsheet?

I just resealed some of mine, but I used the proflex rather than silicone. Right or wrong, I've just never used any silicone on an RV.
As I look at the pics posted, it does not appear there was any lamination up there. I agree with you that it is only held on by the outside caulking and the roof attachments(vents and a/c and such).
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Old 09-30-2016, 11:48 PM   #10
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Scott, I saw the same video by Lichtsinn as you and agree 100 percent. They even said you could go anywhere to purchase it.
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Old 10-01-2016, 05:08 AM   #11
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Thanks to you all who have posted comments here. My purpose in adding this thread is to highlight an issue that many could easily experience if not vigilant about roof inspection. I certainly was unaware that I had such a problem and might have thought twice before touring Scotland at this time of year! When taking the photos I could not see any obvious evidence of water ingress that could have caused this problem or that there had been much bonding of the GRP to the OBD.

Thanks Scott for the info although I think it may not be so readily available here for RV roofs. I have now forwarded the repair estimate of nearly $17,000 (inc. tax) to my insurers.

Alan
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Old 10-01-2016, 10:50 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meltec View Post
Thanks to you all who have posted comments here. My purpose in adding this thread is to highlight an issue that many could easily experience if not vigilant about roof inspection. I certainly was unaware that I had such a problem and might have thought twice before touring Scotland at this time of year! When taking the photos I could not see any obvious evidence of water ingress that could have caused this problem or that there had been much bonding of the GRP to the OBD.

Thanks Scott for the info although I think it may not be so readily available here for RV roofs. I have now forwarded the repair estimate of nearly $17,000 (inc. tax) to my insurers.

Alan
Is this your regular auto insurance? I see your in the UK so maybe insurance rules are different. One of our group lost their roof last spring on a 2002 Itasca. Insurance company balked at first and then paid it but said they would not the next time as they felt it is a manufacturing defect. My friends ended up with the Rhino lining roof. The area to watch is the J channel. Once water starts getting up under the roof along the channel the game is over.
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Old 10-01-2016, 02:09 PM   #13
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The insurance cover I have is tailored to motorhomes and in my case an RV. I am covered for all the usual including any damage and includes breakdown cover and recovery throughout UK and Europe. It should cover this issue but it is still awaiting insurance assessors inspection to authorize work to begin. The true test of good insurance is when one makes a claim and I do not intend to lose my roof twice!

Yes, owning an RV in Europe/UK is more expensive than you would be used to and of course shipping often costs more than the parts. But ownership of an RV is no less enjoyable and perhaps more challenging on our roads.

ps: a correction to my previous post - OBD should have been OSB (but I guess you knew that)
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Old 10-02-2016, 12:32 PM   #14
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I found this video that more or less shows the factory roof install process (starts about minute 13). I guess it is possible the roof is glued down to the substrate before they set down the trusses.

You'll see how the edges are installed, which should emphasize the need to keep that seal in good shape. It also proved to me that it is not a moisture concern. I originally was concerned that cracks in that seal could result in water getting down into the wall, but it is only an aluminum channel for the roof edge to set in.

In order for them to go to a J-edge like Integra, they would have to use a forming process rather than just rough cut sheets. It would be expensive, but they should just bite the bullet.

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Old 10-02-2016, 03:45 PM   #15
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Here are a couple pics posted by "Mach2mobile" in 2009. There does not appear to be any bonding of the fiberglass to the roof.
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Old 10-02-2016, 04:54 PM   #16
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Ya you're right, it doesn't look like there is.
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Old 10-02-2016, 08:02 PM   #17
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Well Gang,
In the 2014 Grand National Rally for Itasca and Winnebago owners, I got a chance to take the 8-person factory tour. We got down and dirty with all the assemblers and got to ask questions, make comments, listen to reasoning for processes, talked about materials, procedures, improvements, and more. At the time, there has never been or wasn't being performed, any lamination of the roof materials to the substrate/luan. Now, this doesn't mean that there hasn't been some experimenting going on here and there by the factory.

Although we weren't told about it, (and why should we be?) it's possible that they tried a few with lamination, just to track results. I suspect and, if I recall some of the conversations with the roof techs while there, the roof will expand and contract, CONSIDERABLY more than anything underneath it. so, there needs to be some "give" in the system.
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Old 10-03-2016, 09:41 AM   #18
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WELL--------To my surprise the service advisor in Forest City told me this morning the fiberglass IS INDEED bonded to the substructure, and also sealed at the edge with caulking. Is now and always has been.
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Old 10-03-2016, 10:45 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meltec View Post
I note on an earlier thread this year that some of you suspected your GRP roof may have some delamination.

As a word of warning to those who might decide to wait and see how things develop, I attach a photo of my 2001 Winnebago Brave that has recently lost most of its GRP roof in strong winds.

I had been up on the roof a few months ago to clean it and was not aware of any delamination existing. And when the wind got under the GRP it tore off two roof vents, the refrigerator roof vent, the bathroom skylight and the TV antenna.

I have after market vent covers fitted and have yet to learn if the windage on them may have precipitated the lifting of the GRP. I am waiting for an estimate to forward to my insurers.
I had my roof sprayed with RV Flexarmor. It isnt cheap but comes with a lifetime warranty. Never has to be resealed either.
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Old 10-03-2016, 11:36 AM   #20
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WELL--------To my surprise the service advisor in Forest City told me this morning the fiberglass IS INDEED bonded to the substructure, and also sealed at the edge with caulking. Is now and always has been.
Hmmmm,
So much for what we saw on the tour and, was told by the techs. Not to mention what others have had happen on theirs too, same thing, just flew off while driving. Oh well, learn something every day. Now, what was it I learned yesterday???
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