Norcold 1200 Recall Thermal Sensor

p00ches · 02-19-2013, 02:26 PM

Had the recall done at my dealer (since out of business) in March of 2011, and never had a problem until now. The thermal sensor they installed now shows a light, and won't let the 12 volts get thru to the fridge. The yellow tag reads "retrofitted with thermal sensor # R-010", and includes a phone number.

Questions: Where can I get a replacement sensor? Where do the 2 small wires (yellow & blue) go? Is it possible the sensor is ok, and whatever is at the other end of the 2 small wires is the culprit?

Thanks, Doug Welch
2003 Journey DL

docj · 02-19-2013, 02:49 PM

Those sensors are designed to cutoff power to the fridge if excessive temperatures are detected on the back side of the system. It's my understanding that only dealers have replacement sensors and they will only install them if the fridge checks out OK. I definitely would not recommend bypassing the sensor because doing so puts you at risk of a fire. It is possible that the sensor is bad and not the fridge, but without testing to find out which is the case, IMHO you would be foolish to try to defeat the sensor.

OldChief7155 · 02-19-2013, 03:14 PM

As docj said. Look around the chimney for signs of heat, such as discolored thermal wrap. Also look for yellow stains, a sign of ammonia leak which calls for a new cooling unit. I had one installed in Dec, so be prepared to kiss $2,100 goodbye.

Pusherman · 02-19-2013, 04:09 PM

Contact an authorized Norcold service center. Those sensors have been known to cut out for not a good reason, and need to be replaced with an updated sensor.

If it's a sensor problem, Norcold most likely will pay for the replacement.

If it cut out for a reason as it was designed to do, a Norcold dealer should be able to diagnose and determine the problem.

You can also call Norcold directly at 1-800-543-1219 and ask their advice.

Muddypaws · 02-19-2013, 04:19 PM

Definately have it looked at by an authorized service center. If it's a bad sensor it's easily and cheaply fixed.

If it's not a bad sensor then it did it's job.

I do not recommend this but it's possible to reset the box with a fairly strong magnet.

docj · 02-19-2013, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muddypaws

I do not recommend this but it's possible to reset the box with a fairly strong magnet.

IMHO it is a disservice to disseminate information that could result in someone else's injury or even death. Service technicians are not permitted to tamper with warning vehicle devices or to bypass safety features such as airbags. I don't know why it's in anyone's best interest to provide instructions to do the equivalent thing.

Muddypaws · 02-19-2013, 05:51 PM

That particular genie has been out of the bottle for a long time. I found the instructions, i.e. the magnet trick. here several months ago.

p00ches · 02-22-2013, 09:57 AM

Thanks folks for the help. I mistakenly said the sensor, when I meant the box. The two small wires, at the box, must go to the sensor. (1) Did the recall add the box and sensor, or were they already there, and just the sensor was replaced? (2) I will look close at where the 2 wires go in to the sensor, and look for signs of overheating or leaks. I also may bypass the box long enough to see if the display board lights up.
Thanks again, Doug
2003 Journey DL.

1ciderdog · 02-22-2013, 10:16 AM

On the recall both the box and the sensor were added. Prior to the recall the 12 volt hot wire that goes to the black box went to the back of the Norcold. Ground wires also modified.

SCVJeff · 02-23-2013, 02:19 AM

I'll have to agree about bypass/ resetting the fail-safe device. Just because you found the info doesn't means its OK to disseminate it irresponsibly. Bombs, Meth, and LSD recipes are out there too, but..

OP: There were several runs of the early fail-safe mod that alarmed a false positive (meaning it failed in the alarm/ fail mode) when there was nothing physically wrong. But only the shop is going to be able to diagnose this as a box failure and not a overheated burner. YOU cannot fix it, nor should you be fiddling with bypassing it if you expect to go after Norcold if it IS a burner assy. Don't cheap yourself. Just pick up the phone and call Norcold direct.

swyates · 02-25-2013, 07:56 AM

It well documented that the recall is terribly flawed. I never had a problem with my refer until the recall. My box failed within a few months when the refer was turned off and RV was in storage - old battery went weak and unit failed. This is common for the fix to fail with bad power. Norcold won't do anything about it and I've heard Norcold is refusing to pay for repairs when a recall fails. The magnet doesn't work on mine - I think the box is totally fried, but I've bypassed the recall.
BTW: We will be either buying a new MH or pulling the Norcold and replacing with a residential before our next major trip.

bobmac · 02-25-2013, 09:33 AM

Last summer, my charge solenoid failed. I wanted to check it to see if I could do anything as it was Saturday and all service facilities were closed.
Exiting the coach, I turned off both the coach and house batteries.
Returning to the coach about a half hour later, I turned both batteries back on only to find I had a "no-co" indication on the fridge. I then checked the box and found the red light on.
Since I had the two freezers full and it was extremely hot and I had no way to get it looked at until Monday morning, I purchased a bar fridge to avoid losing the food.
What happened to mine was the stack overheated because the batteries were turned off shutting down the cooling fans activating the box. Evidently, that is not supposed to happen according to Norcold but the cause was clear to me.
While I appreciate the advice and opinions that you should not reset the box with a magnet, I can tell you that I would have had I known about it at the time. I carry Service manuals for most items on the RV as I am sure many others do and after consulting these, it is possible to make a knowledgeable decision and monitor the outcome closely. I now have an Amish cooling unit installed.

dportem · 02-25-2013, 09:45 AM

I'm on my third black box fix. The last one was easy for the mech to diagnose. The cuplar that wraps around the chimney needs to be clean of any rust so it can make contact. Has been working nicely for the last year. Hope this helps future black box recipients.

1ciderdog · 02-26-2013, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobmac

Last summer, my charge solenoid failed. I wanted to check it to see if I could do anything as it was Saturday and all service facilities were closed.
Exiting the coach, I turned off both the coach and house batteries.
Returning to the coach about a half hour later, I turned both batteries back on only to find I had a "no-co" indication on the fridge. I then checked the box and found the red light on.
Since I had the two freezers full and it was extremely hot and I had no way to get it looked at until Monday morning, I purchased a bar fridge to avoid losing the food.
What happened to mine was the stack overheated because the batteries were turned off shutting down the cooling fans activating the box. Evidently, that is not supposed to happen according to Norcold but the cause was clear to me.
While I appreciate the advice and opinions that you should not reset the box with a magnet, I can tell you that I would have had I known about it at the time. I carry Service manuals for most items on the RV as I am sure many others do and after consulting these, it is possible to make a knowledgeable decision and monitor the outcome closely. I now have an Amish cooling unit installed.

On mine when I turn off the batteries the Norcold shuts down. It will not run if the batteries are off. I've had the "no co" read out but that was when I was (or actually the RV hopefully not me) was off level by more than a few degrees) The is a not very difficult process for clearing the no co alert.

p00ches · 02-27-2013, 08:14 PM

Thanks everyone, I'm trying to understand this thing as much as possible, before have my dealer work on it. More questions: (1) How can I tell whether its the sensor, or the black box, that is defective? The box light is on, and zero volts on the output terminal. There are no signs of overheating near where the sensor wires disappear. (2) How can I obtain a service manual for the 1201? (3) Can I re-set the fridge if I need to? I re-set it two years ago while on a trip. I understand I only have one more user re-set left.

I bypassed the box long (30 minutes) enough to make sure the fridge would turn on. Works ok on gas but gives a "HE" readout when switched to AC. Any thoughts on whats going on there? Thanks in advance for any help.

Dug Welch 2003 Journey DL

bobmac · 02-28-2013, 01:20 PM

Dug
The sensor and the box act as a single unit so you can't really tell which is defective. If the box has activated, it was likely input from the sensor as I experienced. You can google for the service manual for your unit. That won't likely be much help. Others have noted you can reset the "no-co" on the 1200 series but it can't be done on the 121x family. Norcold should be willing to replace the box thru a dealer. I had no problem getting it replaced last summer but from what I can gather, they were inundated with box failures in the summer and released the "magnet" reset procedure to their dealers then. It must be addressed by a Norcold dealer as I believe Norcold is tracking all issue so they can cover their *ss when the lawsuits start to fly. In my opinion, Norcold/Thetford are not handling this issue professionally as a responsible company should. I believe they should have replaced all defective or potentially defective units when the severity of the problem became known. Unfortunately they didn't and the might of the consumer will descend on them sooner or later.

amanda_h · 02-28-2013, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobmac

Dug
The sensor and the box act as a single unit so you can't really tell which is defective. If the box has activated, it was likely input from the sensor as I experienced. You can google for the service manual for your unit. That won't likely be much help. Others have noted you can reset the "no-co" on the 1200 series but it can't be done on the 121x family. Norcold should be willing to replace the box thru a dealer. I had no problem getting it replaced last summer but from what I can gather, they were inundated with box failures in the summer and released the "magnet" reset procedure to their dealers then. It must be addressed by a Norcold dealer as I believe Norcold is tracking all issue so they can cover their *ss when the lawsuits start to fly. In my opinion, Norcold/Thetford are not handling this issue professionally as a responsible company should. I believe they should have replaced all defective or potentially defective units when the severity of the problem became known. Unfortunately they didn't and the might of the consumer will descend on them sooner or later.

I agree with everything that Bob has said. Like others here, we've had our recall re-done several times with updates because of failures. Norcold explicitly told us that everything pertaining to the recall HAS to be done by an authorized dealer or repair person. I suppose the exception to this is if a Nocold tech is giving you instructions over the phone to do "the magnet trick" and in this case, they are documenting it on their records. I also would be hesitant on doing "the magnet trick" myself without Norcold instructing me to do it.

I also agree that they are handling all this very poorly.

-harry

AlexP · 03-03-2013, 03:18 PM

Went through a similar experience last month. With not quite a year on the recall, the light went on on the black box. Well it was the weekend, and since everything looked fine (no Yellow and no smell of amonia) I moved the wires so the box was no longer in the circuit and the refridgerator came back on. (Yes I know.) On Monday I called Norcold and they told me to take it to an authorized service center. Gave me a name near where I was. Tech there had a tone that told me he did not want to deal with it. I ended up at Camping World who charged me 30 minutes to diagnose it (nothing more than I had done, but by an authorized person.) He then talked to Norcold and a new recall kit was put in the mail to that Camping World. So I came back a few days later and they installed it for free.

So for $50 and two trips, I am back in business.

Alex
2004 Itasca Meridan

amanda_h · 03-03-2013, 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexP

Went through a similar experience last month. With not quite a year on the recall, the light went on on the black box. Well it was the weekend, and since everything looked fine (no Yellow and no smell of amonia) I moved the wires so the box was no longer in the circuit and the refridgerator came back on. (Yes I know.) On Monday I called Norcold and they told me to take it to an authorized service center. Gave me a name near where I was. Tech there had a tone that told me he did not want to deal with it. I ended up at Camping World who charged me 30 minutes to diagnose it (nothing more than I had done, but by an authorized person.) He then talked to Norcold and a new recall kit was put in the mail to that Camping World. So I came back a few days later and they installed it for free.

So for $50 and two trips, I am back in business.

Alex
2004 Itasca Meridan

To be truthful, Alex, I don't think you should have paid anything. It's Norcold's fault that this recall has to be done in the first place and it's also Norcold's fault that they issued so many recall kits that went defective and that they had to revise so many times. I've had two kits go defective and haven't yet paid to have them replaced but I'm generally upset at Norcold/Thetford for this entire situation so if I ever have to spend anything to get an additional kit installed, I'm going to be mighty mad.

-harry

1ciderdog · 03-03-2013, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amanda_h

To be truthful, Alex, I don't think you should have paid anything. It's Norcold's fault that this recall has to be done in the first place and it's also Norcold's fault that they issued so many recall kits that went defective and that they had to revise so many times. I've had two kits go defective and haven't yet paid to have them replaced but I'm generally upset at Norcold/Thetford for this entire situation so if I ever have to spend anything to get an additional kit installed, I'm going to be mighty mad.

-harry

I also have had two of the black boxes replaced at no charge. The only expense was the fuel to get to the RV shop. Camping world should not be charging for this.