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Old 09-20-2009, 07:26 PM   #1
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HWH system has failed

I have a model 610 HWH unit on my 2002 Ultimate Advantage. This afternoon when we got ready to come home, neither the front or back slide out would come in. When you pressed the retract switch for either one, there was a noise like the pump was running but, no motion from either slide out. I did retract the jacks and then did the auto leveling and the auto leveling system worked fine and re-leveled the coach so I thought "OK the pump is running fine. I pulled the module up front under the dash and all of the fuses were ok. Finally got everything set up for a manual pull in and went out and opened the valves on the silonides (can spell that one) and no luck -- we could not retract. Then I started to look at the diagrams included in my paper work and found out there are two silonides for extension and two for retraction. Got back under the coach and opened the valve on the rear retraction one and we were able to pull it back in. Still no luck on the front one. We still were getting the sound of the pump running when pressed the switch (we were trying everything). So we let the coach down off of the jacks and then when we tried the autolevel again --- nothing. There is just a "click" back where the manifold area is. Now also when the retract button for the slide is pressed, it just clicks also --- no sound like the hydraulic pump is running. Anyone have any thoughts --- right now my MH is at a state park -- my son came and got me and the wife and brought us home --- with the front slide out extended and it appears no hope of getting it retracted in the present condition.

Sorry for the long post but, I am trying to furnish as much information as possible. Could we have burned out the pump with the continual trys ? Would a bad silonide cause this ? Main control board out ? I have tried to check as much as I could and am looking for suggestions. Oh there is hydraulic fluid in the tank so it is not dry.
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Old 09-20-2009, 08:45 PM   #2
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Give HWH a call Monday.
Also check there web site tonight for help.
Is the E brake engaged?
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Old 09-20-2009, 11:19 PM   #3
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you have to have a good starting battery. try retracting with the engine running. you need more than 12v. 12v is considered 50% discharged.
the parking brake must be set and the parking brake light must be on.
next, check the grounds at the ground stud near the hydraulic pump. they could be loose or corroded. there are inline fuses there also.
if you have good battery voltage and the solenoid at the pump just clicks, try tapping the pump motor housing with a hammer at the end where the heavy wires connect with the retract switch energized. the motor brushes may not be making good contact or could have been overheated. someone else on this forum said that you can get a similar pump motor from napa.
it takes a lot of power to manually retract a slide with the solenoids released.
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Old 09-21-2009, 08:25 AM   #4
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David;

My coach did that once and my motor had failed. Hitting the motor with a hammer worked to get the slides in once and I was able to get home. The motor never worked again. HWH sent me a new motor UPS the next day. If you have not called HWH yet their number is 800-321-3494.

Good Luck;
Don
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Old 09-21-2009, 10:03 AM   #5
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As others have said parking brake must be on , Start the coach to ensure voltage, there are 3 fuses with the solenoids 2 20 Amps and a 40 Amp, Mine did exactly what yours was doing motor turning but no movement it turned out that will the fuses was good the tab on the fuse was corroded from a bad connection. Pull out each fuse check to make sure good and look at connector pocket.

On the electric pump motor DO NOT TIGHTEN NUTS ON CABLE TO MOTOR WITHOUT AN ADDITIONAL WRENCH ON THE NUY UNDER THE CABLE. not doing so will break the brush housing, do not ask me how I know $140 for a new motor.

As for the Solenoids release nuts do not open them all only one at a time the system uses a loop system with the oil draining back to the tank. 2 solenoids are extend one for the jacks and one for the slides . The other is for the retract make sure you open the right one. I would check my manual but it is the coach which is having the Norcold recall completed. The slides will go back in as as you crank them in the oil goes back to the tank.

Good Luck
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Old 09-21-2009, 11:14 AM   #6
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The first time this happened, we heard a click when we pressed the retract button on any of the three slides. I was showing 12.1VDC on the engine batteries. We brought it in for service and were told the engine batteries needed to be replaced. We replaced them and the problem went away for a couple of months. The problem is back and it takes a couple of tries and they retract. The next time it took a couple more tries, (four), but they all came in. The last three times they didn't retract, we started the engine and let it run for about 5 minutes and they all came in the first time. Each time the engine batteries were 12.1 to 12.3 before starting the engine.
I'm going to watch the engine battery voltage after we start the engine to see what it is when we retract.
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Old 09-22-2009, 04:10 PM   #7
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I appreciate all of the replys that everyone has made --- lots of good suggestions. I did make the call to HWH on Monday and Frank (did not get his last name) spent over an hour and half with me on the phone checking out "things." We started with the battery voltage -- mine was at 13.2 volts so we had voltage there. Next we rechecked all of the fuses on the master module under the dash (I had already checked all of them) and they were all good. Next I crawled under the coach (had to go through the door where the propane tank is and then up behind the extended slide as the levelers had already been retracted (did that when trying to see if the pump and pump motor was good or not). We checked out the main relay for proper voltage - checked the three fuses down there (40 amp and 2 20 amp) -- all checked out OK. I had told Frank that all I was getting the "clicking" sound. We decided to check the pump motor -- I got a pair of jumper cables and went from the hot side of the first relay (that had the proper voltage and went straight to the motor connection --- nothing happened. We then decided that the pump motor had given out. So I now have one on the way to me from HWH (I did have to pay for it as my MH is a 2002.

About the reply saying " it takes a lot of energy to move the slides in without the hydraulic assistance" -------- YOU ARE VERY CORRECT. First, since my main slide out drops, I had to use 2 -- 3 1/2 ton floor jacks to raise up the slide out and then start to push it back in ----- very VERY slow -- about 1/2 inch a time and a lot of back breaking pushing. It took me a day and half to get the two slides back in and that was also with the assistance of the wenches provided with the coach (just as a passing thought -- the front wench bent with the strain being put on it).

The MH is now with Cummins South and Bill is going to go through the system very very well. I am covered with my extended warranty (less my $100.00 deduct) so he is going to look at the pump, solenoids, control module, etc.

I will let you know the final outcome as we progress along. The pump motor is expected here on Thursday or Friday of this week. Guess we will not be leaving for Myrtle Beach as planned this Sunday -- OH well --- maybe later on next week.

I will say that Frank of HWH did a tremendous job of stepping me through a lot of steps checking this out and when I called him back with some follow up questions I got straight through to him using the code word we had set up for my problem. Great people there !!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 09-26-2009, 07:29 AM   #8
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I know I'm a little late coming to this conversation but wanted to add my 2 cents.

I had a similar situation where I couldn't retract the main slide. I could hear the motor working but no movement. I called HWH and went through all the checks with them, voltage, fuses, etc, and everything checked out fine. The tech decided to try switching out the bypass valve for the jacks (they were working) with the slide bypass valve. That worked, the main slide came in.

HWH sent me a new valve and all is well.

Paul
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Old 09-26-2009, 08:23 PM   #9
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I took the coach to Cummins South -- ended up that the motor relay and the pump motor were both bad. Both were switched out and all is well once again. Just as a point of interest, I have an extended warranty with RV Shield and they paid for everything done to correct the problem. All I was out was my $100.00 deductible. Cost of the repair including parts and labor was a little over $600.00.

Also, I received the motor from HWH on Wednesday --- had ordered it on Monday noon -- that is great service.
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Old 09-26-2009, 09:06 PM   #10
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David;

I am happy for you that your system is working again. Thanks for reporting back. I know the sick feeling when a slide will not go in especially the big one. I always figured it would take a group of Boy Scouts to push one in. When HWH sent my new motor it came with a new relay. I did not need it so I now have a spare.

Don
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Old 09-27-2009, 02:29 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David K View Post
I appreciate all of the replys that everyone has made --- lots of good suggestions. I did make the call to HWH on Monday and Frank (did not get his last name) spent over an hour and half with me on the phone checking out "things." We started with the battery voltage -- mine was at 13.2 volts so we had voltage there. Next we rechecked all of the fuses on the master module under the dash (I had already checked all of them) and they were all good. Next I crawled under the coach (had to go through the door where the propane tank is and then up behind the extended slide as the levelers had already been retracted (did that when trying to see if the pump and pump motor was good or not). We checked out the main relay for proper voltage - checked the three fuses down there (40 amp and 2 20 amp) -- all checked out OK. I had told Frank that all I was getting the "clicking" sound. We decided to check the pump motor -- I got a pair of jumper cables and went from the hot side of the first relay (that had the proper voltage and went straight to the motor connection --- nothing happened. We then decided that the pump motor had given out. So I now have one on the way to me from HWH (I did have to pay for it as my MH is a 2002.

About the reply saying " it takes a lot of energy to move the slides in without the hydraulic assistance" -------- YOU ARE VERY CORRECT. First, since my main slide out drops, I had to use 2 -- 3 1/2 ton floor jacks to raise up the slide out and then start to push it back in ----- very VERY slow -- about 1/2 inch a time and a lot of back breaking pushing. It took me a day and half to get the two slides back in and that was also with the assistance of the wenches provided with the coach (just as a passing thought -- the front wench bent with the strain being put on it).

The MH is now with Cummins South and Bill is going to go through the system very very well. I am covered with my extended warranty (less my $100.00 deduct) so he is going to look at the pump, solenoids, control module, etc.

I will let you know the final outcome as we progress along. The pump motor is expected here on Thursday or Friday of this week. Guess we will not be leaving for Myrtle Beach as planned this Sunday -- OH well --- maybe later on next week.

I will say that Frank of HWH did a tremendous job of stepping me through a lot of steps checking this out and when I called him back with some follow up questions I got straight through to him using the code word we had set up for my problem. Great people there !!!!!!!!!!!!!
when neither of my slides would retract, i used the tie down for the aft end of the front slide and mounted it on the bedroom slide vertical metal piece next to the bed and used a 1000# come along from harbor freight and a 3' 2x4 laid on the outside of the emergency exit window wall studs attached to a long strap to pull the aft slide in.
on the forward slide, the fabric winch mount bent so badly it quit working. i used the winch mount on the stair landing and the come along to finish the job.
make sure that all 4 of the slide de-pressurizing valves are released about 3 turns and go very slow.
i attached the other fitting from the fwd slide to the floor by the heater duct next to the bed and use these 2 fittings and a new hold down strap purchased from winnebago.com as hold downs to keep the bedroom slide from moving out while i am under way. i use 3 more pieces of 2x4's placed above the slides, 2 in front, 1 in back, to keep the top of the slides fully retracted.
my hwh slide system initially failed when the aft slide migrated out about 9" while i was going across the I-5 bridge between oregon and washington. but that is another very long story...
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