Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 10-24-2013, 11:08 AM   #1
RKL
Winnebago Owner
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 131
HWH jacks retract miracle

Tested jacks before leaving upstate NY.did not use them until I arrived at my site in Florida and immediately Lowered jacks and then decided to move coach further forward on pad . Hit retract and front passenger and rear driver moves upward 2 inches and stopped . Pryed them up and tried again, no luck. Pryed them again and shut down for the night . Next morning moved coach foward, lowered jacks and tried a retract. All jacks came up fast. Tried. Again,same result. Checked fluid , a little on high side,one ibch from top of resivor.

Does anyone think that the problem was fluid expansion and after cooling over night all was ok. Should I drain some out?
Fluid is at top of upper line on cap when screwed in all the way per hwh tech. Thanks. Rkl
__________________
2002 Journey 36GD, Roadmaster Blackhawk tow system, 2006 Jeep Commander Hemi, 2005 Jeep Wrangler...Webster NY/Ft Myers Fl.
RKL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2013, 01:45 PM   #2
Winnebago Camper
 
alkillion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 5
Had similar situation. After I ran them up and down several times they worked fine.
These pistons seem to be real sensative to dust and grit. It gets between the piston and outer sleeve and makes things bind up on retract.
I made it a point to wipe down the pistons before retracting.
Good Luck
__________________
May the Forza be with us!
2014 Winnebago Forza, Freightliner XCS, Cummins 340hp
2006 Jeep Wrangler Toad
alkillion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2013, 05:49 PM   #3
Winnebago Master
 
jerichorick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Full-timer/volunteer w/SOWERS
Posts: 2,734
Cleaning the jacks with WD40 and a soft cloth is important. I had a problem with my jacks on my '05 Vectra. Turned out to be a failed "shuttle valve". Also, if the jacks are clean and the shuttle valve is working correctly you could have weak springs. I think HWH has improved them since your coach was built. (I would often have to raise a jack manually until I had the shuttle valve replaced.)

I don't recommend this what I am about to tell you just yet. I bought some CRC Power Lube on Amazon and cleaned my jacks with it. So far so good. I know silicone spray is NOT recommended by HWH. So, let me try this for a while and I will post the results on irv2 when I am convinced I am doing more good than harm.
__________________
Rick & Melissa Young & Dawson (RIP), 2011 Meridian 40U, FL XCL, ISL 380HP/DEF, Al 3000 MH, 2014 Honda CR-V, SMI AF1, Blue Ox TruCenter & tow equip.,EEZTire TPMS.
Servants On Wheels Ever Ready. Best job we ever paid to do . (full time volunteers)
jerichorick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2013, 08:24 PM   #4
Winnebago Master
 
Ray,IN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: North America somewhere
Posts: 2,044
I doubt fluid expansion is an issue. The breather cap/fill opening is also an overflow point, if your tank is over-filled while the jacks are extended, then you raise the jacks, the only thing that will happen is you get to clean up the mess all over the tank and off the ground/pavement. That is, providing someone has not removed the breather cap and replaced it with a pipe plug.
__________________
2000 Winnebago Ultimate Freedom USQ40JD, ISC 8.3 Cummins 350, Spartan MM Chassis. USA 1SG, retired;PPA,Good Sam Life member,FMCA. "We the people are the rightful masters of both the Congress and the Courts - not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow men who pervert the Constitution." Abraham Lincoln
Ray,IN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2013, 07:41 AM   #5
Winnebago Master
 
AFChap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: ...hopefully on the road!
Posts: 1,653
Quote:
Cleaning the jacks with WD40 and a soft cloth is important
WD40 attracts dust ...more likely to cause problems in this case than cure anything. I have 10 years and 85k miles on my HWH jacks and have never touched the rams. Cleaning/lubing the rams should not be necessary ...I never did it on farm equipment either. When a hydraulic ram doesn't move, look for a fluid or valve issue ...or with these sometimes a spring which is not the problem in this instance
__________________
Paul (KE5LXU) ...was fulltimin', now parttimin'
'03 Winnebago UA 40e TRADED OFF JUL 2023 / '17 Jeep Grand Cherokee toad
AFChap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2013, 10:08 AM   #6
Winnebago Master
 
wa8yxm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 851
I see this "WD-40" recommendation from time to time, I also see "The same fluid you top off the jacks with" recommended.

This is what I recommend: READ THE FINE MANUAL.. It will state the PROPER cleaner/lubricant to use. HINT, I have not mentioned it in this post.
__________________
Home is where I park it!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
wa8yxm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2013, 11:30 AM   #7
Winnebago Owner
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: behind the steering wheel
Posts: 95
i dont think fluid expansion would have caused this. your fluid level in the tank was ok at 1 inch below the top. fluid level isnt that critical with hwh systems. you actually have a quart more than it takes to operate the system in the tank. if you are retracting, it would not affect the operation at all.
it may have been that your jacks were having trouble retracting because of overheated solenoids. apparently your system shut down prematurely. severe overheating will do that. cooling down overnight seems to have helped.
does your alarm go off while traveling? weak springs, or borderline solenoid valves will cause this. if you need further assistance, please feel free to call me 602-549-3638
azpete is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2013, 12:03 PM   #8
Winnebago Owner
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Bonney Lake, WA
Posts: 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by wa8yxm View Post
I see this "WD-40" recommendation from time to time, I also see "The same fluid you top off the jacks with" recommended.

This is what I recommend: READ THE FINE MANUAL.. It will state the PROPER cleaner/lubricant to use. HINT, I have not mentioned it in this post.
Why not?
__________________
Phil in Bonney Lake, WA
2003 Itasca Horizon, 32TD
Madrona is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2013, 12:14 PM   #9
Winnebago Owner
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Anacortes, WA (Stick & Brick)
Posts: 68
I guess I'm more fortunate than I realised with my jacking system (don't know the brand without looking and the coach is in its winter dock). As a former airplane hydraulic systems engineer, It hadn't dawned on me that some systems don't have pressure retract and rely on external springs (shows how much I don't notice!).

On my system, there's an external line running to the bottom of the cylinder. In "retract" mode, pressure from the pump goes to the back-side of the piston and retracts the jack.

As I've mentioned in another string, I don't leave my jacks down when stored at home, as we're across the street (on the low-cost side) from homes that are salt-water marina waterfront. The jacking system manufacturer says not to leave them down in close proximity to salt water. When is asked how they defined "close", the reply was "within 60 miles". I doubt we're much over 60 yards away.

When we're camping near salt water, I wrap a garbage bag around the piston rods after they're extended.
__________________
Frank Damp -Anacortes, WA,(DW- Eileen)
ex-pat Brits (1968) and ex-RVers.
frankdamp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2013, 08:27 AM   #10
Winnebago Master
 
jerichorick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Full-timer/volunteer w/SOWERS
Posts: 2,734
Quote:
Originally Posted by AFChap View Post
WD40 attracts dust ...more likely to cause problems in this case than cure anything. I have 10 years and 85k miles on my HWH jacks and have never touched the rams. Cleaning/lubing the rams should not be necessary ...I never did it on farm equipment either. When a hydraulic ram doesn't move, look for a fluid or valve issue ...or with these sometimes a spring which is not the problem in this instance
Not true. HWH recommends this be done from time to time because WD40 dries and leaves no sticky residue as silicone sprays will. Please refer to the latest information on their website. Here is the link: http://www.hwhcorp.com/ml47149.pdf

I hope this helps to clear up any confusion. I had a problem with my jacks coming slow or sticking on my last coach. I had two problems. One was that i was using silicone spray on them and the other was that the shuttle valve was failing and was finally diagnosed and replaced at Forest City.
__________________
Rick & Melissa Young & Dawson (RIP), 2011 Meridian 40U, FL XCL, ISL 380HP/DEF, Al 3000 MH, 2014 Honda CR-V, SMI AF1, Blue Ox TruCenter & tow equip.,EEZTire TPMS.
Servants On Wheels Ever Ready. Best job we ever paid to do . (full time volunteers)
jerichorick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2013, 08:51 AM   #11
Winnebago Owner
 
Sky_Boss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: ON THE ROAD...SOMEWHERE
Posts: 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Madrona View Post
Why not?
I think the point being made by wa8yxm is folks really need to read manuals. Any site dedicated to supporting others with any device be it mechanical, electrical or whatever has many positives but it also has negatives. The biggest negative is that folks listen to other folks and then think they have the proper answer. Clearly, nothing should be taken as correct unless it is validated by reading instructions/manuals too.

Now, I could be wrong about his intent but...I like my interpretation anyway.
__________________
Don, Sandee & GSD Zeus. Gardian for GSDs Gunny (7/11/15) & Thor (5/5/15)
2006 DSDP 4320, Spartan MM IFS, 2013 CR-V, Blue Ox Avail, SMI AF1, Samsung 197R Refer.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Sky_Boss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2013, 09:09 AM   #12
Winnebago Master
 
AFChap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: ...hopefully on the road!
Posts: 1,653
Quote:
Not true. HWH recommends this be done from time to time because WD40 dries and leaves no sticky residue as silicone sprays will. Please refer to the latest information on their website. Here is the link: http://www.hwhcorp.com/ml47149.pdf

I hope this helps to clear up any confusion. I had a problem with my jacks coming slow or sticking on my last coach. I had two problems. One was that i was using silicone spray on them and the other was that the shuttle valve was failing and was finally diagnosed and replaced at Forest City.
Read that article carefully to be SURE there is no confusion ...it begins by saying that lubrication of the shafts is normaly neither necessary nor desired. It refers to WD40 as a cleaner to use IF the shafts have been crudded up by silicone or other substances. (don't crud them up and you won't need WD40!) And when it mentions WD40 for cleaning, it also says you should follow by wiping the shafts with a clean, soft cloth. if you don't wipe them down very well, the WD40 WILL attract dust/dirt. WD40 is primarily a cleaner/de-gunker. If a lube is needed, ...and it is NOT ... it would be added after the cleaner/degunker is wiped off.
__________________
Paul (KE5LXU) ...was fulltimin', now parttimin'
'03 Winnebago UA 40e TRADED OFF JUL 2023 / '17 Jeep Grand Cherokee toad
AFChap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2013, 09:25 AM   #13
Winnebago Owner
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: behind the steering wheel
Posts: 95
there is nothing better than a owners manual unless its a service manual. both have valuable information that allows an owner to make a good decision.
in almost all of my replies to questions, the first thing i ask is if the owner has a service manual. its almost impossible to discuss a problem if both parties dont have the same information.
as far as the wd40 question, read the manual first, then do what you want. its your jacks, so do as you wish.
azpete is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 06:49 AM   #14
Winnebago Master
 
jerichorick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Full-timer/volunteer w/SOWERS
Posts: 2,734
Quote:
Originally Posted by azpete View Post
there is nothing better than a owners manual unless its a service manual. both have valuable information that allows an owner to make a good decision.
in almost all of my replies to questions, the first thing i ask is if the owner has a service manual. its almost impossible to discuss a problem if both parties dont have the same information.
as far as the wd40 question, read the manual first, then do what you want. its your jacks, so do as you wish.
Now, who can argue with this advice? Only a fool. I have seen many 'opinions' fall flat on their face when measured against facts.

One of the problems I have read in this forum about jacks is failure because of a slight bend to the ram. I wonder if the manufacture installed under rated jacks for the weight application?

My jacks on this coach have a slight leak. The landing pad is a bit moist on top but no puddling. I have cleaned the rams with the WD40 and, this last time, sprayed them with the CRC Power Lube. So far so good. My slides ride on Power Gear and I have sprayed the power lube on the rack and pinion gears and rollers. This is recommended by Power Gear. Once again, so far so good.

My patio awning sounded like a cat fight when it was opened or closed. I sprayed the track and moving parts down with the CRC and the cats are gone! This seems to be great stuff. And I thank irv2 for introducing me to it.
__________________
Rick & Melissa Young & Dawson (RIP), 2011 Meridian 40U, FL XCL, ISL 380HP/DEF, Al 3000 MH, 2014 Honda CR-V, SMI AF1, Blue Ox TruCenter & tow equip.,EEZTire TPMS.
Servants On Wheels Ever Ready. Best job we ever paid to do . (full time volunteers)
jerichorick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 07:47 AM   #15
Winnebago Owner
 
palehorse89's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 86
My Father has owned a excavating business for over 50 years with equipment working in the dirt and dust and I have never seen him wipe any of the cylinders down on any of his equipment and I have never seen anyone that owns any type of equipment with hydraulic cylinders wipe them down. Most all hyd. cylinders have wipers before the seals. Maybe this procedure is unique to just some RV owners? Again......... to each their own and if it works........
__________________
2000 Newmar MADP 4060, 350ISC, Spartan MM, IFS 2011 Jeep JK, M&G Braking, 2014 MTI 27' Hog Hauler, Wireless brake control, 2006Ultra & 1989 Springer
palehorse89 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 09:47 AM   #16
Winnebago Owner
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Bonney Lake, WA
Posts: 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sky_Boss View Post
I think the point being made by wa8yxm is folks really need to read manuals. Any site dedicated to supporting others with any device be it mechanical, electrical or whatever has many positives but it also has negatives. The biggest negative is that folks listen to other folks and then think they have the proper answer. Clearly, nothing should be taken as correct unless it is validated by reading instructions/manuals too.

Now, I could be wrong about his intent but...I like my interpretation anyway.
Yours is a good interpretation. Not everyone has a manual, not everyone can understand what the manual is saying when using technical terms. It's why forums like this exist, to get the real world experience of users that may have had the same issue. I agree that you shouldn't read one answer and assume that it is accurate. But when you have several seasoned veterans giving the same answer, over and over, it's probably correct.

"Read the manual" is akin, in my mind, to "google it." We are all here to help and be helped. Reading the manual and googling for answers is certainly helpful, but coming here is at least as helpful, at least most of the time.

I've just received excellent help here on a question I asked just a few days ago. A $600 repair bill was turned into a $25 dollar part and 10 minutes with a Phillips screwdriver. Accessing the repair manual was part of my research and I suppose the answer was there with a little filtering and deduction, but it was no where near as clear as the answer I found on this forum. I'm grateful.
__________________
Phil in Bonney Lake, WA
2003 Itasca Horizon, 32TD
Madrona is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2013, 09:08 AM   #17
Winnebago Master
 
jerichorick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Full-timer/volunteer w/SOWERS
Posts: 2,734
Quote:
Originally Posted by palehorse89 View Post
My Father has owned a excavating business for over 50 years with equipment working in the dirt and dust and I have never seen him wipe any of the cylinders down on any of his equipment and I have never seen anyone that owns any type of equipment with hydraulic cylinders wipe them down. Most all hyd. cylinders have wipers before the seals. Maybe this procedure is unique to just some RV owners? Again......... to each their own and if it works........
Construction equipment hydraulics are set up to pull and push the ram under high psi pressure. Most of our RV jacks are high psi down and spring retract. Dirt is a problem when packed in the wiper seal. Cleaning the ram with a soft cloth to avoid scratches and WD40 or soap and water is the practice recommended by HWH. The new replacement springs for these jacks are of a heavier gauge wire and pull harder on the retracting jack, which helps some.
__________________
Rick & Melissa Young & Dawson (RIP), 2011 Meridian 40U, FL XCL, ISL 380HP/DEF, Al 3000 MH, 2014 Honda CR-V, SMI AF1, Blue Ox TruCenter & tow equip.,EEZTire TPMS.
Servants On Wheels Ever Ready. Best job we ever paid to do . (full time volunteers)
jerichorick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2013, 05:19 PM   #18
Winnebago Owner
 
palehorse89's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 86
Hydraulic cylinders are all the same and yes equipment has pressure both ways and HWH jacks are pressure down and spring return, but as far as dirt "packed" into the wiper seal.........on a motorhome,,,,,,,, I am not sure where you use your RV and what conditions you use your jacks in but to get dirt packed in the seals off your clyinders?........I do not have that problem, and heavy equipment does have that problem that you described with no leaks or cylinder wipe downs. As always......what ever works for ya....
__________________
2000 Newmar MADP 4060, 350ISC, Spartan MM, IFS 2011 Jeep JK, M&G Braking, 2014 MTI 27' Hog Hauler, Wireless brake control, 2006Ultra & 1989 Springer
palehorse89 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2013, 05:33 PM   #19
Winnebago Master
 
"007"'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 629
HWH MANUALS for most coach's.

Found in QT's 1 & 2.
__________________
98KSCA, 99MACA, 03 KSCA-3740- 8.1 Chev-- ALLISON Trans, now in good hands
VISIT the NEWMAR QUICK TIPS & EASYMODS 1 & 2
QUICK TIPS # 3
RV SYSTEMS & APPLIANCES & RECALLS --- TECH INFORMATION
"007" is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2013, 07:52 AM   #20
Winnebago Master
 
jerichorick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Full-timer/volunteer w/SOWERS
Posts: 2,734
Quote:
Originally Posted by palehorse89 View Post
Hydraulic cylinders are all the same and yes equipment has pressure both ways and HWH jacks are pressure down and spring return, but as far as dirt "packed" into the wiper seal.........on a motorhome,,,,,,,, I am not sure where you use your RV and what conditions you use your jacks in but to get dirt packed in the seals off your clyinders?........I do not have that problem, and heavy equipment does have that problem that you described with no leaks or cylinder wipe downs. As always......what ever works for ya....
Palehorse89, I am not trying to argue with you. Life is just too short. I have been at full time RVing long, enough and talked with enough folks about jack problems, to know what is going on with RVs.

When it rains and the cylinders get damp. Dust and grit collect on them. Each time the jacks come up without pre cleaning the foreign materials on the rams gets pulled up into the recess under the seals. After a time this starts to add friction to the retracting cylinder and slows or stops it from retracting, overwhelming the spring force. One jack may be more sensitive or get more dirt quicker than the others in the set and have problems sooner.

This may be a poor design but it is what we have to live with. It is a way for RV manufactures to keep cost down and has been the industry standard for a very long time.

Please accept my explanation graciously. It is not easy to present the facts in a warm and fuzzy way on a keyboard and in a quick to the point manner.

Happy trails,
Rick
__________________
Rick & Melissa Young & Dawson (RIP), 2011 Meridian 40U, FL XCL, ISL 380HP/DEF, Al 3000 MH, 2014 Honda CR-V, SMI AF1, Blue Ox TruCenter & tow equip.,EEZTire TPMS.
Servants On Wheels Ever Ready. Best job we ever paid to do . (full time volunteers)
jerichorick is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
hwh, jacks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
HWH Jacks won't retract CaptainBC General Maintenance and Repair 6 07-17-2014 08:31 AM
slides and jacks will not retract, help asap asheville General Maintenance and Repair 17 10-21-2009 07:17 PM
Rear jacks don't retract all the way. sightseers General Maintenance and Repair 8 12-27-2008 10:58 AM
HWH Jacks Will Not Retract rg General Maintenance and Repair 16 10-10-2007 05:50 PM

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Winnebago Industries or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:08 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.