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Old 05-23-2016, 03:22 PM   #1
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HWH Hydraulic Levelling Not Dumping Air

Hi all! First post here - I just brought home this 2000 Horizon Saturday and beginning to explore its mysteries. First question - the HWH system doesn't dump the air from the suspension when you turn it on. As as result, the cylinders don't have enough travel to level the coach in my driveway(which is not that out of level).

Hoping this is an easy fix - just need to know what direction to start in.

Thanks!
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Old 05-23-2016, 04:53 PM   #2
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After some googling(sorry - should have searched first), the first order of business is locating the HWH control box. Any ideas where this would be hidden on a 2000 Horizon?
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Old 05-24-2016, 06:34 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by Papa Foxtrot View Post
After some googling(sorry - should have searched first), the first order of business is locating the HWH control box. Any ideas where this would be hidden on a 2000 Horizon?
On my 02 Journey it is under the dash attached to the firewall next to where the steering wheel post goes through the firewall.
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Old 05-24-2016, 11:14 AM   #4
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On my Journey it is under the entry way stairs. If I understand correctly are you attempting to dump your air with the engine running? How do you know the air bags aren't fully deflated?
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Old 05-24-2016, 01:10 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by charles tuit View Post
On my 02 Journey it is under the dash attached to the firewall next to where the steering wheel post goes through the firewall.
Thanks Charles - that's were it is on mine. Altho' it's not attached to anything.

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Originally Posted by MaverickBBD View Post
On my Journey it is under the entry way stairs. If I understand correctly are you attempting to dump your air with the engine running? How do you know the air bags aren't fully deflated?
I'm trying to use the jacks to level it on my driveway. The coach is running and I press the "On" button and nothing happens. Coach height doesn't change at all. My drive has about a one degree pitch and there isn't enough travel to level the coach.

I checked the Dump fuse and it's fine. I guess a call to HWH is in order.
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Old 05-24-2016, 02:51 PM   #6
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Ummmm.... maybe I'm not reading this correctly, but not sure you clearly understand your system.

First, if your Journey is similar to my Vectra, I'm thinking you have two separate issues. The air bags raise the coach body off the frame to give extra clearance and a smooth ride. The jacks extend from the frame down to the ground to stabilize the coach. As far as I know, the air bags do NOT change the distance of the frame to the ground. So the fact the air bags are not dumping doesn't affect the distance of the jacks to ground. (Wiser heads agree?)

Second, with the engine running your air bags will not "dump." I believe there is an interlock but in any case with the engine running the compressor is putting air into the system, so it's not logical. My manual (HW 325 system) says to have the key in the ACC position.

Third, you say you press the "On" button and expect the jacks to do something. Not sure what system you have, but on my 325 system you need to press the appropriate arrow button to actually move the jacks. Do you have 4 pair of up/down arrows? If so, it's a bit counter-intuitive... you press the arrow of the direction you want the coach body to move, NOT the jack. So to lower the jacks (and raise the coach body) you press the "up" arrows. Yeah, I know, but it's the way it's designed. If you have an auto-level system then you need to press that button.

Try it this way. Park, set the park brake, and turn the engine off. Then turn your key to "ACC" and turn on the HWH panel. Try hitting the "dump" button and see if your bags deflate. Try press/hold one of the "up" arrow keys and listen if the pump runs to lower the jacks.
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Old 05-24-2016, 03:51 PM   #7
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Ummmm.... maybe I'm not reading this correctly, but not sure you clearly understand your system.

First, if your Journey is similar to my Vectra, I'm thinking you have two separate issues. The air bags raise the coach body off the frame to give extra clearance and a smooth ride. The jacks extend from the frame down to the ground to stabilize the coach. As far as I know, the air bags do NOT change the distance of the frame to the ground. So the fact the air bags are not dumping doesn't affect the distance of the jacks to ground. (Wiser heads agree?)
I'm pretty sure that the air bags are between the frame and suspension and that the coach body is securely attached to the frame. In fact, my HWH manual warns that the coach will drop suddenly when the on button is pressed.

Quote:
Second, with the engine running your air bags will not "dump." I believe there is an interlock but in any case with the engine running the compressor is putting air into the system, so it's not logical. My manual (HW 325 system) says to have the key in the ACC position.
I've tried it with the ignition both in ACC and On. Same result. According to the manual, there are four normally closed solenoid valves - one each between the levelling valves and each of the four air bags. Doesn't matter if the compressor is running, the bags should deflate.

Quote:
Third, you say you press the "On" button and expect the jacks to do something. Not sure what system you have, but on my 325 system you need to press the appropriate arrow button to actually move the jacks. Do you have 4 pair of up/down arrows? If so, it's a bit counter-intuitive... you press the arrow of the direction you want the coach body to move, NOT the jack. So to lower the jacks (and raise the coach body) you press the "up" arrows. Yeah, I know, but it's the way it's designed. If you have an auto-level system then you need to press that button.
I do not have autolevel. I understand how the system works. I can raise the low side of the coach, just not enough to attain level. My system is s'posed to dump air when you press the "On" button. That's what I'm expecting.

Quote:
Try it this way. Park, set the park brake, and turn the engine off. Then turn your key to "ACC" and turn on the HWH panel. Try hitting the "dump" button and see if your bags deflate. Try press/hold one of the "up" arrow keys and listen if the pump runs to lower the jacks.
I don't have a dump button. The on button serves that purpose. I'm not trying to be argumentative, but I'm pretty sure that I understand how the system works. Before buying this coach, I looked at an '01 Journey with the same system and the owner demonstrated it to me. His coach dumped air when you turned the system on - just like I expect mine to.

Checked the dump fuse this afternoon and it's fine. Checking the dump solenoids tomorrow for mud dauber nests.
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Old 05-24-2016, 04:04 PM   #8
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Ok, certainly wasn't trying to be critical or offensive, just going on my system and offer some help. You have a different system than I have. Sorry.

HWH support is somewhat problematical as far as getting a response. Are you anywhere near Elkhart, IN? There is a great guy there who works on HWH systems who really knows his stuff... Stuart's Service.

One other thing you can try.. if you can get access to the back of the control panel (mine is held on with 4 screws) there is a wiring harness plug that sometimes works loose. You might give that a look-see if you can get to it.
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Old 05-24-2016, 04:15 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by emiddleb View Post
Ok, certainly wasn't trying to be critical or offensive, just going on my system and offer some help. You have a different system than I have. Sorry.

HWH support is somewhat problematical as far as getting a response. Are you anywhere near Elkhart, IN? There is a great guy there who works on HWH systems who really knows his stuff... Stuart's Service.

One other thing you can try.. if you can get access to the back of the control panel (mine is held on with 4 screws) there is a wiring harness plug that sometimes works loose. You might give that a look-see if you can get to it.
Thanks, but I'm actually closer to Gaffney. The coach is due for a trip there anyway, but I'm trying to clear as much of the punchlist as possible before then.
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Old 05-24-2016, 04:45 PM   #10
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If you go to the HWH website you will see that there are "regular service centers" ... and "Master Service Centers" ...

I can tell you from personal experience that the Master Service Centers are better at handling HWH problems. I spent a half a day and $500 at a regular service center ... they were unable to correctly analyze and correct the problem ... a Master Service Center found the problem.

Stuarts Service Center in Elkhart is very knowledgeable and willing to give you helpful suggestions over the phone.
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Old 05-24-2016, 05:13 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by skigramp View Post
If you go to the HWH website you will see that there are "regular service centers" ... and "Master Service Centers" ...

I can tell you from personal experience that the Master Service Centers are better at handling HWH problems. I spent a half a day and $500 at a regular service center ... they were unable to correctly analyze and correct the problem ... a Master Service Center found the problem.

Stuarts Service Center in Elkhart is very knowledgeable and willing to give you helpful suggestions over the phone.
x2 I found my Master Service Center in Medford, Or. Big help with slide out issue. When I was asking the owner about the difference I got an ahh shucks we just been to the class. I was impressed how they got right through to the techs at H.W.H.
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Old 05-24-2016, 07:10 PM   #12
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on my system on the signature coach I have too push the button twice for the system to begin operation.
You did not mention if you pressed it twice, if you did I missed it.
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Old 05-25-2016, 06:38 AM   #13
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on my system on the signature coach I have too push the button twice for the system to begin operation.
You did not mention if you pressed it twice, if you did I missed it.
Haven't tried that - I'll give it a shot today.

Thanks!
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Old 05-27-2016, 10:40 AM   #14
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dep is correct. you have either a 610 or a 623 system. the 610 system has a 6x8x3 control box, usually under the dash. the 625 has a larger box with a plexiglas front. either one will require the on button to be pushed twice. freightliner supplies the dump valve. it requires 12 volt power to activate it either open or closed.
the air bags dump and lowers the frame about 6 inches, which does place the jacks closer to the grounds. otherwise it would not make sense to dump the bags,
please feel free to call me at 602-549-3638. i can help.
i do work for hwh. i live in arizona, and we are on pacific time
i do not solicit part sales or service work on this forum
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