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Old 12-23-2004, 02:53 AM   #1
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OCTOBER 28, 2002

CONDIT FORD

I HAD MY MOTORHOME IN ON AUGUST 10TH 2004 FOR A QUOTE TO REPAIR THE BUBBLING AND PITTING ON THE DOOR AND PANEL BELOW THE DOOR. TIM AND ANOTHER MAN LOOKED IT OVER . THEY STATED IT MAY BE A
DEFECT WHEN THE PAINT WAS SHOT AT THE FACTORY. TIM PEELED A CHIP OF THE PAINT BELOW THE DOOR WITH HIS FINGER TO SEE WHY THE PANEL AND DOOR WERE PITTING AND BUBBLING. I TOLD HIM THIS WAS UNDER WARRANTY FROM WINNEBAGO AND THEY WOULD PAY FOR THE REPAIR. I WAS FAXED OVER A REPAIR COST WHICH I INTURN FAXED TO WINNEBAGO FOR AUTHORIZATION TO HAVE IT REPAIRED. THEY OK'D THE REPAIR THROUGH MY DEALER (CEDAR RIDGE ) AND WE SET UP AN APPT TO HAVE IT FIXED BY CONDIT FORD BODY SHOP.

I DROPPED OFF THE VEHICLE TO BE REPAIRED ON OCTOBER 18TH. AT WHICH TIME I WAS TOLD WOULD TAKE ABOUT 2-3 DAYS TO DO. I STOPPED IN EVERY DAY TO CHECK ON THE PROGRESS AND SEE IF THEY HAD FIGURED OUT WHY OR WHAT CAUSED THE PITTING. . TIM STATED THE BODY REPAIR GUY WORKING ON IT FOUND LITTLE BLACK SPECS UNDER THE PAINT, IT REMINDED HIM OF CARAWAY SEEDS. HE EVEN JOKED THAT MAYBE SOMEONE WAS EATING LUNCH WHEN THEY WERE PAINTING IT. HE ASSURED US THAT THEY WERE SANDING IT OUT AND HAD PRIMED IT AT LEAST 3 TIMES TO SMOOTH IT OUT. HE WAS GOING TO SHOOT THE PAINT ON WED. OR THURSDAY.

I PICKED THE VEHICLE UP ON FRIDAY OCTOBER 22. I HAD NOTICED UPON INSPECTION THAT THERE WERE STILL PITTS AND BUBBLES ON THE DOOR. I BROUGHT THIS TO TIM'S ATTENTION AND HE SAID NOT TO WORRY THAT WAS NORMAL. THE PAINT WAS "TOO SOFT" FOR THEM TO BUFF IT OUT AND SUGGESTED WE BRING IT BACK IN 2-3 WKS AND THEY WOULD BUFF OUT THE PITTS. THESE ARE NOT PAINT BUBBLES THAT CAN BE BUFFED OUT. THEY ARE THE SAME BUBBLING UNDER THE PAINT THAT WE ORIGINALLY BROUGHT THE MOTORHOME IN TO HAVE REPAIRED. THE SAME CONDITION WILL OCCUR AS TIME GOES ON. THE DOOR WILL START TO BLEED AND THE PAINT WILL START TO CHIP OFF. THIS REPAIR WAS NOT DONE PROPERLY AND THE PROBLEM HAS NOT BEEN REPAIRED OR CORRECTED.

I WAS INFORMED LATER THAT THE REPAIR WAS BILLED AT A HIGHER AMOUNT THEN THE ONE I WAS GIVEN ON 8/13/04 BY CONDUIT FORD AND HAD AUTHORIZED BY WINNEBAGO. THERE WAS NO ADDITIONAL WORK DONE ON THE MOTORHOME. THE WORK TO BE DONE WAS THE DOOR AND SMALL PANEL DIRECTLY BELOW THE DOOR WHERE TIM CHIPPED THE PIECE OF PAINT OFF FROM. THIS WAS WHAT THE QUOTE ON 8/13/04 WAS TO REPAIR.
THIS IS WHAT WAS REPAIRED. THE CHARGE SHOULD HAVE BEEN THE SAME. IF IT WAS GOING TO BE A DIFFERENT AMOUNT, CONDIT FORD KNEW IT HAD TO BE PRE APPROVED BY WINNEBAGO.

THIS REPAIR HAS NOT BEEN DONE CORRECTLY AND THE PROBLEM STILL EXISTS.

I DO NOT FEEL COMFORTABLE LEAVING MY MOTORHOME WITH CONDIT FORD AGAIN. I HAD NOTICED WHEN I WAS LEAVING SEVERAL OF MY INSIDE CABINETS FLEW OPEN. THESE ARE LOCKED IN PLACE SO THEY DO NOT MOVE DURING TRAVEL. THE ONLY WAY THEY WOULD FLY OPEN IS IF THEY WERE OPENED UP AND NOT RE-LOCKED AND SECURED PROPERLY. I DO NOT LIKE KNOWING THAT SOMEONE HAS VIOLATED MY PROPERTY AND WENT THROUGH MY CABINETS. THERE WOULD HAVE BEEN NO REASON FOR ANYONE TO ENTER MY MOTORHOME. THE REPAIR WAS ON THE DOOR. NOT INTERNAL. THE DOOR BEING OFF MY MOTORHOME FOR SEVERAL DAYS LEFT MY INSIDE VULNERABLE TO INTRUSION BY ANYONE.

PLEASE ADVISE ME ON HOW WE WILL RECTIFY THIS.

BILL JAMES
__________________________________________________ ______________________
Update-
Tim at Condit ford said he would send someone to look at the bad repair. I have not seen or heard from him except to tell me that our bill is way past due.

Update Dec-I had another auto body give me an estimate on the bad paint job from Ford.I am just not comfortable leaving the truck with Condit Ford after thier negligence with my coach.I feel Condit Ford of Newton, NJ should bear the cost to fix correctly. Winnebago refuses to pay the additional after the fact charge, I dont blame them. I have never seen a quote that grows in cost after the job is completed.We received the added bill 2 weeks after the work was completed Is this crooked?? How do you fight this?

I wrote in this forum about Condit Ford charging me for a warranty inspection on the rear end last year. I payed it hoping to have a good repair center close to home.

2002 Adventurer

cc: Cedar Ridge (Mark)
Winnebago Industries (Gary)
Mark L. Nichter Esq.

Thank you for this forum!!
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Old 12-23-2004, 02:53 AM   #2
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OCTOBER 28, 2002

CONDIT FORD

I HAD MY MOTORHOME IN ON AUGUST 10TH 2004 FOR A QUOTE TO REPAIR THE BUBBLING AND PITTING ON THE DOOR AND PANEL BELOW THE DOOR. TIM AND ANOTHER MAN LOOKED IT OVER . THEY STATED IT MAY BE A
DEFECT WHEN THE PAINT WAS SHOT AT THE FACTORY. TIM PEELED A CHIP OF THE PAINT BELOW THE DOOR WITH HIS FINGER TO SEE WHY THE PANEL AND DOOR WERE PITTING AND BUBBLING. I TOLD HIM THIS WAS UNDER WARRANTY FROM WINNEBAGO AND THEY WOULD PAY FOR THE REPAIR. I WAS FAXED OVER A REPAIR COST WHICH I INTURN FAXED TO WINNEBAGO FOR AUTHORIZATION TO HAVE IT REPAIRED. THEY OK'D THE REPAIR THROUGH MY DEALER (CEDAR RIDGE ) AND WE SET UP AN APPT TO HAVE IT FIXED BY CONDIT FORD BODY SHOP.

I DROPPED OFF THE VEHICLE TO BE REPAIRED ON OCTOBER 18TH. AT WHICH TIME I WAS TOLD WOULD TAKE ABOUT 2-3 DAYS TO DO. I STOPPED IN EVERY DAY TO CHECK ON THE PROGRESS AND SEE IF THEY HAD FIGURED OUT WHY OR WHAT CAUSED THE PITTING. . TIM STATED THE BODY REPAIR GUY WORKING ON IT FOUND LITTLE BLACK SPECS UNDER THE PAINT, IT REMINDED HIM OF CARAWAY SEEDS. HE EVEN JOKED THAT MAYBE SOMEONE WAS EATING LUNCH WHEN THEY WERE PAINTING IT. HE ASSURED US THAT THEY WERE SANDING IT OUT AND HAD PRIMED IT AT LEAST 3 TIMES TO SMOOTH IT OUT. HE WAS GOING TO SHOOT THE PAINT ON WED. OR THURSDAY.

I PICKED THE VEHICLE UP ON FRIDAY OCTOBER 22. I HAD NOTICED UPON INSPECTION THAT THERE WERE STILL PITTS AND BUBBLES ON THE DOOR. I BROUGHT THIS TO TIM'S ATTENTION AND HE SAID NOT TO WORRY THAT WAS NORMAL. THE PAINT WAS "TOO SOFT" FOR THEM TO BUFF IT OUT AND SUGGESTED WE BRING IT BACK IN 2-3 WKS AND THEY WOULD BUFF OUT THE PITTS. THESE ARE NOT PAINT BUBBLES THAT CAN BE BUFFED OUT. THEY ARE THE SAME BUBBLING UNDER THE PAINT THAT WE ORIGINALLY BROUGHT THE MOTORHOME IN TO HAVE REPAIRED. THE SAME CONDITION WILL OCCUR AS TIME GOES ON. THE DOOR WILL START TO BLEED AND THE PAINT WILL START TO CHIP OFF. THIS REPAIR WAS NOT DONE PROPERLY AND THE PROBLEM HAS NOT BEEN REPAIRED OR CORRECTED.

I WAS INFORMED LATER THAT THE REPAIR WAS BILLED AT A HIGHER AMOUNT THEN THE ONE I WAS GIVEN ON 8/13/04 BY CONDUIT FORD AND HAD AUTHORIZED BY WINNEBAGO. THERE WAS NO ADDITIONAL WORK DONE ON THE MOTORHOME. THE WORK TO BE DONE WAS THE DOOR AND SMALL PANEL DIRECTLY BELOW THE DOOR WHERE TIM CHIPPED THE PIECE OF PAINT OFF FROM. THIS WAS WHAT THE QUOTE ON 8/13/04 WAS TO REPAIR.
THIS IS WHAT WAS REPAIRED. THE CHARGE SHOULD HAVE BEEN THE SAME. IF IT WAS GOING TO BE A DIFFERENT AMOUNT, CONDIT FORD KNEW IT HAD TO BE PRE APPROVED BY WINNEBAGO.

THIS REPAIR HAS NOT BEEN DONE CORRECTLY AND THE PROBLEM STILL EXISTS.

I DO NOT FEEL COMFORTABLE LEAVING MY MOTORHOME WITH CONDIT FORD AGAIN. I HAD NOTICED WHEN I WAS LEAVING SEVERAL OF MY INSIDE CABINETS FLEW OPEN. THESE ARE LOCKED IN PLACE SO THEY DO NOT MOVE DURING TRAVEL. THE ONLY WAY THEY WOULD FLY OPEN IS IF THEY WERE OPENED UP AND NOT RE-LOCKED AND SECURED PROPERLY. I DO NOT LIKE KNOWING THAT SOMEONE HAS VIOLATED MY PROPERTY AND WENT THROUGH MY CABINETS. THERE WOULD HAVE BEEN NO REASON FOR ANYONE TO ENTER MY MOTORHOME. THE REPAIR WAS ON THE DOOR. NOT INTERNAL. THE DOOR BEING OFF MY MOTORHOME FOR SEVERAL DAYS LEFT MY INSIDE VULNERABLE TO INTRUSION BY ANYONE.

PLEASE ADVISE ME ON HOW WE WILL RECTIFY THIS.

BILL JAMES
__________________________________________________ ______________________
Update-
Tim at Condit ford said he would send someone to look at the bad repair. I have not seen or heard from him except to tell me that our bill is way past due.

Update Dec-I had another auto body give me an estimate on the bad paint job from Ford.I am just not comfortable leaving the truck with Condit Ford after thier negligence with my coach.I feel Condit Ford of Newton, NJ should bear the cost to fix correctly. Winnebago refuses to pay the additional after the fact charge, I dont blame them. I have never seen a quote that grows in cost after the job is completed.We received the added bill 2 weeks after the work was completed Is this crooked?? How do you fight this?

I wrote in this forum about Condit Ford charging me for a warranty inspection on the rear end last year. I payed it hoping to have a good repair center close to home.

2002 Adventurer

cc: Cedar Ridge (Mark)
Winnebago Industries (Gary)
Mark L. Nichter Esq.

Thank you for this forum!!
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Old 12-23-2004, 04:00 AM   #3
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We've always had great service from our Ford Dealer in Mishawaka,IN Jordan Ford and we have a few Fords. It's not reasonable to expect, that there are some undesireable dealers out there that don't conduct themselves in the proper manner. Your episode is well noted here, just type in lower case next time, it took a lot of space, I could feel your feelings as the heat came of my monitor.

You have ever right to voice your concern and displeasure, now you need to write Ford and send a copy to Winnebago so they have the problem and your displeasure documented.

You could also file a complaint with your local Better Business Bureau.

Tomcat F15
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Old 12-23-2004, 04:11 AM   #4
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Thanks Tomcat!

Yes, the letter I sent to Condit Ford was a little heated. Sorry for the caps, its a copy and paste thing.

Thanks for lending some advice.I will pursue and keep you posted.

Happy Holidays!
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Old 12-23-2004, 06:45 AM   #5
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BJ,

What is that piece of equipment in your signature. Some sort of hydraulic pump with a tank?

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Old 12-23-2004, 08:31 AM   #6
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Tomcat,

We build water treatment equipment.
http://www.reopure.com

Best Regards,

Bill James
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Old 12-23-2004, 08:53 AM   #7
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Is that what that is. I thought it might have been some kind of hi-tech still !!!
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Old 12-23-2004, 12:29 PM   #8
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We had an '01 Adventurer from Cedar Ridge. Mark was not the service manager then; so I won't comment on their service. We had the famous handgrenade clamps on the V-10. The RV was towed to Condit and damaged by the tow truck driver (not Condit's).
We had to wait a week for parts (radiator etc) to come from Detroit, but when the part arrived damaged they got another one the next day!!! Other than the new damage they were to replace all the faulty camps.
Condit only replaced the failed clamp. They either did not remember or bother to tighten the sway bar. I discovered this in the Mojave desert and that only half of the top radiator clamps was holding the hose on after a 10K trip. They then, replaced all the other clamps.
They were very nice each time but I would never go back to them.
We bought our Suncruiser from Flagg RV in MA because they sold it to us for $ 8K less the Cedar Ridge. The Suncruiser cost about $ 2K more than the Adventure with the same options ;we were customers at Cedar Ridge and they know I want a DP in the next year or two.
We are quite pleased with Flagg for the sale and the service.
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Old 12-23-2004, 05:31 PM   #9
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Something else about paint on the 02 Adventurer, is that body shops do not know that paint is a semigloss finish. I had a scrap and they applied Imron paint and it came out very glossy and the rest of paint is semigloss. I bought paint myself and looking at the Winne specs I found a dulling agent that is required in the paint to bring it to the same finish as the original. I always wondered why the lower portion of the paint didn't have a high gloss to it and found out why. Sound like your pitting and bubbling issues could be a result of silicone contamination before painting causing fisheye effect. Hate to here about your problems. Good luck and Merry Christmas!!!
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Old 12-24-2004, 07:53 AM   #10
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Cousin Ed,

Rich was the service manager before Mark.

We had a small problem with Cedar Ridge service at the time when Rich retired. Rich had ordered a replacement driver side double pane window that was defective in the seal.We called and called about the part and after Rich was gone Mark found the part that Winnebago had shipped months before.Mark approached me while the unit was being repaired and said it was out of warranty. I told him that was impossible and a scene commenced with the owner coming out to try to get me to pay $100.00 for the warranty work,I said "no way".The Winnebago rep was listening to the owner tell me that it was out of warranty and concurred. My wife called Winnebago and found out that the part was ordered and shipped to Cedar Ridge months before and was definetly under warranty.(I was never notified that the window had come in, it just sat there and was buried all these months). Since nothing was ever put in writing from Cedar Ridge, Mark had no knowledge of this problem. Good thing Winnebago keeps good records!

I had met a friend there to show him a good place to purchase his trailer at the same time as the window incident. Cedar Ridge has a good and knowledgable sales staff and I had passed their name on before.The above adventure in warranty repair turned my friend off.Not too bright since I told Cedar Ridge a friend was interested in their products.

I must also say that the problems we have had with our 2002 Adventurer are minor compared to what I have read about Tomcat in this forum. I have been very happy with the unit for the last 35,000 miles. The equipment and systems have performed very well. Had a minor hydraulic hose problem and HWH was good with warranty repairs.We are not thinking of trading or selling a well broken in unit with no problems at this time, although the Vectra has me looking.

Thanks to all and a very Merry Christmas!

Bill
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Old 12-24-2004, 08:46 AM   #11
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We have friends who have the same problem with the surface of their door bubbling up. They were told it was due to the house batteries gassing while charging which might make sense as their batteries are built into the entrance to their motorhome. If that is the case I would guess that repainting is a temporary fix and it will bubble up again. They chose to just leave it as is, thinking no sense fixing it if it's just going to do it again.
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Old 12-24-2004, 12:32 PM   #12
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I had a similar problem when a Winnebago dealer billed me for several hundred more than they accepted a paint repair job for. Since it was warranty work, and had been negotiated and cleared ahead of time, I wrote a letter to Winnebago Owner Relations with a copy to the dealer. After several telephone calls, Winnebago resolved the problem at no cost to me.
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Old 12-28-2004, 12:15 PM   #13
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Billjam - Just wanted to let you know that Rich Marinelli is alive and well. He is service manager at Pocono RV in Wind Gap, PA. 610-863-5239. He has been a great asset to them and also to me with my Winneb. Journey. His assistant is with him also. They have a wealth of knowledge on Winnebago and other rvs.
I just spoke to him and he remembers you. Said you were a nice guy and should never have been treated that way. They had papers on your window before he left.
Now, if I could just get Pocono RV to become a Winnebago dealer.......
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Old 12-31-2004, 11:46 AM   #14
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Bill,
I can really feel your anguish and frustration. Condit ford is the pits. I lived in NJ all my life til 3 years ago when I moved to NC. I bought my 96 Minnie Winne from Cedar Ridge and had no problems with them but Condit Ford is a ripoff. I had body delam on my coach while in warranty and Cedar Ridge wanted to have it repaired at a body shop as they don't do body work,and I said no way. The Rep came out and we took it to Tom Schaffer Rv in Pa. They have a body shop and are a Winnebago dealer. They did a superb job and I recommend them highly. The only problem was that Winnebago wouldn't reimburse me for the fuel to drive out and later to drive out and pick it up and drive home. I have high regards for Rich who used to work with Cedar Ridge plus the owner Joe . If you have any troubles I would see him. I have another solution and that would be to make an appointment in Forest City and let Winnebago fix it themselves. You can stay in the coach at night in their campground for free and they were very nice to me. I just bought an 04 Adventurer 34' from Lichtsinn motors in Forest City (only had 25 miles on it) and they are a super dealer too. Good Luck and Happy New Year, Tom
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